Jimmy_Crouch
Ken Catchpole (46)
Rodda has shown why the decision to make Wright the captain was the correct one.
Reds 2020
- Thread starter RugbyReg
- Start date
I think it's fair to say that Izack has made a Rodda for his own back over this whole episode
TSR
Mark Ella (57)
Reg - agree with much of your post, but I don’t quite agree with the last bit. Even in general times people are entitled to a few dud calls, but in these crazy times I’m loathe to judge anyone too harshly. Picone seems to have a lot who dislike him, but he obviously has the ear of his clients and they are prepared to follow his advice. If he’s lasted this long in the industry then enough players obviously value his approach.
More broadly speaking I think people will forgive & forget if they end up resolving things with the Reds and even maybe if they don’t. Who would have though O’Connor would have been getting the plaudits he is from Reds fans 12 months ago.
With regards to the specific players I 100% agree with your first bit. They are all fine players and they will leave a hole if they do go.
This season has shown Hockings and Lucas have some way to go - but any of us who thought it would be otherwise at this age were kidding ourselves. Aside from his accuracy at the breakdown, which does need work, Hockings has actually been fine I think and Lucas is a young guy starting out with plenty to offer but not yet with the body of work to push in front of O’Connor or Stewart. I look at the performance of Stewart in particular this year as reassurance that Lucas will develop just fine if given time.
In short 3 fine players and I hope we sort things out with them but life will go on if we don’t.
Red Andy
Frank Row (1)
Exactly right mate. Life will go on. As my old grandpa used to say about everything to do with sport: There's always another one coming along"". Its true in any organisation really. They have a right to do what is best for themselves. Good for them. They will find they will join the long list of "remember thems". Successful organisations have a passionate WHY with buy in. If your first instinct in a crisis is ME then good on you and we move on to someone with greater commitment to the collective cause. Of course it all may get sorted out in the next week anyway but they have breached the US mindset being brewed at Ballymore by the looks
upthereds#!
Ken Catchpole (46)
Just one of the news articles mentioned friction between Rodda and Thorn - I felt it eluded to ongoing friction, not friction caused by not signing. Rodda also didnt keep it secret missing out on the captaincy confuddles him.
Finsbury Girl
Trevor Allan (34)
Hockings certainly has potential to join the QLD 100 cap club. This is why it is so disheartening.
As for Rodda, there are a few ways to deal with disappointment, the best way is to put your head down and work even harder, prove the bastards wrong. The worst way is to have a sook and spit the dummy.
As for Rodda, there are a few ways to deal with disappointment, the best way is to put your head down and work even harder, prove the bastards wrong. The worst way is to have a sook and spit the dummy.
Mr Tank
Herbert Moran (7)
Interesting commentary on the player stand down over at the Roar (comments from Don on this article if anyone is interested).
Summarising the comments; Hockings wants to stay but has no contract for next year from the Reds - although he does have a Rugby AU contract agreed to. He has asked that his contract for next year be sorted before he will agree to the pay cut. Isaac Lucas has been told he is not wanted anymore, so his objection is being asked to take the pay cut when he has no future at the club. He wants a release from the Reds to go to another Oz super team. Rodda having the same manager has been asked to take a stand with his team mates and he agreed to do so.
All information is third or fourth hand, but given the way Picone acolytes were busy on this board post the Kerevi contracting issue it wouldn't surprise me if there is some truth there.
Summarising the comments; Hockings wants to stay but has no contract for next year from the Reds - although he does have a Rugby AU contract agreed to. He has asked that his contract for next year be sorted before he will agree to the pay cut. Isaac Lucas has been told he is not wanted anymore, so his objection is being asked to take the pay cut when he has no future at the club. He wants a release from the Reds to go to another Oz super team. Rodda having the same manager has been asked to take a stand with his team mates and he agreed to do so.
All information is third or fourth hand, but given the way Picone acolytes were busy on this board post the Kerevi contracting issue it wouldn't surprise me if there is some truth there.
Mr Tank
Herbert Moran (7)
Sorry the other point being apparently Hocking has been offered a contract from the Reds but with a pay cut since the Reds have a surplus of locks. Probably why Picone asked Rodda to stand down so they would probably consider how deep their lock stocks are.
PhilClinton
Geoff Shaw (53)
Don't know how much I believe some of that. Isaac Lucas signed a contract through till 2023 at the end of last year. Now suddenly he isn't wanted? It's not like the Reds have guys banging down the door who are better than him. Sounds weird.
