NSW AAGPS 2021

[Joker]

Love your maths Badger.

How about this.
Since Australian Schoolboy teams were first created in 1973, here is the average contribution to the team (NOT Aus A etc) per year.

Cattle dogs- 2.34
Big cows- 1.29
Dark Empire- 1.09
Wolf pack 1.02
Newingwookie- 0.88
Shoremen- 0.52
Highway Men- 0.39
Highlanders- 0.16
No bloody Sense of humor- 0.11

 

[The Honey Badger]

I knew it started 1970 ish. so it would be 33 years to 2006.

The stats definitely change for some post 2006.

I miss being able to visit California

 

[The Honey Badger]

Hey Joker,

what happened to your Head Master?

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/nsw...unces-sudden-resignation-20201002-p561kb.html

 

[Balmain Subbies]

Hey Joker,

what happened to your Head Master?

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/nsw...unces-sudden-resignation-20201002-p561kb.html

Was going to ask the same thing. Seems a little too quick, not like Dr Lambert whom is in his 14 year I believe.

 

[Quick Hands]

I knew it started 1970 ish. so it would be 33 years to 2006.

The stats definitely change for some post 2006.

I miss being able to visit California

But you're talking a very small sample size and you're dealing in percentages and ratios, so it takes very little change to massively skew the statistics.

You could prove anything using these particular statistics depending on what you wanted to prove.

 

[Joker]

Was going to ask the same thing. Seems a little too quick, not like Dr Lambert whom is in his 14 year I believe.

Thanks lads. There is no official reason but through back channels I have heard it a combination of family issues and his health. Chris Hayes is a good man who came into the job with an acknowledged health issue. Joeys is not an easy place and I am sure running Australia largest boarding school during COVID has taken its physical and mental toll. There was no coup to oust him due to the rugby results.

Lambert though just keeps going on through the marvels of technology and hit squads against his enemies. Here he is sitting in his office.

 

[Quick Hands]

For example, in the period from the first Aust schools team in 1969 (not 1973) and carried your research into the 70s and 80s and early 90s you'd find that around 50% of the team came from state schools (sometimes more). This has fallen dramatically as the game has collapsed in the state school system and junior club competitions. Logic suggests that this will lead to an increase in boys from private schools making the team.

2006 also coincides with some fairly disastrous policies re juniors and schools from RA which have served to further concentrate rugby within the private schools system to the overall detriment of the game.

Interestingly, I reproduce the 1969 Australian Schoolboys team which toured South Africa.

Epping Boys - 5
Matraville - 1
Vaucluse Boys - 1
Hurlstone Ag - 2
Balgowlah Boys - 1
Brisbane High - 1
Scots - 3
Newington - 2
TAS - 2
Grammar - 1
Riverview -1
Shore - 1
Trinity 1
Barker - 1
Cranbrook - 1
Marist Ashgrove - 2

15 private v 11 state schools

EDIT: note 3 Scots and 2 Newington, but no Joeys or Kings.

7 Richard Allen Trinity Grammar School NSW
12 Robert Armstrong Epping Boys High School NSW
9 John Babister Sydney Grammar School NSW
6 Peter Bull Newington College NSW
12 Timothy Clementson Newington College NSW
4 Greg Cornelsen The Armidale School NSW
4 Alan Coutts Epping Boys High School NSW
15 Russell Fairfax Matraville High School NSW
1 Steven Finnane Vaucluse Boys High School NSW
8 Peter Fleming Marist College Ashgrove QLD
15 Peter Fosberg Epping Boys High School NSW
13 David Giles Hurlstone Ag High School NSW
5 Brian Hayward The Armidale School NSW
10 Jim Hindmarsh The Scots College NSW
2 Charlie Horder Shore School NSW
13 Malcolm Jack Balgowlah Boys High School NSW
11 Graham McPhail Brisbane State High School QLD
2 Sean Mooney Epping Boys High School NSW
5 Alistair Robinson Hurlstone Ag High School NSW10

(c) Peter Robinson Epping Boys High School NSW
14 Timothy Rowlands The Scots College NSW
3 Lou Slaughter The Scots College NSW
9 Andrew Strathopoulos Cranbrook School NSW
12 Ronald Taylor Barker College NSW
7 Timothy Wardle St Ignatius College NSW

 

[Kenny Powers]

I knew it started 1970 ish. so it would be 33 years to 2006.

