Reds 2017

[Forcefield]

Was it, really?

 

[TOCC]

In my opinion yes, and I've been saying it since February last year


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[amirite]

Whilst I think Hodge has an excellent collection of skills, there's no reason he's a 12 long term for Australia. Partly because he hasn't entrenched himself there yet, and party because as a good defender, with a cannon boot, he could just as easily play 15 or even that special 2nd-fullback/winger role reserved for guys like CJ and Daly.

Step up Duncan! Be the 12 that can set guys outside you alight while being a threat yourself!

 

[TSR]

i want to see the kid do well - but let's wait until he's played at least a few super rugby games before we start measuring him up for gold.

 

[Joe Blow]

It's a great looking squad. Hope they pull it together and challenge.
GS will add a lot at 7. The tight 5 is very solid and the backs should match it with most.
Higgers at 8 with Tui at 6 will give balance to the back row

 

[Getwithme]

The bench will provide a big difference for the reds this year. Too often in the recent past the bench for all provincial Australian sides don't actually keep the side going or boost their performance. I can see that actually hoping though with the reds. The depth is quite impressive.

 

[Simon.]

I'm curious to see how GS goes. Houston was very successful in England and a cult hero with numerous MOTM performances, and from what I can tell basically just a wrecking ball at 8. But he came back here and didn't make much impact at the end of last season, and over the off season has slimmed down a lot which seems to be an admission that the game is different here, and they are emphasising mobility and fitness over bulk.

Smith is 36 and probably going to find it similar to Houston in terms of the contrast between English club rugby and Super Rugby. He's a class player though, even Houston's record doesn't come close to Smith's in the UK, so I hope the difference isn't as noticeable!

 

[Simon.]

The bench will provide a big difference for the reds this year. Too often in the recent past the bench for all provincial Australian sides don't actually keep the side going or boost their performance. I can see that actually hoping though with the reds. The depth is quite impressive.

Very true. Last season the Reds were actually in the game up until 60 minutes a whole bunch of times and then the benches came on and the Reds ended up getting flogged.

 

[Scoey]

I'm curious to see how GS goes. Houston was very successful in England and a cult hero with numerous MOTM performances, and from what I can tell basically just a wrecking ball at 8. But he came back here and didn't make much impact at the end of last season, and over the off season has slimmed down a lot which seems to be an admission that the game is different here, and they are emphasising mobility and fitness over bulk.

Smith is 36 and probably going to find it similar to Houston in terms of the contrast between English club rugby and Super Rugby. He's a class player though, even Houston's record doesn't come close to Smith's in the UK, so I hope the difference isn't as noticeable!

Probably the key difference in my eyes at least between Houston and Smith is the role they play. Houston's is ball running first and foremost and in a higher standard of competition he is going to find is more difficult to make the same impact. George's strength has always been his technical ability and game awareness/timing. I think this will be less impacted by his return to Super Rugby. Possibly to a degree yes, but it won't be as big an issue as it is to Leroy. Just my 2c though.

 

[Happy to Chat]

It is rather nice to have this problem though. Good options.


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[dru]

i want to see the kid do well - but let's wait until he's played at least a few super rugby games before we start measuring him up for gold.

Ah geez. It's February. Nothing wrong with letting the kid know he's already got some fans! OK WB talk could lead to excessive expectations, but hell.

I'm really looking forward to DP this year, wasn't sure he'd get a starting role - still not sure, but if I'm reading Stiles right, ya just don't know.

Make it a huge year, Duncan.

 

[Hawko]

We have a tough draw. Sharks at home is a good start first up, Force in Perth we will need to win but they seem to have our measure more often than not. Crusaders at home in R3 needs to be a win (hoping for the traditional slow start from them) because we then have the Lions away and Jaguares away after that. We then come back home to face the defending champs at Suncorp after travelling around the globe. We take on the Brumbies in Canberra and round out with the Kings at home before our first bye in R9.

Lets just look at this "tough" draw. The two best NZ teams you have at home. You play 3 NZ teams away. You should win 2 from 5 and only the Hurricanes game looks a write-off. Reasonable expectation would be 2 NZ wins but 3 would be very possible. Five easy conference games. The team you must beat to win the conference you play only once. AT HOME. After a bye. Realistically if you lose more than four then your team has seriously underperformed. Nine Wallabies plus Hunt in the top 15.

I'll go first. I expect us to be top 2 in the Aus conference. I expect us to be close to the playoffs if we don't make them. Sure I hope we top the conference and comp but I'm not an idiot. Aus (and all non-NZ) teams were so far off the mark set by Kiwi teams last year that whilst yes, we should do well against non kiwi teams, there may still be a big gap between us and them at the pointy end of the season.