Getwithme
Cyril Towers (30)
agreed
Mr Tank
Herbert Moran (7)
Yes, its very unlike the Reds to groom a young flyhalf, throw him in at the deep end, blame him for a loss, and then discard him for the next new shiny thing.
PhilClinton
Geoff Shaw (53)
And who would the shiny new thing be?
Also since signing the long term deal, there hasn't been much of a deep end to throw him in. The Reds have made some selection blunders in the past for sure, but to discard someone from a sample size of 6 games in 2020 is even a stretch too far for them.
Ignoto
John Thornett (49)
Ah, I see Rodda was one of the brave souls that would reply "Yes" whenever his mother asked "If Isaac jumped off the cliff, would you?"....
upthereds#!
Ken Catchpole (46)
Weird about Lucas....what has changed since they gave him his long contract to 2023....? Does Thorn not like him? They would have to pay his contract out, unless its more about he won't get much game time.
RedsHappy
Tony Shaw (54)
But rugby life here in Australia will soon be very, very different.
I'm surprised that few posters here have stopped to consider the possibility that, indeed, come later in 2020, these 3 guys might just be seen as amongst the smartest in the room. At least as far as medium-term income and career security goes. And who are we to judge that such considerations should be made secondary for professional rugby players just because we want them to 'stay where we like to see them play' or 'because good blokes should stick with their mates'.
They sound like fine sentiments, but they are more for our own self-gratification than they are for someone facing massive negative changes in their employment base, or potentially zero employment onwards, or for years ahead 50% or more less than they have earned in recent years.
It's a virtual certainty that gross $ income into pro Aust rugby will be drastically down, by big %s, from 2021 and for the then foreseeable future. On all current sensibly estimated trajectories RA's gross income could easily go from c. $100m pa in 2019 to c. $30m in 2021. The local RUs' 2021 income will be pro-rata affected in the same business logic path.
This can only mean two things: both (a) total pro player headcount and RA and local RUs office's headcount and (b) $s per head of every head will have to fall just as drastically, there is no spare cash reserves anywhere in Aust rugby for any other landing place in 2021 but this (and it could be worse than this; quite conceivably the whole pro layer in Aust rugby could be demolished by early 2021).
With at best Foxtel maybe backing a new domestic comp in 2021 with vastly lower $s than 2019's, sponsorship $ falling too, gate income down say 50% on 2019, add it all up, to stave of insolvency the total current 2020 headcount entailed in playing and running pro rugby here is totally unsustainable (unless say a Twiggy Forrest white knights the code as he might have done if that clown Clyne had not totally alienated him).
There will surely be a major surplus of pro players here come end 2020. Given that, unless individuals want to head lemming-like for the for sea cliffs and go over, the smart, rational personal call for players of quality is get out now before this deluge of supply hits the market and further attempt to attain greater job security and/or income levels in Japan or EU before these zones close off team selection for their next late 2020 or early 2021 season. Many players, like some of us here, are totally jack of the chronically incompetent, idiotic management of the code in Australia, they are not fools.
We observe and type away, they have to pay the mortgage every month. The thrill and motivation of 'loyalty' and 'for the good of the game' has gone for many of our players as their understandable cynicism and distaste for their bosses has justly magnified. Many just want out, some right now before the going goes bad.
PhilClinton
Geoff Shaw (53)
Nice post RH but it doesn't change the fact that these three blokes out of an entire cohort are the only ones who've chosen to take this course of action.
I refuse to believe it's all due to them having some exceptional foresight into the future of Australian rugby - if that was the case then why hasn't Picone pulled the same move for all this players?
No disrespect to them but there are plenty of others much smarter than this lot who've chosen a different path when faced with the same choice.
I refuse to believe it's all due to them having some exceptional foresight into the future of Australian rugby - if that was the case then why hasn't Picone pulled the same move for all this players?
No disrespect to them but there are plenty of others much smarter than this lot who've chosen a different path when faced with the same choice.
upthereds#!
Ken Catchpole (46)
There may very well be a whole bunch of others out there who intend on leaving as soon as they can, but no point jumping ship on a contract now when there is not that many contracts being made available anywhere. You could play Super rugby and several tests for the wallabies THEN talk about leaving.
Only thing is I assume they have a better chance of breaking or being released from contract now over this pay dispute then they do just down the track when it's more settled.
Only thing is I assume they have a better chance of breaking or being released from contract now over this pay dispute then they do just down the track when it's more settled.