The stats definitely change for some post 2006.

I miss being able to visit California

Unfortunately it has become part of the NRL Development Pathway for many. At least with Russel Fairfax we got some tests out of him before he went to league.

Would be good to see the ARU stand up for kids who will play rugby post school and not the carpet baggers that appear in rugby because of schools they get to attend.

 

[Quick Hands]

Unfortunately it has become part of the NRL Development Pathway for many. At least with Russel Fairfax we got some tests out of him before he went to league.

Would be good to see the ARU stand up for kids who will play rugby post school and not the carpet baggers that appear in rugby because of schools they get to attend.

The best way that RA ans NSWRU could stand up for kids who want to play rugby is to reinvigorate their own junior pathways and competitions, which in turn has a flow on effect into the state system, which means that the majority of aspirational kids aren't funnelled into the private school system.

 

[Kenny Powers]

The best way that RA ans NSWRU could stand up for kids who want to play rugby is to reinvigorate their own junior pathways and competitions, which in turn has a flow on effect into the state system, which means that the majority of aspirational kids aren't funnelled into the private school system.

I think it has to be appreciated that aspirational kids are trying to make a living from professional rugby league or rugby union, no problem with that. However I think there needs to be an appreciation of a basic business principle. In my employment if I sign with a competitor for a new job I will be walked from the premises with immediate effect.

Kids that sign with a rugby league club that’s the end of their involvement in rugby unions pathways. It’s a business decision and welcome to the world of professional sport.

Yes we have had players return from league Tom Wright,Tepai Morea but do you really think if they don’t make it in league they will take an office or regular job on preference to having a crack at union because rugby cut them off when they signed with league? It’s the way the business world works and they will learn that pretty quick post school.

To be honest looking at some of the league stars in the GPS one didn’t play for his school and another I watched had defence so poor I can only conclude it was a commitment issue to school rugby. Maybe it might bring a new reality to some schools that they run second to a rugby league club, the boys they play with know it just the adults need to come to that realisation.

Appreciate it will be an unpopular opinion but for rugby to succeed it can’t be league’s bitch!

 

[Titch]

I would like to share my stats to date:

Aust Schoolboys (1969-2019) excluding Australian A / Barbarians

Joeys 96 (45 Wallabies)
Kings 42 (27)
Scots 39 (23)
View 31 (10)
New 29 (26)
Shore 18 (18)
High 16 (21)
Grammar 4 (31) the last schoolboy rep in 2005

Total CAS schoolboys reps 87 (Barker 13, Cranbrook 13, Knox 18, Aloysius 3, Trinity 13, Waverley 27)

Other interesting stats outside of Sydney who has ranked 2nd and 3rd
Nudgee College (Joeys equivalent in Brisbane GPS) 68
Eddies (ACT) 62

Keep in mind there are players such as Harry Jones represented Aust schoolboys from 2 different schools (Kings and Barker). In all 13 dual school rep players but 12 are not from Sydney GPS

One thing for sure, it'll be long time before any schools to pass Joeys either the schoolboys level or the Wallabies!

 

[Quick Hands]

I haven't posted here for years. I've read a fair bit of dribble. Do you guys realise the ARU provides zero funding to GPS schools? If a kid attends a GPS school and their parents pay full freight, even if they don't, that kid has the right to play whatever code they like.
I even had a parent say to my face that kids signed with an NRL club shouldn't be taking the place of another kid in a school 1st XV. That had to be the craziest thing I've heard.

I agree

 

[The Honey Badger]

I haven't posted here for years. I've read a fair bit of dribble. Do you guys realise the ARU provides zero funding to GPS schools? If a kid attends a GPS school and their parents pay full freight, even if they don't, that kid has the right to play whatever code they like.
I even had a parent say to my face that kids signed with an NRL club shouldn't be taking the place of another kid in a school 1st XV. That had to be the craziest thing I've heard.

Not that crazy and not that unusual.

wasn't long ago there was a group of parents at Scots called 'Friends of Scots rugby'. set up to lobby the school to stop the anomalies that turned up in the 1st XV.

