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Occupy Movement

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mark_s

Chilla Wilson (44)
I would like to go back to the orignal cause. IMO, the architects of the 2008 GFC (both US and european bankers) have got off far too light. Most New York bankers (and my best mate is one of them) had one year of bad bonuses and then its game on again despite the US, european and many other countries having a generation of debt as the hangover.
 

Cutter

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Without being glib, join the protesters if that is the case. However, as far as I'm concerned, the cause is irrelevant to the key point of this thread.

The concern I have is that our governments (acting through the police), who are appointed to serve the people, appear to have a policy of clamping down on dissenting voices in a threatening and disproportionately forceful way. That issue has escaped coverage in the media.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Cutter, can you provide some proof that this police response was out of line with similar styles of protest?
 

Cutter

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Evidence - not that could be relied on in court Scotty. That's why I've said it appears etc. I also said at the start that I've not been involved so I can only base it on what I've read.

However, here is a good example of a disproportionate response. 50-100 police and riot squad officers to evict 5 squatters with between 40-60 unarmed protesters nearby. And why do it at night? Why not send in half a dozen, move people on and lock it up when they're out and about during the day?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-11-...ccupy-sydney-raid-arrests/3654576?section=nsw

Police defend Occupy Sydney raid force
Updated November 09, 2011 20:16:26


VIDEO: Occupy Sydney members arrested for trespassing (7pm TV News NSW)
RELATED STORY: Riot police evict Occupy Sydney protestersRELATED STORY: Occupy group plans legal action over evictionRELATED STORY: Three charged over Occupy Sydney protestRELATED STORY: Another veteran hurt in Occupy protest clash
MAP: Sydney 2000
Police have rejected claims they used excessive force, after at least 50 officers removed five Occupy Sydney protesters from a building last night.

The activists had broken into a vacant seven-storey building on Clarence Street and barricaded themselves in.

The group said they were highlighting the high cost of housing and rent in Sydney, and had been living in the building for about a week.

In response scores of police were dispatched, including officers from the riot, bomb disposal and dog squads.

They tore down the barricades about 9:30pm (AEDT) and arrested a 27-year-old woman and four men aged between 22 and 44.

All are expected to be charged with trespass.

A larger group of about 40 supporters also gathered outside the building.

"Occupiers we love you, don't let them push and shove you," the group chanted.

Police also moved that group on, arresting one man for failing to comply with a police direction.

Activist Larissa was among those critical of how police dealt with the situation.

"It was an over the top, unnecessary use of force for something that was quite small," she said.

"I mean there were five homeless people squatting in a building and half of bloody Sydney's riot squad were brought out.

"I don't understand, just as a citizen, why that amount of force was necessary."

There were estimates last night that 100 police were called in for the operation.

But Superintendent Gary O'Dell says 50 officers were involved.

"This was a seven-storey building. We need to plan our response and be able to deal with whatever we come across in the building," Superintendent O'Dell said.

"Certainly our information was that there could be up to 30 protesters, so we were planning for those sort of numbers.

"There was no heavy handedness. Once we got inside the building the offenders were arrested without any of resistance."

Police say they attempted to talk with the protesters but they refused to negotiate.

Last night was the latest in a series of clashes between Occupy Sydney protesters and police.

Three men were arrested after a march through central Sydney last weekend.

Activists were also forcibly evicted last month from Martin Place, where they had been holding a week-long protest.

This one written by someone who was at Hyde Park after the march and who articulates my thoughts (better than me).

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...-to-protest-20111106-1n1vk.html#ixzz1dXA6JoQG
Occupy the mind with right to protest
Michael Koziol
November 7, 2011
I love money far too much to hold a great deal of sympathy for the Occupy movement. I want it - lots of it - and would happily earn it as a greedy chief executive.

But I also want, and indeed cherish, a set of freedoms currently being tested by this motley protest group. We may have the right to movement, speech and assembly, but apparently they can be denied if you try to exercise them all at once.

I attended much of Saturday's rally and subsequent "occupation" of Hyde Park as a reporter. I use inverted commas because, although the group have coined that term, it is hardly descriptive of what they are doing. We are talking about 50-100 people sitting and talking in one small corner of a very large public park.

Advertisement: Story continues below
The protesters who assembled outside the Reserve Bank building after the rally collectively decided to move on to Hyde Park rather than be forcibly removed from Martin Place, again. In addition to the park being more public, more comfortable, and shadier, they figured it was also a more diplomatic spot which would present fewer concerns for police.

It only took until about 5.30pm for police to conduct their first raid, with several arrests made and at least one person violently manhandled and dragged away by officers, footage of which was posted online.

When I arrived back at the scene about 7pm, 23 armed police stood in a sinister line-up along the main boulevard, all eyes on the occupiers. At least 20 more were gathered further back. Police were filming using hand-held cameras and demanded that large banners obscuring their shot be removed. Protesters did not comply. A little later someone was arrested for using the word f---.

So this is what it has come to: the NSW police prepared, perhaps ordered, to employ rarely-used laws against swearing or loitering in order to shut down a political protest.

The police must know they are wasting their time ''protecting'' us from an imaginary threat. On Saturday dozens of officers stood around aimlessly for 10 hours guarding a peaceful assembly, all the while not policing serious crime. If there was antagonism between occupiers and police, it was a direct result of the standover tactics of the latter.

