Bledisloe # 3 - Saturday 31st October, ANZ Stadium

[Viking]

I also like losing lineouts.

Fellas, it is going to be wet this week in Sydney and a thunderstorm might hit around game time based on the forecast, so I'll take whatever gives us best ball security and a repeat of the Wellington kicking game.

You're probably right. But how does someone with such good ball skills be so poor at line-out jumping in Wilson? Surely he is a work in progress in that regard, I'd back him to become a solid jumping option.

Naisrani is a decent enough option isnt he?

Why aren't these guys taught to jump? Pisses me off.

 

[Viking]

Are you talking about his foot injury? He got cleared to play the last Bledisloe, so I can’t see it would be a reason not to play this one. I can’t see him being rested yet personally and I think Ned will be retained at 6.

I expect the backrow to stay the same. Maybe Naisa would take a bench spot. He would be a solid impact player in the last 20mins. Although I'd still prefer Samu.

 

[wamberal]

I expect the backrow to stay the same. Maybe Naisa would take a bench spot. He would be a solid impact player in the last 20mins. Although I'd still prefer Samu.

If he is selected, he will will have a lot to prove. Presumably he will only be selected if has shed a few kgs, I reckon he could do okay.

 

[KOB1987]

Are you talking about his foot injury? He got cleared to play the last Bledisloe, so I can’t see it would be a reason not to play this one. I can’t see him being rested yet personally and I think Ned will be retained at 6.

I didn’t read the in depth reports admittedly, however my take on it was that the gastro was just cover for the real issue, which was his foot and that he was on a drip in hospital. Then he got hooked early despite being one of our best players. I just don’t think Naisarani is being recalled to play v Argentina and for whatever reason DR didn’t seem to like Samu’s game in Wellington.

 

[KOB1987]

Why can’t he jump? Or do you just mean he’s not very good?

I got the sense Harry’s injury was very temporary. I’d love to see 6. Wilson and 8. Naisarani but if Harry is struggling Ned may not be so bad.

Yeah that he’s only a 0.5 jumper in the lineout equation

 

[Tomikin]

Conner Macnerrny been added to the squard

 

[TSR]

I didn’t read the in depth reports admittedly, however my take on it was that the gastro was just cover for the real issue, which was his foot and that he was on a drip in hospital. Then he got hooked early despite being one of our best players. I just don’t think Naisarani is being recalled to play v Argentina and for whatever reason DR didn’t seem to like Samu’s game in Wellington.

He got a cut on his foot while got infected and his foot swelled up.

They pumped him with anitibiotics and he was fine by game day.

Nothing I’ve read suggests it is an ongoing issue. In fact, the opposite.

 

[Up the Guts]

I don’t think Hanigan actually won a lineout last week. Or is his presence as a jumper enough to win us lineouts?

 

[TSR]

Well our lineout was better. How much was him, I don’t know.

Generally speaking I thought he was okay though.

But then I didn’t think they should change the team from the previous week, so what would I know.

 

[dru]

Well our lineout was better. How much was him, I don’t know.

Generally speaking I thought he was okay though.

But then I didn’t think they should change the team from the previous week, so what would I know.

He-he. In Rennie we trust, let’s see what he does this time.

 

[TSR]

I’m a big fan of Rennie. Have been for a long time. I am also a big fan of all the emerging talent we have and, whatever people’s thoughts are on Cheika, McKenzie & Deans it is highly likely IMO, that Rennie will have better talent and depth to choose from. I also think he has one of the best support groups that has been around the Wallabies for a long time.

But he will still have to deal with a lot of legacy issues from 2 decades of neglect of our pathways systems as well as having a lot of the normal issues associated with implementing new systems.

I will go into each and every game with expectation & optimism - even if it is sometimes unrealistic - but I think most fans realise we need to set our expectations at a realistic level of a little while yet.

Dru: that wasn’t really the point you were making, I know, but I am happy to back Rennie’s selection judgment, for now at least.

 

[Braveheart81]

You're probably right. But how does someone with such good ball skills be so poor at line-out jumping in Wilson? Surely he is a work in progress in that regard, I'd back him to become a solid jumping option.

Naisrani is a decent enough option isnt he?

Why aren't these guys taught to jump? Pisses me off.

Because for both Wilson and Naisarani, they spend the majority of lineouts not actually in the lineout as the crash ball option. They're only going to participate in full lineouts and both of them are going to be the fourth lineout in most of the teams they play in.

Not a whole lot of time is ever going to be spent on them catching lineouts.