I sure as hell wouldn't like a mercenary displacing my son in a 1st XV at a school costing $35k a year

 

[Quick Hands]

Hey Joker,

what happened to your Head Master?

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/nsw...unces-sudden-resignation-20201002-p561kb.html

I understand that it's a serious health issue which requires immediate and ongoing treatment. I wish him well.

 

[Quick Hands]

I would like to share my stats to date:

Aust Schoolboys (1969-2019) excluding Australian A / Barbarians

Joeys 96 (45 Wallabies)
Kings 42 (27)
Scots 39 (23)
View 31 (10)
New 29 (26)
Shore 18 (18)
High 16 (21)
Grammar 4 (31) the last schoolboy rep in 2005

Total CAS schoolboys reps 87 (Barker 13, Cranbrook 13, Knox 18, Aloysius 3, Trinity 13, Waverley 27)

Other interesting stats outside of Sydney who has ranked 2nd and 3rd
Nudgee College (Joeys equivalent in Brisbane GPS) 68
Eddies (ACT) 62

Keep in mind there are players such as Harry Jones represented Aust schoolboys from 2 different schools (Kings and Barker). In all 13 dual school rep players but 12 are not from Sydney GPS

One thing for sure, it'll be long time before any schools to pass Joeys either the schoolboys level or the Wallabies!

Interesting statistics.

Interesting that the schools who produce fewer Australian schoolboys have a much higher percentage go on to become Wallabies.

Joeys 46%
Kings 64%
Scots 58%
View 32%
New 89%
Shore 100%
High 131%
Grammar 775%

Grammar is a statistical anomaly - I presume that most of their Wallabies came pre 1969.

 

[Up the Guts]

How are you getting a proportion of schoolboys who become Wallabies of over 100%?

 

[The Honey Badger]

I would like to share my stats to date:

Aust Schoolboys (1969-2019) excluding Australian A / Barbarians

Joeys 96 (45 Wallabies)
Kings 42 (27)
Scots 39 (23)
View 31 (10)
New 29 (26)
Shore 18 (18)
High 16 (21)
Grammar 4 (31) the last schoolboy rep in 2005

Total CAS schoolboys reps 87 (Barker 13, Cranbrook 13, Knox 18, Aloysius 3, Trinity 13, Waverley 27)

Other interesting stats outside of Sydney who has ranked 2nd and 3rd
Nudgee College (Joeys equivalent in Brisbane GPS) 68
Eddies (ACT) 62

Keep in mind there are players such as Harry Jones represented Aust schoolboys from 2 different schools (Kings and Barker). In all 13 dual school rep players but 12 are not from Sydney GPS

One thing for sure, it'll be long time before any schools to pass Joeys either the schoolboys level or the Wallabies!

Where did you get the school Wallaby figures from?

It was only a couple of years ago that Shore didnt have a full and complete list of boys that had gone on to be Wallabies. I think they were celebrating all the wallabies at an Old boys dinner and it became apparent the School list was very deficient.

Obviously all ancient history ones, as the modern history ones are fewer in number

 

[Quick Hands]

How are you getting a proportion of schoolboys who become Wallabies of over 100%?

If a boy doesn't get picked for Aust schoolboys but nevertheless goes on to become a Wallaby, he doesn't figure in the schoolboys number. For example NFJ and Phil Kearns only played 2nds at Newington and didn't play in any schoolboy rep teams but became Wallabies.

I didn't provide the original statistics, but I presume that the list of Wallabies goes back to the 19th century, whereas the schoolboys stats would only begin in 1969.

As I always say, statistics don't necessarily provide the answers and are often beguiling.

 

[Up the Guts]

If a boy doesn't get picked for Aust schoolboys but nevertheless goes on to become a Wallaby, he doesn't figure in the schoolboys number. For example NFJ and Phil Kearns only played 2nds at Newington and didn't play in any schoolboy rep teams but became Wallabies.

I didn't provide the original statistics, but I presume that the list of Wallabies goes back to the 19th century, whereas the schoolboys stats would only begin in 1969.

As I always say, statistics don't necessarily provide the answers and are often beguiling.

I see, I originally thought it was a conversion from schoolboys to Wallabies but it’s total players who become Wallabies.

 

[Balmain Subbies]

Found this little gem gentlemen. Enjoy