England v Australia

[tragic]

Personally I'd have tomane/speight on the wings. Cooper at 10.Genia on the pines (although not too fussed about white provided he has learnt from that bloody box kick) with Horne for his utility value.
And then think about an extra piggie on the bench as this is where this game will be won or lost, and I'm really worried about the scrum capitulating in the final 20 and losing us the game with skelton on.

 

[Gillys_ghost]

What pisses me off about skelton is that he has some great ball skills, but he hasnt demonstrated them once at test level.

 

[wamberal]

What pisses me off about skelton is that he has some great ball skills, but he hasnt demonstrated them once at test level.

The only thing that he has done is break up a couple of rolling mauls.

 

[vidiot]

Interesting that Cooper and Beale appear to have been given quite different roles each time they come on in the last 20.

Cooper has been very steady - Cheika has gotten him playing a very sane style with minimal Cooper crazy, just the sort of thing we've hoped for.

Beale is rampant, he runs dramatic inside lines and is an energiser bunny. Just hasn't got the timing right yet but when/if he does he will really hurt a side and it could well be the Poms.

 

[Godfrey]

What pisses me off about skelton is that he has some great ball skills, but he hasnt demonstrated them once at test level.

He set up a try for Israel Folau in his first test with a pretty nice pass.

 

[Gillys_ghost]

He set up a try for Israel Folau in his first test with a pretty nice pass.

yeah actually your right i forgot about that one, it was quite deft from skelton

 

[Joe Blow]

What pisses me off about skelton is that he has some great ball skills, but he hasnt demonstrated them once at test level.

Well he did tear the Frogs a new one with his ball skills in his first test announcing his arrival but hasn't done much since.

 

[tragic]

Beale actually looked pretty good coming on against the frogs earlier in the year, in the last 20 in his energiser bunny role. But he has been completely ineffectual since due to the better defensive sides he has come up against. Admittedly if the forwards were crossing the gain line more in the last 20 with quick ball recycles and tired players he would have more space to play with and might be quite good in that role. Unfortunately that's not going to happen against the top tier sides anytime soon
Its not an anti tahs sentiment but I just don't see a role in the 23 for him at the moment.

Edit: that was a reply to vidiot but for some reason his post did not come up

 

[Brumby Runner]

The only thing that he has done is break up a couple of rolling mauls.

Which he is very good at, but it's not enough to keep him in the team imo.

 

[Braveheart81]

Which he is very good at, but it's not enough to keep him in the team imo.

Do we even know if Horwill is available for selection?

Skelton's inclusion seems as much about what the other locks and the replacement forwards don't bring to the side as what Skelton adds.

We're really missing some muscle on the bench. Hopefully Jones can add something this week. Hopefully him and Skelton can provide us some strong cleanouts and quick ruck ball in the last 15 minutes to give Cooper and Beale a good chance to spark the attack.

 

[Joe Blow]

If Skelton keeps improving at the rate he has done for the past 18 months he will make himself irresistible as far as selection in the 23 goes, maybe in the starting side considering we are not exactly over endowed with lock riches right now.

edit - I mean by RWC time or shortly thereafter

 

[Forcefield]

Are you serious? I haven't seen any improvement over the last 6 months. If he can gain parity with our other locks in scrummaging, I'd be all for him starting a few games or coming off the bench, but unless that happens he simply isn't worth it.

You are right that we are thin on the ground with locks but there are also those who haven't been given a reasonable chance like Neville (who apparently is a great scrummager). There are also those who will be knocking on the door for 2016- a couple from the Brumbies and Adam Coleman.

 

[Sully]

I also believe that he hasn't improved since the June tests.

 

[Forcefield]

The tricky thing is that in the first test he played against the French, they were on the rack. So maybe he looked a lot better and more influential at test level than he actually is. I want to see a couple of runs from Skelton like the one he put in against the Force in Perth this year. Made a lot of metres and made about 5 defenders look very sheepish.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Do we even know if Horwill is available for selection?

Skelton's inclusion seems as much about what the other locks and the replacement forwards don't bring to the side as what Skelton adds.

We're really missing some muscle on the bench. Hopefully Jones can add something this week. Hopefully him and Skelton can provide us some strong cleanouts and quick ruck ball in the last 15 minutes to give Cooper and Beale a good chance to spark the attack.

My comment is irrespective of Horwill's availability. In terms of Skelton's readiness for test rugby, I just don't think he is there yet, and won't be until at least he learns to scrummage properly. In terms of this test match, I've already posted my preferred lock selections and bench reserves. I'd have Jones starting in place of McMahon and have both McMahon and Schatz on the bench. Jones moves to lock if either Simmons or Carter need to come off. Schatz to cover 8 in case of injury to McCalman. McMahon to cover 6 and 7 if there are problems there. IMO a much better balanced pack and bench with the versatility to cover for any eventuality with injuries/form etc.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Are you serious? I haven't seen any improvement over the last 6 months. If he can gain parity with our other locks in scrummaging, I'd be all for him starting a few games or coming off the bench, but unless that happens he simply isn't worth it.

You are right that we are thin on the ground with locks but there are also those who haven't been given a reasonable chance like Neville (who apparently is a great scrummager). There are also those who will be knocking on the door for 2016- a couple from the Brumbies and Adam Coleman.

Forcefield I think you are on the money here regarding Skelton and Neville. But at the brumbies, I'm not sure that apart from Carter who is already there and Fardy who is ideally a 6, there are others who are yet knocking on the door. Tom Staniforth and Rory Arnold perhaps some time after 2015. Yet to see how Blake Enever pans out but hoping for big things down the track. Also think Coleman will still be a bit green for 2015.

Neville deserves a shot but Skelton probably still is our biggest hope. He needs to learn to scrummage (scrums absolutely go backwards when he packs in the second row) and to play for the best part of 80 minutes. ATM he can't do either which makes him a liability at test match level.

 

[Mr Doug]

With no free to air coverage of this match, (clearly a "breach of contract" that the ARU had with the Wallabies supporters, having said all matches except the Baa Baas match "would be broadcast on Fox Sports and Channel 10"), the thousands of us without Pay TV will be relying on those of you who have it, to give us a minute by minute description of play tonight!

 

[boyo]

We're really missing some muscle on the bench. Hopefully Jones can add something this week.

Based his performance in Ireland it will be to the opposition's scoreboard and to their scrum count.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I actually like the bench options and starting 15 selected.

Jones as bench option also gives better line out options when Skelton comes on whose lineout ability (too heavy to jump) and scrimmaging ability as a lock (enough said) is a continuing concern. We need to find more depth and cover for lock options for RWC

 

[Joe Blow]

Skelton is still extremely young. Carter is coming on nicely and Simmons is similar to Sharpie in a lot of ways. He will get better, but not that much better. He is a technician rather than a tearaway.
The RWC may be a little too soon for Skelton but he will rise to the top at some point. He's smart, strong and very big. We know his hand eye co-ordination is top notch for a big bloke and that he has excellent footy smarts.