 

[dru]

Dru: that wasn’t really the point you were making, I know, but I am happy to back Rennie’s selection judgment, for now at least.

Your thoughts were 100% on point. It may change in time, but right now I’m happy to give the coaching team as much rope as they want with room to spare.

Personally I’m confused with the Banks persistence where he demonstrably has failed “kick-return 101”; don’t understand the absence of Stewart in the squad - palpably the most similar game and skillset to To'omua; and hate the silly buggery line outs where we need stability.

But it doesn’t matter - this coaching team know what they are doing and I’m completely comfortable to acknowledge I have it wrong where we differ.

Looking forward to the next team announcement.

 

[dru]

Because for both Wilson and Naisarani, they spend the majority of lineouts not actually in the lineout as the crash ball option. They're only going to participate in full lineouts and both of them are going to be the fourth lineout in most of the teams they play in.

Not a whole lot of time is ever going to be spent on them catching lineouts.

Wilson is frequently the target at the Reds. Granted that WB poor line out performance has resulted in a focus on shorter versions.

 

[Braveheart81]

Wilson is frequently the target at the Reds. Granted that WB poor line out performance has resulted in a focus on shorter versions.

I'm not sure where I can get lineout wins for all players but surely in Super Rugby AU he was at best the fourth most targeted player for the Reds in what was the worst lineout of the 5 teams.

Is that frequently targeted? The Reds clearly threw the majority of their throws to LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) and Wright.

 

[TSR]

I'm not sure where I can get lineout wins for all players but surely in Super Rugby AU he was at best the fourth most targeted player for the Reds in what was the worst lineout of the 5 teams.

Is that frequently targeted? The Reds clearly threw the majority of their throws to LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) and Wright.

Yeah - but he was used and was okay. He has good hands. He is unlikely to ever become a primary target, but he is a sound 4th option. I doubt many 4th options feature high in the ‘line outs won’ stats.

Most of the Reds problems stemmed from the throwing missing target and I found it interesting that BPA mentioned that the Wallaby system is more straight forward then the Reds.

My reflection on that was maybe with the Reds it wasn’t so much a problem of not working on the lineout, but trying too hard.

 

[Joe Blow]

Naisaranis Super Rugby form this year has been punctuated with inaccurate play and poor ball security. Maybe it was a lack of fitness, but who knows? Where he will fit and who in the current back row stocks he will be more accurate than is anyone’s guess. He is certainly a more robust ball carrier than Samu and Hanigan, but they both possess different attributes at the break down that we do not see from Naisarani.
It could be that Samu is now not seen as a starting 8 and Naisarani becomes the back up?
Wilson has been close to the best for us over the past 2 tests.
I reckon Horton is a touch light for what Rennie is looking for at 2.

 

[Derpus]

I’m a big fan of Rennie. Have been for a long time. I am also a big fan of all the emerging talent we have and, whatever people’s thoughts are on Cheika, McKenzie & Deans it is highly likely IMO, that Rennie will have better talent and depth to choose from. I also think he has one of the best support groups that has been around the Wallabies for a long time.

Deans had the best talent to choose from, aside from the front row. Easily. We were consistently number 2 in the world around that time and could not quite clinch number 1 because the ABs were in their peak Carter McCaw era.

We have lots of promising young talent coming through now but it's been a barren few years and that's probably making the new crop look a little better than they might be.

 

[Braveheart81]

This is going to be the issue of reverting back to a backrow where we are essentially picking two ball carrying number 8s. We end up with our third jumper being a guy who was probably fourth choice for their Super Rugby team. That's not to say they aren't up to the task but it's definitely a hindrance and with a shaky lineout to begin with I can see why Rennie steered away from it after the first test.

Seems pretty likely we'll get a bunch of changes in the 23 again and I said after the first test that I thought the backrow had done enough to be retained and I think the same thing again from the second test but who knows?

 

[Braveheart81]

Deans had the best talent to choose from, aside from the front row. Easily. We were consistently number 2 in the world around that time and could not quite clinch number 1 because the ABs were in their peak Carter McCaw era.

We have lots of promising young talent coming through now but it's been a barren few years and that's probably making the new crop look a little better than they might be.

I think the big change from Deans to now is the improvement in the Northern Hemisphere teams. All four of the home nations are significantly better than they were for most of Deans' tenure.

Talent wise it's hard to compare. Deans had more talent relative to our competitors but I'm not sure he had more talent to choose from relative to Cheika and now Rennie.