Ewen McKenzie Resignation

[Hugh Jarse]

I wouldn’t say it is a co-ordinated waratahs plan, but there was definitely a faction ARU employees working to get rid of him. <snip>.

You know this as a fact?

By all accounts there are not all that many ARU staff left. I would have thought that those remaining would be thankful for still having a job given the reported state of the ARU finances, and that they would be working to keep their jobs rather than whiteanting the National coach.

 

[Train Without a Station]

It needs to remember that people are irrational and resent change they don't like. They often are not objective. Or at least that's my experience dealing with professionals aged between 20 and 50 for the last decade.

I remember on one construction project I was a young supervisor on, we had a member of the administration staff let go when things were getting tight for the company.

I remember people making large complaints about this and even that "he was the only person around here that actually does anything". These comments came from 45 year olds that have been in supervision roles for a decade at that time.

I thought the guy was a nice enough bloke, had even gone around to his house at one stage and done him a personal favor with some carpentry work and told him not to worry about it when he offered to pay me, but really couldn't see why we actually needed him there on the project, as what he did really wasn't necessary and if people needed to be culled for financial reasons, he's probably one of the first people I would have let go too.

For what it's worth, the need to reduce costs was certainly real, the company went into receivership about a month or two later.

The point is don't expect people to be able to keep their personal feelings out of their professional judgement.

 

[Ulrich]

Forget Beale, forget Patston. This is just about the players and Link.

If the players were split on Link we would have heard about it, gag order or not. All the players talk to journos, after all. If anyone was up in arms about what happened (like a lot of fans were) then surely they would have expressed this outrage to a journalist, no?

I could be totally wrong here, and a number of players could be quietly seething. But somehow I doubt they are.
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This is true.

Link did mention that the players can express their concerns to him though. Whether the concerns are reasonable or unreasonable is at his discretion while he is in charge.

If it later emerges that he was being unfrair, rude, biased, disrespectful etc. then we'll all sing a different tune.

At the moment it would seem that whoever may have had beef with him did not even have the decency to confront him about it - OR - they didn't accept his response. (I.E, not playing Beale or whatever it could have been).

 

[thierry dusautoir]

Forget Beale, forget Patston. This is just about the players and Link.

If the players were split on Link we would have heard about it, gag order or not. All the players talk to journos, after all. If anyone was up in arms about what happened (like a lot of fans were) then surely they would have expressed this outrage to a journalist, no?

I could be totally wrong here, and a number of players could be quietly seething. But somehow I doubt they are.
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Perhaps they have all learnt a valuable lesson, and realised the Australian rugby is much bigger than their own personal agendas. Maybe, just maybe this crucible has brought all parties together in a bid to bring back the glory days.

And link is their saviour who died for their sins but will come again?

 

[Muglair]

Ulrich, I think you and IS are in loud agreement on this one. The impression I got from your post was that you maintained respect for the teachers that held you to a higher standard and I presume that this is because they also maintained their standards.

IS was pondering what would happen where the teacher that insisted on high standards did not maintain the standards themselves.

This is a pivotal issue for us all and I hope that the ARU is totally transparent here. Any cover up might save some face and some money in the short term but will leave Australian Rugby in a difficult and divided position.

 

[Braveheart81]

At the moment it would seem that whoever may have had beef with him did not even have the decency to confront him about it.

Except there are reports that members of the squad voiced concerns with McKenzie as early as November last year.

The relationship between the coach and the players is a two way street. The players need to buy in to what the coach is doing but at the same time, the coach can only succeed if they keep the players in their corner.

At the end of the day, if the relationship between players and coach breaks down, the coach is the one to lose their job every single time. It's a lot easier to hire a new coach than find 30 new players.

 

[Ulrich]

Ulrich, I think you and IS are in loud agreement on this one. The impression I got from your post was that you maintained respect for the teachers that held you to a higher standard and I presume that this is because they also maintained their standards.

IS was pondering what would happen where the teacher that insisted on high standards did not maintain the standards themselves.

This is a pivotal issue for us all and I hope that the ARU is totally transparent here. Any cover up might save some face and some money in the short term but will leave Australian Rugby in a difficult and divided position.

That is a good point, Muglair.

For me, the issue came to light in the media when Beale didn't want to wear the blazer.

Whatever the protocols of the union they should be followed.

In various contries school uniforms are not necessary but in many others they are and you can be sure to expect trouble if you don't comply.

Here in SA you're not allowed to be found smoking in your uniform even after school whether your parents, friends, your god or whoever agrees or not. In fact, you can get locked up even if you're 18.

Those are the rules. It's about pride in what you represent and who you represent as well as where you're going.

