Tour of India
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jermano
Ted Fahey (11)
I know this is of the tour of India topic. BUT
Watson could become the Chris Gayle of Australia. Play as a T20 Mercenary in various comps around the world, make bulk dough and spend more time with the family. Sounds like the life and to quote him "There are more important things in life"
Back on topic... We be fucked.
Watson could become the Chris Gayle of Australia. Play as a T20 Mercenary in various comps around the world, make bulk dough and spend more time with the family. Sounds like the life and to quote him "There are more important things in life"
Back on topic... We be fucked.
At least Chris Gayle had a decent test career before he did this.
Dan54
Tim Horan (67)
I'm absolutely gobsmacked that Watson has walked out on tour because he has been dropped, and everyone is blaming the coach or captain??? Looks like the act of a spoilt schoolboy to me, 3 others were also stood down and they haven't thrown their little hiisy fit and gone home!!! I don't even know what the essay/note is meant to be, but I understood he had asked/told all players to write down how they thought team could improve. Is that so bad??I know it's up ro coach to set tactics, but wouldn't you like to think the players thought about at least what they could do better?? Or maybe you think the players should just go through whatever motion the coach captain has told them.
No4918
John Hipwell (52)
Pattinson obviously wants to keep playing test cricket and said he was wrong and selfish. Not sure i agree with his claim that former test greats don't understand the culture they are trying to create. These guys are all pretenders in comparison to some of those critics and i am sure understand team culture, Border in particular held the team together through the 80's.
It's just cricket Mickey, it does not seem like much to ask but is it really necessary to treat the players like that. I'd felt like i was being treated like a child if asked to write such a piece. They are playing for there country and it's my belief everyone of them is giving 100%. If he wants to bring them together he should buy a couple of slabs and invite them all to his room but that behaviour is probably not deemed acceptable anymore.
Listening to the radio today everyone is taking the absolute piss out of it - Triple J to 612 ABC.
It's just cricket Mickey, it does not seem like much to ask but is it really necessary to treat the players like that. I'd felt like i was being treated like a child if asked to write such a piece. They are playing for there country and it's my belief everyone of them is giving 100%. If he wants to bring them together he should buy a couple of slabs and invite them all to his room but that behaviour is probably not deemed acceptable anymore.
Listening to the radio today everyone is taking the absolute piss out of it - Triple J to 612 ABC.
One article today made a good point. It is difficult for teams to bond now days in the same way they used to.
It's not like life on tour is spent in the pub every night and leaving early was seen as not being a team man.
Getting people to bond and 'buy in' to the culture is a lot more difficult than it was in the past. Standing players down for not submitting the three points thing is definitely not a reaction just to this incident.
The fact that Watson has walked out after the decision is also probably a sign of the problems that have developed within the team. The sense of entitlement is incredible and needs to change.
It's not like life on tour is spent in the pub every night and leaving early was seen as not being a team man.
Getting people to bond and 'buy in' to the culture is a lot more difficult than it was in the past. Standing players down for not submitting the three points thing is definitely not a reaction just to this incident.
The fact that Watson has walked out after the decision is also probably a sign of the problems that have developed within the team. The sense of entitlement is incredible and needs to change.
jermano
Ted Fahey (11)
This is obviously bigger than reported, but my issue is the combat between coach, players and admin does not work. This has been on the card for awhile at the peril of the fans.
Simple question, Who is enjoying the cricket at the moment?
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Simple question, Who is enjoying the cricket at the moment?
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I like to watch
David Codey (61)
About a billion Indians.
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
Dan54, I see It as Arthur and Clarke's job to avoid exactly situations like this arising. Ending up in a position where 25% of the touring squad is stood down for a test mid tour is a diabolical failure. If Watson is the problem, then deal with him and harshly if need be. But there are many ways this could have been dealt with behind the scenes without this childish homework. They could always have just confronted him and dropped him for the third test. The excuses today from Arthur, Clarke and Howard all point to them failing to manage this over a long period.
As for Watson coming home, his wife is heavily pregnant and he was coming home after the 3rd test for the birth anyway. Given he isn't playing, why not come home in case the baby comes early.
