School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[Quick Hands]

I was talking to a couple of Kings fathers last week watching the second half of the 1sts and one of them said "Every try that the Scots 1st XV score against Kings today will see 1 less Kings boy play rugby next year. You can only watch the biggest and strongest boys in the school get flogged by over 50 points by the same school so many times before you become demoralised and lose interest in something you used to love."
He then named half a dozen boys in U14 & U15 who had played rugby since U8s in club and school who had switched to Soccer or Mountain biking this year.
The discussion then moved on to the possibility of Kings or New or even Shore deciding to follow Tas, High and Grammar into the 3rds comp in 2016 when the current structure is up for review. This was despite the fact that apparently Kings and Scots played 24 games with Kings winning 14 (inc 2nds, 4ths, 16as, 14as) and 1 draw (15as) and the only blowout being the 1sts.
It was all a little depressing

What's concerning is theat the two smallest (in terms of playing numbers) at Kings this year are 13s and 14s. These are normally the biggest age groups with the most teams, but IIRC Kings only go down to Es - this is less teams than they have in their 16s age group. If the normal drop-out rate applies to the current 13s and 14s at TKS, they'll be lucky to get a 16Cs in 2 or 3 years.

You're right, it's depressing.

 

[Gregor]

I was talking to a couple of Kings fathers last week watching the second half of the 1sts and one of them said "Every try that the Scots 1st XV score against Kings today will see 1 less Kings boy play rugby next year. You can only watch the biggest and strongest boys in the school get flogged by over 50 points by the same school so many times before you become demoralised and lose interest in something you used to love."
He then named half a dozen boys in U14 & U15 who had played rugby since U8s in club and school who had switched to Soccer or Mountain biking this year.
The discussion then moved on to the possibility of Kings or New or even Shore deciding to follow Tas, High and Grammar into the 3rds comp in 2016 when the current structure is up for review. This was despite the fact that apparently Kings and Scots played 24 games with Kings winning 14 (inc 2nds, 4ths, 16as, 14as) and 1 draw (15as) and the only blowout being the 1sts.
It was all a little depressing

I am sorry, but what a load of nonsense. A blowout in one game will make zero difference to a 13 or 14 year olds choice about continuing to play rugby. I played GPS in Queensland at a time when Nudgee flogged everyone. It didn't make one iota of difference to all the kids from my school what the score was in the 1st XV as to whether we continued to play. There were so many more important factors like the motivation and quality of coaches that play a much bigger part in the decision making of a kid. In fact because Nudgee had this awry of invincibility when we played them, the whole school lifted. It was the stuff of legends if you could pull one win against them during your entire high school years!

New were joint premiers last year and though they are struggling this year, I am told they are really excited about the talent coming through in the next couple of years. Talk of them considering going to the 3rds is pure fiction. Finally, I saw plenty of lads from both Kings and Scots last week giving it their very best and having a great time whilst at it, win, lose or draw.

 

[I like to watch]

What is not nonsense is they have a declining base.
They will probably field 3 16's sides in 3 years,depth will be affected and their 1's will be weaker.
Death by a thousand cuts.

 

[lincoln]

In 2002 Kings was putting cricket scores on other GPS schools with students whose enrollment circumstances may not have been totally understood by the headmaster. Maybe the decline in playing numbers is a consequence of many factors (too many helicopter mums for one). What happened at Scots in recent years was abhorrent but cannot be blamed for the current malaise in junior rugby.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

A good reminder that enrolment irregularities are not a new phenomena, nor restricted to the two most recent examples of such.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

by at the top level struggle with the differing body requirements
requirement (upper body muscle and speed for Rugby, endurance and lean muscle for Rowing)
Throw Athletics season in the mix and some boys choose to play soccer to avoid
extras hours in the weights room or on the erg at the season changeover

And this is why the code of practice specifically mentions the fact that boys should not play only 1 sport.
Of course the boys could be trained better if they only did one sport. They could be bigger where they need to be and leaner where they need to be.
And if cricket were banned they actually do some exercise during summer instead of loafing around getting too much vitamin D.
But none of that is what school sport is about.
You can specialise when you leave school. Just as with academics.

 

[Gregor]

And this is why the code of practice specifically mentions the fact that boys should not play only 1 sport.
Of course the boys could be trained better if they only did one sport. They could be bigger where they need to be and leaner where they need to be.
And if cricket were banned they actually do some exercise during summer instead of loafing around getting too much vitamin D.
But none of that is what school sport is about.
You can specialise when you leave school. Just as with academics.