If you're not going to follow protocol / dress code in the small situations why not just wear casual attire during the next team photo?

 

[Ulrich]

Except there are reports that members of the squad voiced concerns with McKenzie as early as November last year.

The relationship between the coach and the players is a two way street. The players need to buy in to what the coach is doing but at the same time, the coach can only succeed if they keep the players in their corner.

At the end of the day, if the relationship between players and coach breaks down, the coach is the one to lose their job every single time. It's a lot easier to hire a new coach than find 30 new players.

I did not know that.

What were the concerns that they voiced?

 

[Train Without a Station]

It was regarding what Patson's role was.

Seriously, unless it meant they weren't able to receive adequate medical treatment, gym, field, recovery time, or equipment, then I don't see what it's got to do with them.

 

[Scrubber2050]

It needs to remember that people are irrational and resent change they don't like. They often are not objective. Or at least that's my experience dealing with professionals aged between 20 and 50 for the last decade.

I remember on one construction project I was a young supervisor on, we had a member of the administration staff let go when things were getting tight for the company.

I remember people making large complaints about this and even that "he was the only person around here that actually does anything". These comments came from 45 year olds that have been in supervision roles for a decade at that time.

I thought the guy was a nice enough bloke, had even gone around to his house at one stage and done him a personal favor with some carpentry work and told him not to worry about it when he offered to pay me, but really couldn't see why we actually needed him there on the project, as what he did really wasn't necessary and if people needed to be culled for financial reasons, he's probably one of the first people I would have let go too.

For what it's worth, the need to reduce costs was certainly real, the company went into receivership about a month or two later.

The point is don't expect people to be able to keep their personal feelings out of their professional judgement.

So, Train, did you give him the flick ?

 

[Ulrich]

It was regarding what Patson's role was.

Seriously, unless it meant they weren't able to receive adequate medical treatment, gym, field, recovery time, or equipment, then I don't see what it's got to do with them.

I think we should take some caution on this because Patson may have some skeletons that were harmful. Can't think of how that would be possible but that's the benefit of the doubt I'll give the players.

 

[chasmac]

So, Train, did you give him the flick ?

Goooooooorrrrrnnnnneeee

 

[Braveheart81]

Seriously, unless it meant they weren't able to receive adequate medical treatment, gym, field, recovery time, or equipment, then I don't see what it's got to do with them.

This seems like the sort of attitude that ends up with the coach losing the dressing room and the sort of fiasco we're in the middle of.

Whether or not the players are entirely justified in any concerns they have, dismissing them seems like folly to me.

Coaches (particularly McKenzie) talk about finding those extra 1 per cents often. That involves non-rugby related issues just as much as on field issues.

 

[barbarian]

It was regarding what Patson's role was.

Seriously, unless it meant they weren't able to receive adequate medical treatment, gym, field, recovery time, or equipment, then I don't see what it's got to do with them.

That's an overly simplistic view of things.

If her presence was affecting the mood of the camp then it was well within the rights of the players to voice concerns.
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[Train Without a Station]

That's an overly simplistic view of things.

If her presence was affecting the mood of the camp then it was well within the rights of the players to voice concerns.
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Yeah. But I guess it comes down to that it's all speculation. Is the affect her fault of theirs. My view is that it's very likely the player simply resented the changes. Sort of like "We didn't have to fill out expense forms back when Edgo was here" or something of the sort.

My point is that it sounds like there was a mandate to reduce costs, players need to suck it up if it's merely affecting creature comforts.

Now if it crept into any other those other examples, that's a different story and they would rightfully have reason to complain.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think one of the clear takeaways from this debacle is that an employee doesn't have to be in the wrong or doing a bad job for them not to work out.

 

[Muglair]

I realise we are getting close to 50 pages. Page 59 was when the last thread initially was shut down and I think we are starting to drift back into previously charted territories. There are sunken ships on my map. And a moderator with a knife .....

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I realise we are getting close to 50 pages. Page 59 was when the last thread initially was shut down and I think we are starting to drift back into previously charted territories. There are sunken ships on my map. And a moderator with a knife ...

played by Johnny Depp?

 

[barbarian]

I think one of the clear takeaways from this debacle is that an employee doesn't have to be in the wrong or doing a bad job for them not to work out.

I think people have made the assumption that Link is in the right here, and good at his job. Which is a fair assumption to make, but it might not be correct.

It will take a while until we have the full story here. I would like to hear the player's side of the story.
.

 

[Muglair]

played by Johnny Depp?

No doubt the moderators would be happy to claim the resemblance. I note however the absence of photographs of the Moderators and have drawn my own conclusions.