There is clearly a massive issue between Watson and Clarke though. Im not sure watson is essential to our test futurre but The number of senior aus cricket players that Clarke has fallen out with will soon be a whole cricket team. That's a problem the ACB needs to address.
This will go down as one of our worst tours ever, terrible selections both initially and for each test, playing players when injured, a dysfunctional squad and poor form by most of the players. The situation with Watson and the three others is the trees, the disaster that is the tour as a whole is the woods that should be firmly in everyone's sights.
As for Watson coming home, his wife is heavily pregnant and he was coming home after the 3rd test for the birth anyway. Given he isn't playing, why not come home in case the baby comes early.
There is clearly a massive issue between Watson and Clarke though. Im not sure watson is essential to our test futurre but The number of senior aus cricket players that Clarke has fallen out with will soon be a whole cricket team. That's a problem the ACB needs to address.
This will go down as one of our worst tours ever, terrible selections both initially and for each test, playing players when injured, a dysfunctional squad and poor form by most of the players. The situation with Watson and the three others is the trees, the disaster that is the tour as a whole is the woods that should be firmly in everyone's sights.
I like to watch
David Codey (61)
He is old school,he won't get on with the captain.
Or are you suggesting both the coach and the captain go?
(Apparently they are as one, on this issue,so it would make sense)
jermano
Ted Fahey (11)
VS the current Australian team. Best game of the summer!!
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Dan54
Tim Horan (67)
I see your point Mark, but hasn't Arthur inherited a team with this culture?? And as for all the business of homework hasn't anybody read supposedly what they were asked?? To I either tell Artheu, or write down 3 ways they thought the team could improve to win a test. And the VICE CAPTAIN was one who didn't the VICE CAPTAIN FFS, so you don't expect your bloody vice captain to do something to help get team to improve?? And if he has no ideas, he sure shouldn't be a bloody vice captain or anything!! And the business of wife having baby, isn't it amazing it suddenly became important to be back with her when he got dropped. As for team helping out with ideas to help win tests, I know the All Blacks have meetings, with players making notes (just like at school) to help in making decisions in how they play, seems if you not wanting to appear a spoilt brat you would do these things and perhaps say in your report (and it didn't have to be in writing apparently) 'I don't think making us help with coming up with ways of improving is helping us win tests' not just not do anything!!! I believe Watsons behaviour is inexcusable, and it all very well to lay blame on coach,and it's easy because he not Aussie is stupidity in extreme. I know in old days when Aus had a real top team, it was considered something for whole country to be proud of that Boonie had record for beer drunk on flight, and Fatcat Richie has boasted on radio that he played a test after being on piss until 6 that morning, but the sport has moved on from those days and I would think everyone should be putting in to get out of slump!!!
Ok had my rant, and you probably all think I expect too much from these precious wee boys , but that is what I think. Anyway I'll wander off back to rugby threads now.
Ok had my rant, and you probably all think I expect too much from these precious wee boys , but that is what I think. Anyway I'll wander off back to rugby threads now.
The Red Baron
Chilla Wilson (44)
If you look at this instance in isolation, it does seem ridiculous. The team was asked to submit 3 points as to how they would improve, etc etc. Two of those guys haven't even played a test on this tour and one of the others is our best fast bowler. So how the hell should these guys know how to fix their games? When was the last time Khawaja actually played a game of cricket?
And that's the funny thing. These guys are cricketers. They are not plumbers, or academics, or writers, or managers. Their skillset revolves around bowling a ball, hitting a ball and fielding the ball. They try and get runs while trying to get the other team out. That is their skillset. Not writing some half baked fucking essay about how they can get better. They play, and the coach should be figuring out how to make them better.
However, it is obvious that Mickey has no idea how to make them better individually or as a team. Otherwise he would never have asked for these 3 points. And while I am at it, if the players 'forgot', were they reminded that they had to get their essay in before time? For example, did Mickey go up to any of them on the Friday and say, "I haven't seen your essay yet mate, make sure you remember to have it to me by tomorrow night". Or did he let them hang themselves?
If the latter, then it really speaks volumes about his 'management' style. The team was shot to bits after getting flogged last week, this stunt will not motivate them. It will make matters so much worse.
