Australian Schoolboys & National Championships 2016

[The Honey Badger]

Wouldn't the preference be taller loosey and a shorter tight head?

Good luck to the Aussie boys today. Go the Gold!

That would be my thinking and that is what they have done

 

[The Honey Badger]

Match Report from the Schools Rugby Website.
NSW boys must have figured strongly in the early stages
BMW Australian Schools defeat Samoan Schools

By Andrew on September 24, 2016 in News
MATCH REPORT: BMW Australian Schoolboys v Samoan Schools, Saturday 24th September 2016, Apia Rugby Stadium
The BMW Australian Schools defeated Samoan Schools in their first match of the tour 50 – 10 at Apia Rugby Stadium, Samoa. This match was the ninth occasion the two countries had met, with the first match played at St Ignatius College, Riverview in 2001 where Australia recorded a 47 – 6 victory. This has also been the fourth tour to Samoa by an Australian Schools team.
On a warm afternoon Australia kicked off and Samoa after catching the ball returned with a long kick. Australia shifted the ball and a sensational run down the left sideline by Yirrbi Jaffer-Williams ignited some early Australian attack. This was soon followed by a massive run through the middle of the field by Opeti Helu taking Australia deep into the Samoan 22m. The ball was passed out to the right with James Armstrong crossing the line for the first Australian try. A fine conversion from Ryan Lonergan had Australia take an early 7 – 0 lead. Ryan Lonergan added a penalty goal extending the lead to 10 – 0. Samoa with some possession and territory received a penalty 20m out and in front of the posts which they successfully kicked reducing Australia’s lead. A quick response and some excellent play by Isaac Lucas and Sunia Finefeuiaki resulted in William Eadie displaying his undoubted speed to score on the right side of the field. Another conversion by Ryan Lonergan took Australia to a 17 – 3 score.
After Isaac Lucas kicked downfield Samoa returned with a high midfield kick which was regathered by Samoa and their fullback suddenly found himself in the open and heading for the try line. A superb chase by William Eadie caught the fullback just short of the line. Unfortunately William was sent to the sin bin and form the ensuing play, the Samoan halfback scored a try which was converted bringing them into the match 17 – 10. Yet again Australia responded quickly and from 25m out James Armstrong ran to score under the posts for his second try. The conversion by Ryan Lonergan took Australia to a 24 – 10 lead and a second try to William Eadie shortly after and converted by Ryan Lonergan had Australia leading Samoa 31 – 10 which would be the half time score.
Australia was soon on the attack in the second half with Sunia Finefeuiaki, William Eadie and Isaac Lucas featuring strongly leading to Isaac Lucas popping an overhead pass to fullback Luke Osborne to score. The conversion from Ryan Lonergan took Australia to a 38 – 10 lead. At times the second half was a little scrappy but Australia added a further two tries with Tom Ross forcing his way over close to the line and from a lineout 5m from the Samoan line a well-constructed driving maul resulted in Fraser McReight scoring a try and a final score of 50 – 10.
Australia
Tries: James Armstrong 2, William Eadie 2, Luke Osborne 1, Tom Ross 1, Fraser McReight 1
Conversions: Ryan Lonegan 6
Penalty Goals: Ryan Lonergan 1
Samoa
Tries: Number 9, 1
Conversions: Number 10, 1
Penalty Goals: Number 10, 1
Number Name School
1 Opeti Helu Newington College
2 Lachlan Lonergan Trinity Christian School
3 Thomas Ross Daramalan College
4 Matthew Willshire Toowoomba Grammar School
5 Esei Haangana St Pauls Catholic College
6 Justin Sikimeti St Patrick’s College, Shorncliffe
7 Luke Gersekowski (c) St Edmund’s College
8 Sunia Finefeuiaki Marcellin College
9 Ryan Lonergan Trinity Christian School
10 Isaac Lucas (vc) St Joseph’s College Gregory Terrace
11 Yirrpi Jaffer-Williams St Joseph’s College
12 Hunter Paisami Pakenham Secondary School
13 James Armstrong Knox Grammar School
14 William Eadie St Joseph’s College Gregory Terrace
15 Luke Osborne The King’s School
16 Sean Farrell Brisbane Boys’ College
17 Lloyd Gorman Brisbane State High School
18 Laurence Tominiko Keebra Park State High School
19 Rory Suttor Shore
20 Fraser McReight Brisbane Grammar School
21 Joshua Vuta Somerset College
22 Adam Doueihi St Patrick’s College, Strathfield
23 Matthew McTaggart St Joseph’s College

Manager John Rownes Knox Grammar School
Coach Pat Langtry St Edmund’s College
Asst. Coach Andrew Moloney Anglican Church Grammar School
Asst. Coach Jay Tregonning The Illawarra Grammar School
Asst. Manager John Guy Hunter Valley Grammar School
S & C Jonathon Roussetos St Joseph’s College Gregory Terrace
Physiotherapist Tom Lombardo
Doctor Kate Gazzard
ARU Pathways Adrian Thompson


.

