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Marriage Equality

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Jets, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Scoey Tony Shaw (54)

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    I agreed with you up until you used the word 'fictitious'. If you think that the concept of religion is BS that's fine. But the use of that word undermines the importance that religious people place on their beliefs and is entirely as discriminatory as the anti gay marriage argument. Discriminatory may be a strong word but it's certainly not "accepting that society is made up of a wide group of people who believe in different things."

    That is my point. Supporters of gay marriage often fail to see the importance of marriage to religious people and often dismiss their beliefs. It doesn't trivialise marriage by arguing pro gay marriage. It often trivialises religious beliefs by arguing pro gay marriage.
  2. Karl Bill McLean (32)

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    I just liked all the Marriage Posts I agree with but there's no dislike feature so assume if didn't get a like, it's a Dislike.

    Religion claiming marriage as its own now and seeking to exclude non-religious unions (well just non heterosexual unions) from using the term is ridiculous. Legally there is no reason to differentiate and in fact every reason not to, and as religion doesn't have a monopoly on the term and don't control it's meaning they have no role to play in a Government's decision to properly ensure that it's citizens are not discriminated against. On this issue, the Church should butt the hell out and STFU in my view. They don't have to recognize a same sex marriage if they don't want to, but last time I checked some official God Botherer's approval and consent was entirely irrelevant to the administration of the Family Law Act.
    Swat, ChargerWA, Godfrey and 3 others like this.
  3. TOCC Guest

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    I was raised catholic, went to a catholic school, was christened and baptised yet I still don't object to gay marriage.

    Everyone in Australia should be entitled to equal rights, and marriage is one of those rights.
    MrMouse, AngrySeahorse and louie like this.
  4. TOCC Guest

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    curious as to what you dislike about my comments considering you seem to be reiterating the same point
    Scoey likes this.
  5. Scoey Tony Shaw (54)

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    Maybe I didn't explain myself clearly enough? That's great that you are supportive of gay marriage - I have no problem with that. But for some people the whole marriage thing IS deeply religious. To dismiss that, is being dismissive of what that person believes in. You can't quantify it and you can't rationalise it - it's a belief.

    To try and bring this back to Rugby and Rugby to many is just like a religion. If a Tahs fan made a statement that QLD players showed no heart and had no pride in the jersey, a QLD fan would probably be insulted and instantly get defensive. You can't quantify these things, it's just something you believe to be true. But the statement from the Tahs fan is still disrespectful in the eyes of the QLD yet the Tahs fan will probably fail to see what the QLD fan is so upset about.

    Edit: Agree with the equal rights statement. But is it still equal rights if in achieving it you step all over another persons belief system?
  6. louie Bob Davidson (42)

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    My opinion on the topics in this theard are the follwing:

    - The Bingham Cup is amazing and what sport should be all about. Wonderful stuff. I hope Sydney gets it.

    - Anyone who says they support right to be gay but doesn't suport their right to be married is hypocrite.

    - Rugby is for everyone. Any background. No matter who they are.
    - So is the right to say i love you in anyway you like. Weather that's in a court of law or otherwise.
    MrMouse, Karl and AngrySeahorse like this.
  7. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    comment doesnt make sense at all..
  8. Braveheart81 Rocky Elsom (76)

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    The simile would be that because the Tahs fans didn't believe that the Qld players showed heart or pride in their jersey, the Tahs fans are going to say that Queensland shouldn't be allowed to play rugby.

    No-one is trying to argue that any specific religion should be forced to marry gay couples. They are merely asking for the right to have their marriage recognised under the law. Our current laws don't differentiate between a Christian marriage or a Jewish marriage or a Greek Orthodox marriage or a civil marriage.
  9. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    ill ask one last time then, why are they not lobbying for a civil union then? under law their "marriage" will be recognised and its the exact same thing but without the link to religion.problem solved
  10. louie Bob Davidson (42)

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    It makes complete sense. You saying "it's fine to be gay but you can't have any of the rights and privileges i have." That's suporting at all. That's the condratiction your making. You can't support gay rights and not supoort gay marriage. Doesn't work that way. You can support something but with conditions as to how it suits you.
    AngrySeahorse likes this.
  11. Scoey Tony Shaw (54)

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    Touche! :D

    And we end up back where we started. That it (being 'marriage') means different things to different people. We'll never please all the people, so is it right to upset one group to make another happy? Did we really achieve anything? I guess it depends in what group you fall. There's the rub.
  12. Braveheart81 Rocky Elsom (76)

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    Why should they?

    I am an atheist and I am given the right to marry under our laws.

    Marriage has no real link to religion. No religion invented marriage. The concept, the word, everything about it predates Christianity. Just because religions practice marriage ceremonies doesn't mean they have ownership of the concept.

    Why should a person have to settle for something different just because they love a person of the same sex?
    Swat, slydare, ChargerWA and 6 others like this.
  13. louie Bob Davidson (42)

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    BINGO!
  14. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    haha your joking right, being gay is (i believe) biological you cant help it your born that way, you can have all the rights you want but marriage is part of the christian faith and thats somthing they cant take part in, as ive said previously i cant take part in a Bar Mitzvah because thats part of someone elses religion, i dont see it as a restriction of my rights, do you? i doubt it, so why is marriage any different? Lets apply it to rugby, say i want to play colts but i dont qualify because i dont fit the criteria eg im 22, would you consider this "a restriction of my rights and privileges"?

    just have a civil union, its the exact same thing, gives gay people all the same rights, is recognised under law but doesnt have the religious connatations that go with marriage
  15. Braveheart81 Rocky Elsom (76)

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    At one point in time we didn't let women vote. Even though it upset one portion of our society we eventually allowed it.

    At one point we didn't consider indigenous Australians to be citizens nor for them to vote. We eventually allowed it even though doing so upset some people.

    Recognising the marriage of a gay couple under the law does not infringe on the marriage of a couple in a Christian ceremony nor does it infringe on the marriage of a couple in a Jewish Synagogue.

    I guess it boils down to whether you have a reasonable right to be upset by the mere fact that someone else is being allowed to do something that has no impact on you.
  16. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    given the right to marry yes because again by definition marriage is between a man and a woman, would you be allowed to marry in a church? debatable, alot of churchs now screen couples before they allow them to get married in a church to ensure they understand the religious aspect behind it. If you are a atheist and dont get married in a church you are effectivly having a civil service anyway. And as i PM'd you before and said yes the term predates christianity but the modern wedding is based around the christian concept and seeing as it has been a intergral part of our religion for a couple of thousand years i think we can lay claim to it being ours.

    and its just not for same sex people, if your a atheist why the hell are you getting married instead of having a civil service?? why would you want to have a wedding and get married in a church
  17. Sully John Eales (66)

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    A new thread for Gay Marriage discussion has been started here. All non rugby content in this thread will be deleted.
  18. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    damn their all out of order :p
  19. Sully John Eales (66)

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  20. southsider Arch Winning (36)

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    can you point me in the direction where anyone on here has argued the point that religious weddings are more meaningful or vice-versa totally moot point

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