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Springboks vs Wallabies @ Newlands 27/9/2014

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Lindommer

Lindommer

Steve Williams (59)
Staff member
Big Willy's listed at 135kg on the Tahs site and 137kg on Wikipedia, that's far too heavy for top level rugby wearing a 4 or 5 jumper. Retallick's 121, Whitelock's 116 and Matfield's 110kg, Willy should be aiming to strip at least 10kg off over summer.
 
PaarlBok

PaarlBok

Rod McCall (65)
PaarlBok said:
Another chicken runner gone. Mvovo released for CC rugby and later a few more. After that we can expect the match23 to be. Would have love to had Brussouw now in 6. He, Duanne & Hendro win the CC in 2007 when they started as young guns for Free State.
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Have to be Potgieter.;)
 
cyclopath

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
Lindommer said:
Big Willy's listed at 135kg on the Tahs site and 137kg on Wikipedia, that's far too heavy for top level rugby wearing a 4 or 5 jumper. Retallick's 121, Whitelock's 116 and Matfield's 110kg, Willy should be aiming to strip at least 10kg off over summer.
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Completely agree.
He can come and ride some hills with me and Gagger, or I am happy to run around the cliffs and beaches of Coogee etc with him. He can shout the coffee after! ;)

I don't buy the argument that his size is a differentiator that he needs to maintain - he is taller than most locks, and even 10kg lighter will still be heavier than most, and still a bloody big lump to stop. But more mobile.
That said, the orthodoxy that he has to fulfill all the "eggs, flour and sugar" of the cake, rather than the icing is outdated - coaches pick 23 man teams these days which rely on combinations, not a bunch of pegs in holes (Like the retarded argument the Hooper is no good unless he is pilfering. Wake up, the game is diversifying. 2 Super Rugby winning coaches think he goes alright! Maybe Cheika and McKenzie are idiots??)

So what if Skelton doesn't jump as much in lineouts - if the 23-man team covers that outside him then who cares. Sure, don't pick him to be the 2nd lineout option, but don't sweat it if he is the 4th. No problem with him not being picked if the need is for lineout gurus. Stick him at the front on defensive lineouts to be a pain in the arse, and fuck up mauls. He can be used if you want.

If he can get lighter, and be more useful at lineout, great. But he provides things that others don't, so I'd be keeping him well in the mix. As I, and many have said, work in progress.
 
qwerty51

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
So Alberts is still injured? Whiteley has played better rugby than Burger this year. I guess he doesn't meet the bulk requirement?
 
Dismal Pillock

Dismal Pillock

Simon Poidevin (60)
Hugh Jarse said:
USA Education Department endorsed Map of The World
US+Map+A.jpg
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haha

worldmap01_zps7f67f83e.jpg



come on, surely one of you psychos can manage an Aussie version...
 
Joe Blow

Joe Blow

Peter Sullivan (51)
Retallic was the main offload merchant against the Boks last week for the Darkness but all 8 forwards were doing it at some point, without doubt under instruction from Hansen.
In comparison there were virtually no offloads by our forwards and we ran one out for most of the day. While this may have been somewhat effective against the Argies it will not do anything for us against the Boks. They will pick us off and hold us up for the turnover.
Skelton brings a different level of ball skills to our pack. He has a great awareness of where the opportunities are, much like Cooper or Beale, and the ability to distribute.
If he improves his fitness for the next 12 months at the same rate he has in the last 12 he will put himself in an excellent position to star at the RWC for the Wallabies.
 
Gnostic

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
cyclopath said:
Completely agree.
He can come and ride some hills with me and Gagger, or I am happy to run around the cliffs and beaches of Coogee etc with him. He can shout the coffee after! ;)

I don't buy the argument that his size is a differentiator that he needs to maintain - he is taller than most locks, and even 10kg lighter will still be heavier than most, and still a bloody big lump to stop. But more mobile.
That said, the orthodoxy that he has to fulfill all the "eggs, flour and sugar" of the cake, rather than the icing is outdated - coaches pick 23 man teams these days which rely on combinations, not a bunch of pegs in holes (Like the retarded argument the Hooper is no good unless he is pilfering. Wake up, the game is diversifying. 2 Super Rugby winning coaches think he goes alright! Maybe Cheika and McKenzie are idiots??)