The Waratahs will have to play out of their skins for you to not top the conference. If you line up the top 15 players on both sides you'll see a team of established players vs a team of developing players. Only one Waratah player is clearly better than their opponents (Kepu).

I would expect that based on these alone, I can see us losing as many as we win (or thereabouts), which I guess would put us mid table or a bit below.

If the reds can just end up winning most of their home games, I'll be happy. I don't expect us to make finals, but I just enjoy a good game of rugby played live.

This post totally disregards the quality of the Reds squad. Ten Wallabies, seven of whom have got 20+ caps. (Maybe 6, I don't think Kerevi has that many but he's an absolute gun!) If you end up 7/8 or 8/7 then Stiles should be fired immediately.

 

[TOCC]

Lets just look at this "tough" draw. The two best NZ teams you have at home. You play 3 NZ teams away. You should win 2 from 5 and only the Hurricanes game looks a write-off. Reasonable expectation would be 2 NZ wins but 3 would be very possible. Five easy conference games. The team you must beat to win the conference you play only once. AT HOME. After a bye. Realistically if you lose more than four then your team has seriously underperformed. Nine Wallabies plus Hunt in the top 15.



The Waratahs will have to play out of their skins for you to not top the conference. If you line up the top 15 players on both sides you'll see a team of established players vs a team of developing players. Only one Waratah player is clearly better than their opponents (Kepu).





This post totally disregards the quality of the Reds squad. Ten Wallabies, seven of whom have got 20+ caps. (Maybe 6, I don't think Kerevi has that many but he's an absolute gun!) If you end up 7/8 or 8/7 then Stiles should be fired immediately.

Waratahs are still the favourites for the Aussie conference based on the quality of their squad, coaching continuity and key Wallabies; Folau, Foley, Hooper and Kepu.

Tahs have 12 players with international experience, and then Kellaway and Dempsey who went on EOYT.

 

[Scrubber2050]

The thing with George is the age of his legs. Great exponents of the game.

Super rugby is super quick on fields probably a little harder and in temperature's a little higher.

Can only imagine that whatever time GS gets on the paddock will be quality (and probably not quantity minutes)

 

[Hawko]

Waratahs are still the favourites for the Aussie conference based on the quality of their squad, coaching continuity and key Wallabies; Folau, Foley, Hooper and Kepu.

We have Folau, you have Kerevi. We have Foley, you have Cooper. We have Hooper, you have Smith. Only Kepu stands alone.

You have Slipper/Moore, we have Robertson/Latu. You have Simmons/Douglas, we have Mumm/Skelton. Backrows are roughly equal. Which pack is stronger? In 2018/2019 I expect the order to reverse but in 2017 the Reds pack is way stronger.

 

[Braveheart81]

You're not being a proper Waratahs fan Hawko if you don't claim February champion status.

Let the other teams fight for the underdog tag and save your excuses for later in the season when we'll almost certainly need them*.

* not saying we won't have a good season but we've needed the excuses every year except 2014.

 

[Hawko]

You're not being a proper Waratahs fan Hawko if you don't claim February champion status.

I am a realist, based on all those years when we had it won in January only to have lost it by February. 2014 was such a surprise that I could barely believe it happened. I was still sitting in my seat ten minutes after the game, absolutely gobsmacked that we had won.

Realistically though, the attempt by QLDers to try to claim underdog status with the squad they've got is just unreal. Donald Trump unreal.

 

[Twoilms]

This post totally disregards the quality of the Reds squad. Ten Wallabies, seven of whom have got 20+ caps. (Maybe 6, I don't think Kerevi has that many but he's an absolute gun!) If you end up 7/8 or 8/7 then Stiles should be fired immediately.

Keep in mind 4 of those 7 highly capped Wallabies are Simmons and Douglas who are both well out of form (and since dropped as starters from the Wallabies), Moore who admittedly picked up his otherwise horrendous form in the EOYT and i assume you are including George Smith who is nearing 40.

Edit: Mid-table from near wooden-spooners is probably reasonable progress.

 

[TOCC]

We have Folau, you have Kerevi. We have Foley, you have Cooper. We have Hooper, you have Smith. Only Kepu stands alone.

You have Slipper/Moore, we have Robertson/Latu. You have Simmons/Douglas, we have Mumm/Skelton. Backrows are roughly equal. Which pack is stronger? In 2018/2019 I expect the order to reverse but in 2017 the Reds pack is way stronger.

Foley, Folau, Kepu and Hooper are first picked for the Wallabies.. Cooper, Smith and even Kerevi aren't..

Tahs have an established coaching structure with Super Rugby and Wallaby experience, Reds have a brand new team with little experience at Super Rugby level..

 

[TOCC]

Realistically though, the attempt by QLDers to try to claim underdog status with the squad they've got is just unreal. Donald Trump unreal.

Right.. and all of this has nothing with you trying to claim the Tahs underdog status?