Wallabies 2021

[Derpus]

It is not provincial bias, I have often stated that I do not support bringing back players to be Wallabies and that I also do not support the sabbaticals overseas with an automatic return to the Wallabies.

I believe he will be in team, but wonder if he should just waltz back in, especially as captain.

If you want future Wallabies teams to be made up of players who don't play Super Rugby AU and just play in Japan while under a Wallabies contract then good for you, I actually like to see players for my national team every week on TV so I can see who is actually the best option and want to support them for supporting the competition that I support. I don't care which team you play for, I just appreciate that they play here.

I dont want that. I live in reality though, where our best players can earn double playing 1/4 intensity.

Do you want to be 7th forever because you are too obstinate to select a player who has ducked out to top up his bank account after 10 years of hard service? Pfft.

 

[Adam84]

To be fair Rennie has said similar comments about using the Wallaby jersey as an incentive to retain players and rewards those who stay, that’s why he didn’t exercise the ability to use the Giteau clause in 2020. But also lack of oversight on those players who are overseas, and standard of competition makes it harder to assess and track them.

I wouldn’t be entirely surprised to see Rennie pick other players ahead of Hooper based on that. Especially if the current crop of backrowers continue to perform.

 

[wamberal]

I wouldn’t be entirely surprised to see Rennie pick other players ahead of Hooper based on that. Especially if the current crop of backrowers continue to perform.

There are risks either way. But I would far prefer to see the coach err on the side of giving domestic players a good go. By the time Hooper comes back, somebody else might have cemented their hold on the 7 jersey.

 

[Braveheart81]

It would be pretty rough if the quid pro quo used to both save Rugby Australia money and allow the lesser paid players to be paid more was then used against Hooper in relation to the Wallabies.

It would also seem strange for Rennie's opinion of Hooper to have dropped after last year. He stated that he thought he was an obvious choice to be captain, picked up at 7 in every test and his teammates voted him the best player last year.

 

[Tomikin]

It would be pretty rough if the quid pro quo used to both save Rugby Australia money and allow the lesser paid players to be paid more was then used against Hooper in relation to the Wallabies.

It would also seem strange for Rennie's opinion of Hooper to have dropped after last year. He stated that he thought he was an obvious choice to be captain, picked up at 7 in every test and his teammates voted him the best player last year.

Its dumb the rational to be honest, McReight's been good against other Aussies but I would say never as dominate as Hooper has been, against better players (Tests, Kiwi Teams). Hooper will be Captain and first picked at 7, he did the ARU a favorite and to be dropped for that just wont happen.

 

[liquor box]

I dont want that. I live in reality though, where our best players can earn double playing 1/4 intensity.

Do you want to be 7th forever because you are too obstinate to select a player who has ducked out to top up his bank account after 10 years of hard service? Pfft.

I have no issue with topping up bank accounts, I am possibly the only Reds fan who had no issue with what Rodda, Hockings and Lucas did, they have a limited earning capacity due the nature of their profession and need to look after their future.

But there has to be consequences for choosing where to play, if you don't play in Australia, then I dont think you should play for Australia.

I dont care about being ranked 7th, I would be just as passionate about the game if we were ranked 30th or 1st.

 

[Braveheart81]

I have no issue with topping up bank accounts, I am possibly the only Reds fan who had no issue with what Rodda, Hockings and Lucas did, they have a limited earning capacity due the nature of their profession and need to look after their future.

But there has to be consequences for choosing where to play, if you don't play in Australia, then I dont think you should play for Australia.

You genuinely think these are similar situations?

 

[Adam84]

It would be pretty rough if the quid pro quo used to both save Rugby Australia money and allow the lesser paid players to be paid more was then used against Hooper in relation to the Wallabies..

That’s a nice way of saying he went overseas for more money.
It was certainly he entitlement to do so and had earned the right, but let’s not pretend he was simply making a sacrifice on behalf of the game to go there, he had a lot to gain also.

I just think Rennie will want to be seen rewarding those who have remained.

 

[hammertimethere]

I have no issue with topping up bank accounts, I am possibly the only Reds fan who had no issue with what Rodda, Hockings and Lucas did, they have a limited earning capacity due the nature of their profession and need to look after their future.

But there has to be consequences for choosing where to play, if you don't play in Australia, then I dont think you should play for Australia.

I dont care about being ranked 7th, I would be just as passionate about the game if we were ranked 30th or 1st.

I envy the reality you live in. I would be passionate about the game if we were 30th in the world, but it would break my heart to see the rest of Australia tune out of our great game because we didn't find the right balance to produce high performance outcomes.

P.S I agree with you that open doors policy would not be ideal for us because we don't have the player base of South Africa.

That said, to keep our game sustainable I would hope we could embrace being creative with contracting and strengthen our ties to Japan in preference to Europe. I was hoping that the new Super Rugby and Test season design would deliberately try to minimise the crossover with the Japanese season to allow us to purposely use Japanese sabbaticals to our long term advantage.

