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Wales vs Australia - Sunday 12 November - 4:15am AEDT

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Micheal

Micheal

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
From the front page: "My take is that Cheika is building depth in tactics as well as players."

An interesting thought. A good team should find a way to win with different weapons and strategies.

What if we don't have Folau as a strike runner and a bomb diffuser?

What if we need two bash-brother centres?

What if we don't have another ball-playing half at 9 (Genia) and opt for a workman (Phipps) instead?

Etc.

Curious, innit?
 
Simon.

Simon.

Bob Loudon (25)
Derpus said:
Yeah Gatland has made a point of moving away from big ball carriers and direct rugby. He's giving a 10 a debut at 12. It's bold and probably the right direction for the future. I'd be blown away if it clicks the first time they try it in their first test in 4 months without Sam Warburton and some other big names. If Australia play to their potential then we should blow them out of the water.
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Yeah I'm struggling to see much going for Wales this time, other than the Wallabies lacking Folau. Warburton, Tipuric, North and Webb all out, and that small backline (with essentially two 10s) against the Fijian beast that is the Kerevidrani. No doubt they will try and target Kerevi's defence but he's much less of a liability at 12. They will pretty obviously target the breakdown given out back row and Hanigan's terrible cleanouts and they might try to win it on penalties but I just can't see them shutting out a backline of Hodge, Beale, Koroibete and Kerevidrani. Unless the spoil Foley, which no doubt they will also focus on.
 
Derpus

Derpus

George Gregan (70)
^^^^
I think we adequately demonstrated last match that our attacking play does not really revolve around the 10 making plays. Also, Foley was pretty ineffective against NZ in the final bled and we still attacked quite well.
 
dru

dru

Tim Horan (67)
Micheal said:
From the front page: "My take is that Cheika is building depth in tactics as well as players."

Curious, innit?
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Not really. Cheika and crew have not shown an interest or ability to Link-Reds-like change strategy completely for each opponent. (Not sure Link did either at test level.)

It requires a coaching strategy and training implementation for each desired strategy or strategy adjustment. The requirement that Cheika should have been working through these things is not curious. In fact well discussed.

What might be said to be curious is the appearance that he has not done things other lurching as issues hit his table. We can only trust that the curious is appearance only and that they are all over it, completely rehearsed and natural, and ready to pounce.
 
Brumby Runner

Brumby Runner

David Wilson (68)
Simon. said:
Yeah I'm struggling to see much going for Wales this time, other than the Wallabies lacking Folau. Warburton, Tipuric, North and Webb all out, and that small backline (with essentially two 10s) against the Fijian beast that is the Kerevidrani. No doubt they will try and target Kerevi's defence but he's much less of a liability at 12. They will pretty obviously target the breakdown given out back row and Hanigan's terrible cleanouts and they might try to win it on penalties but I just can't see them shutting out a backline of Hodge, Beale, Koroibete and Kerevidrani. Unless the spoil Foley, which no doubt they will also focus on.
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".... obviously target the breakdown given our back row and Hanigan's terrible cleanouts...." Must also include Simmons in that comment. If anything, he is even less effective than Hanigan at cleanout time.
 
Inside Shoulder

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
watch the scrum - a lot of emphasis in the home nations on this element and Wales took some time out from team preparation to go to Bristol to scrum against the Poms this week.
 
jimmydubs

jimmydubs

Dave Cowper (27)
RugbyReg said:
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Looks low on Jones'. But 3 x Williams and 2 x Davies is about right. Interesting to see how they go.
 
Wales Fan

Wales Fan

Alfred Walker (16)
From a Welsh perspective I'm a little concerned about what the Wallabies could do to this side. But also pleased that Gatland has finally gone with a 2nd playmaker at 12 in Owen Williams. The problem is Williams is a decent 10 but by no means a solid defender, your Fijian boys in the centre will have a field day running down his channel.
The backrow is also an area of concern, our 7 Navidi is solid enough but probably no higher than 5th choice if everyone else was fit. His back-up on the bench has played 2 senior professional games in his career?! 2!
Could be worse than last year's opening game against you guys.
Apart from that I'm pretty positive

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk
 
Alex

Alex

Jimmy Flynn (14)
Even when Kerevi is not starting he is often the "midfield" backline reserve, so in those cases the wallabies are going into matches with him as the back-up for Foley, Beale or Kuridrani - whether as a result of an injury or a tactical sub. If that is the case, we have to be comfortable he can slot into the existing systems for any of those players at any stage. Starting him to give him more game time to develop in this role (and prove he can do it) is important. If we don't think the team can aford to start him in this position, then he shouldn't be subbing to cover these positions. I reckon this is a good move by the coaches with an eye to the future. Beale will fill the role of second ball player from subsequent phases and Hunt will provide playmake back up. I am excited to see how this backline goes.