 

[OldColt]

I don't know too much about the boy playing 3 (but be is 180 cm & 120 kg according to tour book profile), so they must think the best combination is for Ross to play 3 and Helu 1. Opeti is tall for a THP (189 cm and 125 kg).

I think they have got it right based on height difference.

Apparently Helu is a late conversion to the front row and was playing centers 2 or 3 years ago. So he probably doesn't care too much which side of the scrum he is on.

Yes, a late conversion to the front row, and not a particularly good one - has never been an effective tight-head, and in most games has been comprehensively out-scrummaged by his opposite loose-head (and that's under the U-19 laws with pushing limited to 1.5m). When the coaching staff made the initial conversion, they might have been better off playing him at No. 8, where his ball-running and defence would have been more effective without the constant grind of packing into the front-row. Hopefully, the less demanding loose-head spot will suit him more than tight-head, but still looks more like a No. 8 as a long-term prospect.

 

[2bluesfan]

When the coaching staff made the initial conversion, they might have been better off playing him at No. 8, where his ball-running and defence would have been more effective without the constant grind of packing into the front-row. Hopefully, the less demanding loose-head spot will suit him more than tight-head, but still looks more like a No. 8 as a long-term prospect.

That's a road less travelled. There aren't many, if any, that have gone in that direction in the upper levels of our game.

 

[The Honey Badger]

I am told James Armstrong MOTM on Saturday

 

[Webbodactyl]

I am told James Armstrong MOTM on Saturday

I have been told it was Isaac Lucas, No. 10

 

[Lee Grant]

Yes, a late conversion to the front row, and not a particularly good one - has never been an effective tight-head, and in most games has been comprehensively out-scrummaged by his opposite loose-head (and that's under the U-19 laws with pushing limited to 1.5m). When the coaching staff made the initial conversion, they might have been better off playing him at No. 8, where his ball-running and defence would have been more effective without the constant grind of packing into the front-row. Hopefully, the less demanding loose-head spot will suit him more than tight-head, but still looks more like a No. 8 as a long-term prospect.

That is harsh - though no denying that it would be interesting to see the 125 kg Helu play 8 one day.

He can't be that bad as a prop: he was picked in the Green and Gold Rugby GPS Team of the Year in 2015 as a prop - though very raw in the position - and was the unanimous choice from the selection panel (or near enough) as the THP in the G&GR GPS TOTY in 2016.

Maybe all the G&GR selectors ignored his scrummaging - though I doubt it from what I saw of him this year (school, trials and nationals).
.

 

[OldColt]

That is harsh - though no denying that it would be interesting to see the 125 kg Helu play 8 one day.

He can't be that bad as a prop: he was picked in the Green and Gold Rugby GPS Team of the Year in 2015 as a prop - though very raw in the position - and was the unanimous choice from the selection panel (or near enough) as the THP in the G&GR GPS TOTY in 2016.

Maybe all the G&GR selectors ignored his scrummaging - though I doubt it from what I saw of him this year (school, trials and nationals).
.

It wasn't meant to be harsh - just realistic. I'd suggest he was picked more for his ability to bend the line in attack, and to put the occasional big hit on in defence, rather than for his scrummaging ability. And while he may have been the unanimous choice for G&GR GPS THP, the Aus schools selectors have switched him to LHP, which might indicate that the selectors at the higher level continue to value his contribution in attack and defence, but aren't as convinced of his ability at THP.

 

[will2shy]

http://www.schoolsrugby.com.au/2016/news/bmw-schoolboys-to-play-fiji-schools-u18/

 

[footy4life]

Yes, a late conversion to the front row, and not a particularly good one - has never been an effective tight-head, and in most games has been comprehensively out-scrummaged by his opposite loose-head (and that's under the U-19 laws with pushing limited to 1.5m). When the coaching staff made the initial conversion, they might have been better off playing him at No. 8, where his ball-running and defence would have been more effective without the constant grind of packing into the front-row. Hopefully, the less demanding loose-head spot will suit him more than tight-head, but still looks more like a No. 8 as a long-term prospect.