When summer sport finished, and pre season preparations for rugby started, they would split us between those that rowed in summer and those that played cricket. Those that rowed went straight into skills training, those that played cricket had to do fitness and strength training for a month before they would let us touch a rugby ball. Cricketers were frowned upon as a pack of bluggers who had spent half their time tanning themselves on the ovals and the other half sleeping in the sheds whilst a couple of token players who had drawn the short straws, whacked a ball and preceded to jog (but most of the time walk) 22 yards, before they needed to take a breather.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

You must be 20 years younger than me then.
everyone just started playing in my day

 

[Gregor]

You must be 20 years younger than me then.
everyone just started playing in my day

I finished school in the year a Liberal prime minister who attended Oxford University and studied the modern greats was replaced by a Labor prime minister who also attended Oxford Uni and studied the modern greats (though I belief he changed course mid stream).

 

[Quick Hands]

- Newington already have less rugby teams than Kings. In the lower age groups
the New teams play a lower Kings team. ( Kings C vs New B)

True in the older age groups (opens, 16s and 15s), but in the 14s they both have 5 teams so will match up exactly and in the 13s New have 6 teams to Kings 5 so it will be one of the NC teams which will play a lower TKS team and another will have a game against another school.

Worrying news from a school which used to go to Gs or Hs in 13s/14s.

 

[Gregor]

I think Kings went to 13H and 14G as recently as 2011 so it has been a rapid reduction

Kings need to look at what is really attracting or influencing kids to the other codes, as there are plenty of theories as to the reasons. Kings could believe that it is not there place to influence participation rates between the various codes and that movement between them is part of a natural cycle or evolution, in other words, if rugby dies a slow death and some other footy code rises up to become the dominant sport, then so be it. Of course for us rugby lovers and followers it is a tragedy that we can't allow to happen.

 

[Quick Hands]

It's probably more a demographic issue at Kings than the effect of rugby scholarships at Scots. TKS have really improved academically recently - in fact I think they outperformed Shore in the HSC last year. The supply of country boarders seems to be in a bit of decline as well, to the extent that they've had to rationalise their boarding houses.

Rugby in general needs to appeal to more than the anglo-celtic demographic of 1950s Australia. Sevens is a great way to do this - despite huffing and puffing from traditionalists.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

It's probably more a demographic issue at Kings than the effect of rugby scholarships at Scots. TKS have really improved academically recently - in fact I think they outperformed Shore in the HSC last year. The supply of country boarders seems to be in a bit of decline as well, to the extent that they've had to rationalise their boarding houses.

Rugby in general needs to appeal to more than the anglo-celtic demographic of 1950s Australia. Sevens is a great way to do this - despite huffing and puffing from traditionalists.

I guess it depends on your measure but both schools maintained their 2012 HSC ranking in 2013 being 26th for Shore and 38th for TKS.

Kings need to look at what is really attracting or influencing kids to the other codes, as there are plenty of theories as to the reasons. Kings could believe that it is not there place to influence participation rates between the various codes and that movement between them is part of a natural cycle or evolution, in other words, if rugby dies a slow death and some other footy code rises up to become the dominant sport, then so be it. Of course for us rugby lovers and followers it is a tragedy that we can't allow to happen.

I do not think that this is a phenomenon confined to TKS or the GPS. It began at SGS 35 years ago.
It is occurring out in the real world too.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Was at BBC to watch BBC v ACGS 1st XV today. Heard that BBC has 80 kids on rugby scholarships. Assuming half board and half dayboys, that would cost around $2.4m p.a. (80 x $30,000). What is the driver of making that substantial investment? If it is important for the kids of BBC to win the rugby, why was there only about 30-50 BBC kids there (at home) to watch their 1st XV (and there was barely "peep" out of them)? Who drives the decision to have that much money invested in rugby with so little support from the student body (and so little return on investment)?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I don't want to like you post HJ - i want to like Jake the Peg's

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Jake's post has been deleted from where it was originally posted. As a newbie, he appears to be blissfully unaware of Hotel California.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Jake's post has been deleted from where it was originally posted. As a newbie, he appears to be blissfully unaware of Hotel California.

He'll be back.
We're all just prisoners here

 

[Rob hart]

He'll be back.
We're all just prisoners here

" You can check out but you can never leave "

Just ask dodgy knee ........

 

[RUGBYGIRL11]

Don't know about Riverview playing by the rules
The have 100 boys on Old Boys Bursaries

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Don't know about Riverview playing by the rules
The have 100 boys on Old Boys Bursaries

Are these bursaries that can only be awarded to sons of old boys?