In any event, while Kerevi is still developing, I reckon he already brings a lot more than a crash ball and I think has shown he has the potential to be a decent distributor. The mitts on him mean he gives a pretty handy one handed off load. If Australia get into trouble in this test I don't think it will be for lack of attacking ability in the midfield.
 
dru

dru

Tim Horan (67)
Alex said:
Even when Kerevi is not starting he is often the "midfield" backline reserve, so in those cases the wallabies are going into matches with him as the back-up for Foley, Beale or Kuridrani - whether as a result of an injury or a tactical sub. If that is the case, we have to be comfortable he can slot into the existing systems for any of those players at any stage. Starting him to give him more game time to develop in this role (and prove he can do it) is important. If we don't think the team can aford to start him in this position, then he shouldn't be subbing to cover these positions. I reckon this is a good move by the coaches with an eye to the future. Beale will fill the role of second ball player from subsequent phases and Hunt will provide playmake back up. I am excited to see how this backline goes.

In any event, while Kerevi is still developing, I reckon he already brings a lot more than a crash ball and I think has shown he has the potential to be a decent distributor. The mitts on him mean he gives a pretty handy one handed off load. If Australia get into trouble in this test I don't think it will be for lack of attacking ability in the midfield.
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I have absolutely no issue with Kerevi. My issue is the limitation (which goe with the strengths) around our chosen playmaking systems, combined with the developed and developing game strategy. Thence everyone, including Kerevi, everyone's adaptability to suit those strategies. In short I'm comfortable with K, but concerned over what seems a potentially ugly coaching ride of learning by making mistakes - or at least by insisting on risking that. It comes down to how well, and for how long, we have been training and strategising a big bopper centre implementation. As mentioned, we see K coming of the bench. It does not seem to me that we have been finishing strongly. I don't blame Kerevi for that. And things went well vs Japan. We don't see what is happening in the strategy sessions nor at training. And we should take Wales eitherway. Let's see a big one tonight WBs and demonstrate this second strategy against a strong rival.
 
Alex

Alex

Jimmy Flynn (14)
I am not sure that this is a second strategy. I think that it might be the same strategy executed with different players

Larkham seems to like a first phase attacking set up where Foley takes the ball wide and flat with essentially three passing options - they don't do this all the time from first phase but it seems to be the basis of a lot of the wallabies current play:
1. blind wing (Hodge and Speight in recent weeks) running off his inside shoulder to slice through under the posts or at least fix the backrow from drifting too fast
2. Kuridrani running a hard unders line to punch hole in close or set up a quick next phase or, as is often the case, fix possibly two, but at least one, defenders in the inside backs
3. Beale leading a second line sitting in behind Kuridrani with Folau and the open side winger outside him - and hopefully with a 3 on two if the the blind winger and Kuridrani have done their jobs fixing the defenders.

WIth the backline selected for today, I don't think Kerevi will play the Beale role in that pattern, nor that Beale will play the Folau role - nor that this pattern will be abandoned in favour of something else. I think Beale will continue to play the Beale role. Kuridrani may continue to play his usual role (although they may get Kerevi to practice that in a match situation), but more likely Kerevi will play the Folau wide running role between Beale and Korobeti/Hodge. He has the ability to beat a first man and give an offload or score himself (the job Folau does). I want to see how this goes
 
dru

dru

Tim Horan (67)
Alex, I'll go back over this in time, but in essence, most of time in the "A" strategy Beale stands deeper either behind the second pod or running a second back line.

If that is the intention with Kerevi life will be interesting.
 
Getwithme

Getwithme

Cyril Towers (30)
I will never get what Nathan Grey legit does. That try was a clearly circumstance of poorly run scramble defence. Our width, without committing barely anyone in the rucks has been poor and with 19 minutes we've been caught with 3 to 4 Welshmen on 2 or so wallabies in a 20 metre channel.
 
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