So what if Skelton doesn't jump as much in lineouts - if the 23-man team covers that outside him then who cares. Sure, don't pick him to be the 2nd lineout option, but don't sweat it if he is the 4th. No problem with him not being picked if the need is for lineout gurus. Stick him at the front on defensive lineouts to be a pain in the arse, and fuck up mauls. He can be used if you want.

If he can get lighter, and be more useful at lineout, great. But he provides things that others don't, so I'd be keeping him well in the mix. As I, and many have said, work in progress.
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I'd agree with everything here except the weight argument. We can't just arbitrarily day a player should be X weight without knowledge about optional performance levels. Think of boxers who have been great at one weight level dropping the few kg to a low division and they lost power. The rest of the post I can agree with 100% and his effect is about difference and most importantly balance with the rest of the pack and how he is used.
 
Scrubber2050

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
Big Willie tipped the scales at 150.something last week. Shit that is a big piece of meat. He needs to get fit drop to about 135kgs.

Genia's return to the fold will have White and Phipps looking over their shoulders and probably rightfully so. It would be great IF he can get back to his best.

Also good to see Robbo join the squad. As said prior his experience at RWC would be an advantage all round.
 
T

Train Without a Station

Guest
cyclopath said:
So what if Skelton doesn't jump as much in lineouts - if the 23-man team covers that outside him then who cares. Sure, don't pick him to be the 2nd lineout option, but don't sweat it if he is the 4th. No problem with him not being picked if the need is for lineout gurus. Stick him at the front on defensive lineouts to be a pain in the arse, and fuck up mauls. He can be used if you want.

If he can get lighter, and be more useful at lineout, great. But he provides things that others don't, so I'd be keeping him well in the mix. As I, and many have said, work in progress.
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Could not agree more. He will never be the best line out jump in the team. But neither was Bakkies Botha. He obviously needs to improve that area a little but to expect him to be Victor Matfield is stupid.

I'd be more concerned about him getting lighter as a consequence of increasing fitness levels so he can improve his work rate. Once again, he's never going to be the best working lock in the world, but he needs to improve this to the level of some of the weaker locks in international rugby. As his involvements can be so good, this will be offset by that.
 
Blue

Blue

Andrew Slack (58)
cyclopath said:
Completely agree.
He can come and ride some hills with me and Gagger, or I am happy to run around the cliffs and beaches of Coogee etc with him. He can shout the coffee after! ;)
.
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Skelton's problem is not mobility. It's endurance.

But I suspect he won't ever be able to jump or be lifted unless he defats significantly.
 
Blue

Blue

Andrew Slack (58)
Train Without a Station said:
Could not agree more. He will never be the best line out jump in the team. But neither was Bakkies Botha. He obviously needs to improve that area a little but to expect him to be Victor Matfield is stupid.

.
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Exactly. Bakkies has always been an excellent jumper at 2. Most international jumpers at 2 will be totally useless at 4. They can getup and across quick with limited requirement for height. It's about speed and timing but you need some zip in your jump.

It's horses for courses. Skelton needs to be able to jump "aggresively" at 2 if you get my what I'm saying. The requires some explosiveness in the legs. Brad Thorn was great at this and Retalick is awesome (he should work at 4 as well - freak bastard hate the fucker he is so damn good).

Actually, Skelton will do good to take a leaf out of Flip vd Merwe's book. He was a big fat lumbering lump of lard when he first played for the Bulls but he worked hard and improved to such an extent that he took over the lineout calling and jumping at 4 for the Boks last year with great success. He has built endurance. May I point out that it took 3 to 4 years though. It can be done but requires enormous discipline and more time than people think. This is not a one off-season gig. He is 2 to three years away if you ask me.
 
T

Train Without a Station

Guest
Blue, seeing him in person he certainly isn't a fat lard. He looks a lot slimmer when you meet him off the pitch. But you can't be an effective lock at 135+kg. If Skelton slims down to 125kg he would still be probably the biggest lock in 1st tier international rugby.
 
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