Earlier this year at the opening night of the Sydney Festival I witnessed police "move-on" a busker from the corner of Market and Elizabeth streets. The officers then ruthlessly dispersed the crowd of about 20, arresting a woman who refused to move. She screamed as they dragged her away.

The predominant argument against Occupy is that their message is vague and their demands unknown. This is only partly true. Speaking to demonstrators on Saturday, it was clear that the movement has welcomed people with a range of grievances, including the Northern Territory intervention, treatment of refugees, and war. But at its core, the group shares a primary concern about income inequality and corporate greed.

Moreover, it doesn't matter how badly phrased or incoherent their objectives are, because that's not the basis of legitimacy. Are we suggesting that a protest is only legitimate if it pertains to a single government policy? Or if a group is professionally organised? Or if the speakers command a certain level of English?

Other critics suggest that the occupiers have had "enough time" to get their point across. But if we believe these freedoms to be inalienable and absolute, then it is unthinkable to impose a time limit on them. The cognitive dissonance of this position should be enough to force a rethink.

Finally there is the matter of civic disruption. Saturday's rally was only given permission to proceed because they agreed to change course to avoid congestion at Wynyard and a wedding at Sydney Town Hall. The mild inconvenience of a few citizens should not take precedence over the rights of political protesters.

Let us not pretend that the state cared so much about this wedding that they took the case to the Supreme Court: they simply seized on an excuse to try and prevent the rally occurring in the first place.

The group will now attempt to occupy a small portion of Hyde Park, even after they were moved on by police at 2am on Sunday. By all means condemn their politics as naive and wrong. But we should defend with unrelenting certainty their right to be there.

Michael Koziol is studying media at the University of Sydney.

And the first one...another dawn raid with 100 police not to mention 400 police in Melbourne. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-10-23/occupy-sydney-protesters-vow-to-return/3596192/?site=sydney

Occupy Sydney protesters vow to return
Updated October 24, 2011 02:27:27
The Occupy Sydney protest started last week as part of the worldwide movement that began in New York.

Occupy Sydney protesters have vowed to return to Martin Place in the CBD after being forcibly evicted by police.
In a dawn raid on Sunday, more than 100 police forcibly removed about 80 people involved in the week long sit-in protest against corporate greed.
Police and the New South Wales Government defended the use of force, which protesters described as excessive, but Lord Mayor Clover Moore said she was "concerned" about reports of violence.
"The city respects the right of people to protest," she said in a release on Sunday.
"The city was not informed ... nor gave any direction to the police to act against the protesters early this morning."
Protester Elsie Kennedy says the group will maintain a presence in Martin Place, but not in the form of a sit-in protest.
"The reason that we're not going back into the occupation of Martin Place immediately is that we want to strengthen our movement," she said.
"We want to take the time to strengthen our movement; we want to take the time to do outreach to the suburbs, do outreach to unions, do outreach to other organisations."
Assistant Police Commissioner Mark Murdoch says protesters resisted requests to leave and police used a necessary level of force in response.
"My officers conducted themselves with the utmost professionalism," he said.
"If some people had their arms bent behind their backs, I make no apology for that - absolutely none.
"It was to ensure compliance in their own personal safety and the safety of my police."
But protester Susan Price maintains the police actions were over the top.
"I personally witnessed protesters who had the knees of police officers pushed into their necks and their faces were on the ground ... their noses were bloodied," she said.
'Acted responsibly'
Premier Barry O'Farrell defended police, saying "I think police have acted lawfully".
"They've acted in the interests of the public and have acted responsibly," he said.
Police arrested 40 people but most were released with on the spot fines.
Meanwhile, the Lord Mayor denied there were council laws preventing the protesters from camping.
"These (laws) have not technically existed in NSW since the introduction of the 1993 Local Government Act," Ms Moore said.
"The police chose to enforce signage in Martin Place that prohibits camping."
Ms Moore said the Local Government Act, which gave police authority to intervene, is managed by the State Government.
The Occupy Sydney protest started last week as part of the worldwide movement which began in New York against what protesters describe as corporate greed.
Meanwhile, Victorian Premier Ted Baillieu has praised police for their actions during the Occupy Melbourne protest.
Violence erupted on Friday when about 400 police evicted demonstrators who had been camping in the city square for nearly a week.
ABC/AAP

So, no evidence, but I'd be surprised if you could disagree this is heavy handed.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Depends on your definition of heavy handed. It certainly appears there are way more police involved than needed to be, but I don't see any evidence of overly physical force used? In fact the second article seems to suggest that the police are in line with their previous modus operandi when moving people on:

Earlier this year at the opening night of the Sydney Festival I witnessed police "move-on" a busker from the corner of Market and Elizabeth streets. The officers then ruthlessly dispersed the crowd of about 20, arresting a woman who refused to move. She screamed as they dragged her away.

So maybe the question is on overall police tactics, and not just this occupy movement?

On another note I thought you started the thread to highlight an area that was missed in the media, but you have just linked 3 articles from msm sources about it?
 

Cutter

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
And as the New York protest is moved on in another night time raid...

For those who said they weren't sure what the point of the Occupy protest is:

[video=vimeo;31489386]http://vimeo.com/31489386[/video]
 
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