 

[Derpus]

It's not an open doors policy, though, is it? Because we aren't selecting uncapped players from the French second division. We would be selecting the incumbent captain and a 100 test Wallaby.

I get your concern in that we don't want the domestic game weakened because players can leave without doing any time and still be eligible for the Wallabies. This isn't that.

Short stints overseas for one season should be seen as a method of keeping our best players around. The alternative is we lose him entirely, which is not a better outcome.

 

[formerflanker]

I just think Rennie will want to be seen rewarding those who have remained.

Rennie will pick a winning team, irrespective of where they play.

 

[Braveheart81]

That’s a nice way of saying he went overseas for more money.
It was certainly he entitlement to do so and had earned the right, but let’s not pretend he was simply making a sacrifice on behalf of the game to go there, he had a lot to gain also.

I just think Rennie will want to be seen rewarding those who have remained.

Of course he did but likewise he agreed to a massive reduction last year then relieved Rugby Australia and the Waratahs of a significant amount of 2021 expenditure because they didn't need to pay him for 6 months.

Rugby Australia using sabbaticals to save 6 months salary for their highest paid players, have them miss Super Rugby but be available for all the tests is a valuable contracting tool. If the player going on the sabbatical left as a starting Wallaby it would seem to not be in Rugby Australia's interests if the move became detrimental to their test careers.

It seems like the general feeling in this thread is more positive towards Matt Philip being straight into the side this year than Hooper which is funny given one actually left (but was expected to re-sign afterwards) versus the other player having it included in his RA contract.

 

[Adam84]

Rennie will pick a winning team, irrespective of where they play.

Dave Rennie doesn’t agree though, he didn’t exercise the Giteau Clause in 2020 and has again expressed this year he is unlikely to use it, for the purpose of rewarding those players who remain in Australia.

 

[Braveheart81]

Assuming Philip, Rodda and Hanigan re-sign in Australia selecting them won't involve using the Giteau clause. Selecting Hooper won't involve it either because he is already contracted here.

 

[Adam84]

Of course he did but likewise he agreed to a massive reduction last year then relieved Rugby Australia and the Waratahs of a significant amount of 2021 expenditure because they didn't need to pay him for 6 months.

Rugby Australia using sabbaticals to save 6 months salary for their highest paid players, have them miss Super Rugby but be available for all the tests is a valuable contracting tool. If the player going on the sabbatical left as a starting Wallaby it would seem to not be in Rugby Australia's interests if the move became detrimental to their test careers.

It seems like the general feeling in this thread is more positive towards Matt Philip being straight into the side this year than Hooper which is funny given one actually left (but was expected to re-sign afterwards) versus the other player having it included in his RA contract.

He made a sacrifice which was equal as a percent of his pay to all the other Australian players, and was offered the opportunity to offset that loss overseas. All players made massive sacrifices last year, and those not in the Wallabies squad during the TRC made even greater sacrifices as their pay wasn’t reinstated in full until 2021.

No i think Phillip should earn his way back into team also, and i said the same about Nic White last year.

I dont have an issue with sabbaticals, that’s a seperate issue at this time, my comment is that players who go overseas shouldn’t just walk back into the Wallabies starting XV. I think players who have remained in Australia should be recognised for ignoring the greater overseas pay on offer.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

So Rennie selected his virtual RWC 2023 side - might have to háve some fun guessing what that might look like

 

[Derpus]

^^^^
As a secondary consideration at best. Nic White walked back in because he's significantly better than the next best guy.

It's test match rugby. Pick your best possible team.

 

[Adam84]

Assuming Philip, Rodda and Hanigan re-sign in Australia selecting them won't involve using the Giteau clause. Selecting Hooper won't involve it either because he is already contracted here.

Yep, all quality players and it will be good to have them in the wider squad. They can earn their way back into the starting role.

 

[Adam84]

^^^^
As a secondary consideration at best. Nic White walked back in because he's significantly better than the next best guy.

It's test match rugby. Pick your best possible team.

Nic White also played the second half of Super Rugby AU and demonstrated his class

 

[Braveheart81]

He made a sacrifice which was equal as a percent of his pay to all the other Australian players, and was offered the opportunity to offset that loss overseas. All players made massive sacrifices last year, and those not in the Wallabies squad during the TRC made even greater sacrifices as their pay wasn’t reinstated in full until 2021.

Australian rugby's top earners have volunteered to take pay cuts of more than 65 per cent to protect their lower-paid teammates while the game rides out the coronavirus shutdown.
As World Rugby's coronavirus working group prepared to finalise a loan facility worth between $100 million and $200m for the game's tier-one unions, senior Wallabies Michael Hooper, Matt To'omua and Dane Haylett-Petty spearheaded the push for the country's highest-paid players to shoulder the lion's share of cuts.
Should the plan receive the support of the players, it means Hooper, Kurtley Beale, Taniela Tupou, Izack Rodda, Allan Ala'alatoa, Marika Koroibete, To'omua and Haylett-Petty will approve a pay deal that will hit them hardest.