And that's the funny thing. These guys are cricketers. They are not plumbers, or academics, or writers, or managers. Their skillset revolves around bowling a ball, hitting a ball and fielding the ball. They try and get runs while trying to get the other team out. That is their skillset. Not writing some half baked fucking essay about how they can get better. They play, and the coach should be figuring out how to make them better.
However, it is obvious that Mickey has no idea how to make them better individually or as a team. Otherwise he would never have asked for these 3 points. And while I am at it, if the players 'forgot', were they reminded that they had to get their essay in before time? For example, did Mickey go up to any of them on the Friday and say, "I haven't seen your essay yet mate, make sure you remember to have it to me by tomorrow night". Or did he let them hang themselves?
If the latter, then it really speaks volumes about his 'management' style. The team was shot to bits after getting flogged last week, this stunt will not motivate them. It will make matters so much worse.
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
Dan, I agree if players are being dickheads then they should be dealt with and harshly if needed. I am blaming captain and coach. I can not see how this is a sensible move or that it will improve team harmony, standards or performances. They could have just dropped all four players from the third test, and if need be, tell Watson he is one inch away from being stamped as never to be picked again andmmissing out on two ashes series. It's happened before, being a dickhead was enough to miss out on the baggygreen in the past regardless of form. Instead they go for public humiliation with hints of entrapment.
Note Watson was going to do the homework, he thought it was due Monday and not Saturday as did Johnson.
Anyway, I'm not trying to defend Watson. Everyone has fucked up here, but this is one of many recent fuck ups from captain and coach by my measure.
Note Watson was going to do the homework, he thought it was due Monday and not Saturday as did Johnson.
Anyway, I'm not trying to defend Watson. Everyone has fucked up here, but this is one of many recent fuck ups from captain and coach by my measure.
I disagree. Self-reflection and individual planning are very important parts of team sport at the top level. A simple task like this gives a more formal avenue for players to critique their own performance and work out what they have to fix before the next game.
And the idea that exercises such as this are unique to Arthur or a product of the post-Waugh era (a great term which I will use more) is just wrong. John Buchanan was legendary for this sort of stuff- getting players to write down plans for bowling/batting and reflecting on their place in the team. It worked well enough back then, and it still works now.
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The Red Baron
Chilla Wilson (44)
I don't recall commenting that this was a relatively new exercise there BaaBaa. However, the problem here lies with the methodology. And I stand by my comment.
Self reflection will work when it is properly structured, and players regularly receive feedback to improve their performance. If the reflection is poorly structured, then it just an exercise in futility. Exactly the situation currently before us. Why poorly structured? Because I believe that Mickey is at a loss as to how to improve the players in his charge.
As I said though, 2 of those players have yet to play a test this series. Another has been our best bowler. Whatever the intentions of the homework, it was most certainly not the most effective way to bring the best out in the players. What we are currently witnessing is a team that has little direction, and has just unnecessarily had it's dirty laundry publicly aired.
Now, rather than playing the devil's advocate for once, let us know your take on the situation.
Self reflection will work when it is properly structured, and players regularly receive feedback to improve their performance. If the reflection is poorly structured, then it just an exercise in futility. Exactly the situation currently before us. Why poorly structured? Because I believe that Mickey is at a loss as to how to improve the players in his charge.
As I said though, 2 of those players have yet to play a test this series. Another has been our best bowler. Whatever the intentions of the homework, it was most certainly not the most effective way to bring the best out in the players. What we are currently witnessing is a team that has little direction, and has just unnecessarily had it's dirty laundry publicly aired.
Now, rather than playing the devil's advocate for once, let us know your take on the situation.
Kenny Powers
Ron Walden (29)
How long will Pat Howard remain in his role at Cricket Australia, doesn't appear to be respected by past players given Shane Warnes comments and now Watson's.
As a ruby player I thought he was overrated, granted he had some success in European club rugby but when playing for the Wallabies received more chances than he deserved.
As a ruby player I thought he was overrated, granted he had some success in European club rugby but when playing for the Wallabies received more chances than he deserved.
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