Not a particularly good one? That must be why he made school boys I assume? Opeti is a very good prop which is why he has played 2 years in 1st XV for Newington

 

[Lee Grant]

http://www.schoolsrugby.com.au/2016/news/bmw-schoolboys-to-play-fiji-schools-u18/

As always we should not be too analytical about which players are chosen for this tour match or that one. By the end of the Fiji game every player would have got a start, and four would have two of them.

The selection goal is to produce the best 15 and 23 for the fourth (and final) tour match versus NZ Schools and nothing else matters.

But glancing at the team for the Fiji game, Joeys' supporters will be scratching their heads a bit. They have McTaggart, their fullback, playing 13, and Jaffer-Williams who played 13 this year, playing wing. Maybe this is a midfield interview for McTaggart so they can compare him with the likes of Armstrong who is rested for this game.

Meanwhile Osborne gets his second start at fullback.

Tai, the 113kg ACT no. 8, who was magnificent in the mud for the ACT on the last day of the nationals, gets his first game on the trip.

Finefeuiaki, another big lad at 111 kgs, who was my player of the tournament in the nationals, is moved from 8 to 6. I hope that he can be retained in Victoria and is not tempted by approaches to him to return to NZ, while on tour.

Size is not everything but THP Tominiko, who is 122kg in his U17 year, gets his first start, and other props - 120kg Ross, who played U20s for the ACT this year, and 125kg Helu, are on the bench.

Let's hope that all these big lads reveal some impressive play to go with their imposing dimensions.
.

 

[OldColt]

Not a particularly good one? That must be why he made school boys I assume? Opeti is a very good prop which is why he has played 2 years in 1st XV for Newington

Never suggested he's a bad player at all - who can deny that he adds serious go-forward to any attack, and some scary hits in defence? Just suggesting that his conversion to THP wasn't particularly good, because size doesn't make up for either technique or skill in that crucial position. This isn't a huge issue when U/19 rules reduce the impact of scrum dominance, but becomes much more of an issue in the move to Colts and above, where technical ability in the front-row matters more than size alone.

 

[amirite]

I'll be honest and say that I think schoolboy scrummaging bellow international level is of a low standard. The boys' body shape at scrum time is generally pretty poor. This could be the ruleset, or could be the fact that most teams are picking the best players and worrying about their positions after.

That being said, by Colts and Grade the same players have pretty good shape at scrum time. I think this is because PEOPLE LEARN.

Opeti will learn and get better, he's got the physical attributes, though currently he's not exactly an awful scrummager. For those wishing to see him at 8, I've seen plenty of guys converted to the front row, but I've never seen anyone converted out of the front row.

 

[redblack]

Does anyone have any information as to whether the Aus Schools vs Fiji game today is being streamed?

 

[OldColt]

I'll be honest and say that I think schoolboy scrummaging bellow international level is of a low standard. The boys' body shape at scrum time is generally pretty poor. This could be the ruleset, or could be the fact that most teams are picking the best players and worrying about their positions after.

That being said, by Colts and Grade the same players have pretty good shape at scrum time. I think this is because PEOPLE LEARN.

Opeti will learn and get better, he's got the physical attributes, though currently he's not exactly an awful scrummager. For those wishing to see him at 8, I've seen plenty of guys converted to the front row, but I've never seen anyone converted out of the front row.

You make a very good point, but my initial suggestion about him playing No. 8 was related to the fact that he only became a front-rower last season, after reportedly playing in the centres prior to that. So, with only two years experience as a front-rower, the conversion to back-row wouldn't be as unusual as it would be if he'd been a prop all his life.

 

[footy4life]

Does anyone have any information as to whether the Aus Schools vs Fiji game today is being streamed?

The only game for Australia which will be televised is the one against New Zealand

 

[The Honey Badger]

Australia defeat Fiji 39-17, come from behind effort. Great game

 

[amirite]

Australia defeat Fiji 39-17, come from behind effort. Great game

Is this Fijian team considered handy?

 

[footy4life]

anyone know who scored the tries?

 

[The Honey Badger]

Is this Fijian team considered handy?

For what its worth, I do.

There was some serious talent playing today, The Fullback & No 8 all Class