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Mining and the Greens

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Scotty, Sep 14, 2010.

  1. The_Brown_Hornet Michael Lynagh (62)

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    It does bother me that all the press has been on the nuclear situation, as opposed to the devastation that actually has occurred. Watching Four Corners last night, I felt that more should have been made of that, rather than focusing on the reactor. The toll has been horrific.

    EDIT: Just found this.

    http://blog.xkcd.com/2011/03/19/radiation-chart/


    Yes, it's from XKCD, but stay with me here, the purpose is serious.
  2. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...s-of-mccarthyism/story-fn59niix-1226121472463

    The Greens are gaining power on the back of Labor's complete incompetence, and the lack of good options coming from the Liberals. We are in big trouble if this type of person ends up leading the country.

    When will socialists and communists realise that their system does not work? There have been plenty of examples of this in other countries, and the ones in power end up abusing it, while making everyone else do the work for them (see place like Vietnam for a good example of this). The haves are part of the ruling party, the have nots are screwed continually.
  3. cyclopath Phil Waugh (73)

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    The notion of a "wealth" tax worries me. Mainly because it seems to be an ill-defined concept. With our income tax system, high-earners pay more anyway, no problem with that, and the soon to be Carbon Tax is basically a new bracket of income tax, it seems. I'd love to know what Rhiannon means by taxing wealth. If I work hard, as I have, and end up in a pretty well paid job, as I have, and am able to help set up my family in the future, why should that be a bad thing? Or should my estate be taken back by the Commonwealth, so my kids can start from scratch? Why create a disincentive? If I thought the average politician could do anything with all that revenue, I'd be more confident, but more and more they seem to be financial vandals with no concept for future-proofing.
    This country is hardly under-taxed. They should focus more on using that revenue better, rather than reaming more from the populace.
  4. Ruggo Mark Ella (57)

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    She goes to far but I get what she is saying. Cycs post sums up the medium well in my view.

    While in this thread, it probably should be merged with the coal seam gas thread given the greens have been active in promoting farmland of mining for quite a while and this thread is about mining and the greens.
  5. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    I think she is actually talking about an estate tax (ie inheritance tax) rather than just an extra tax on wealthy (although with her background, I'm pretty sure wouldn't be against this either).

    So you work hard, invest smart, pay a high tax rate, plus lots of state taxes such as stamp duty on the way through plus large capital gains on anything you sell, but at the end you have done a good job and managed to leave some money for your family's future only for the government to take a big chunk of it so they can further grow said government.
  6. Cutter Nicholas Shehadie (39)

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    Socialism is an economic policy. Communism is a political system. I believe socialist policies (including provision of welfare, public healthcare, free education, public infrastructure and projects etc) have a place in a modern economy. I'm not a communist.

    Contrary to your point above, the countries with the highest standards of living are socialist democracies (the Nords).
  7. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    I too believe in those things, but socialism is a whole lot more than that, and socialism and social democracy are two very different things, but I'm pretty sure you already know that.
  8. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    PS You sure you aren't a politician, Cutter. A very small amount of research in the Norway's government shows that they are a 3 way coalition, only one of which is considered socialist. The other two are the Centre party and Labour Party.

    And do you have any statistics to prove that the standard of living in Norway has improved in the last 6 years?

    Edit: Short answer myself - Human Development Index (Norway's ratings)

    2010 1st
    2009 1st
    2008 2nd
    2007 2nd
    2006 1st
    2005 1st
    2004 1st
    2003 1st
    2002 1st
    2001 1st

    The current alliance won government at the end of 05. From 01 to 05 a centre right party was in power.
  9. antipodean Banned

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    I don't have a problem with an inheritance tax. As I said to my parents; it's your money, you worked for it, you enjoy it. If there is something left over and a transfer of wealth happens, why should it be exempt from taxation?

    The concept of democratic socialism is well ingrained in Norway. Labour was in power 'from 1945 to 1981, except for three periods (1963, 1965–71, and 1972–73)' (Source).
  10. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    Really?

  11. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    Because it has already been taxed, and will be taxed again with a little thing called capital gains tax.
  12. Ruggo Mark Ella (57)

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    I take it you are not a fan of the GST then?
  13. antipodean Banned

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    According to the source, yes. Nothing you quoted contradicts that. It's entirely possible for a political party to hold office for decades without ever going full term.

    It's a transfer of ownership; I have to pay a duty/ tax when purchasing property from other people, or my parents while they are alive, why shouldn't I have to do the same because they died? Serious question.
  14. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    Two points:

    1. Stamp duty was meant to be abolished when the GST was introduced. The states reneged.
    2. I'm not sure, but I suspect if it is a property (or car) transfer you will still have to pay stamp duty to transfer it into your name.
  15. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    You said this about Labor being in power there:

    Fact is they weren't form 2001-2005.
  16. antipodean Banned

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    1. Politicians renege on shit all the time.
    2. Death duties were abolished in Australia in 1979(?).

    From the ATO: There are no death duties in Australia; however, certain income or capital transactions that occur as a consequence of a person's death are taxed.

    Yes. So?
  17. Scotty David Codey (61)

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    Sorry misread your post. Missed the 1981 part.

    I think you missed my point in reaction to Cutter's post. A right leaning government was in power from 2001-05, all years where Norway was ranked no. 1.
  18. chief John Solomon (38)

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    I have a huge problem with Inheritance taxes. A lot of these funds are used to pay off University Tuition and a lot of other things. Sure some are just for money purposes. Money that has been taxed shouldn't really be taxed again in that manner, like sure I'm aware there are wholes in my argument like with the GST and numerous other taxes. But I think it is wrong to tax hard earned savings.
    Scotty likes this.
  19. Cutter Nicholas Shehadie (39)

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    That doesn't mean they don't have socialist policies.
  20. Cutter Nicholas Shehadie (39)

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    So how do we identify what are hard earned savings and which aren't?

    My thoughts are that a substantial threshold should be tax free and then after that it should be taxed relatively heavily. That way, your university tuition can be covered, maybe even part of your mortgage. However, if you're thinking about using it to buy your second investment property, boat or racehorse, then a chunk of that can be taxed.

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