Imitation is the best form of flattery isn't it?
School sporting scholarships/recruitment
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Craig Time
Frank Row (1)
If the athlete's academics are falling behind because of sports, it is a problem. However, taking away talent based scholarships so that someone may be afforded a chance to better their education and enjoy playing the sport they love is wrong. We should be reforming the way we award the scholarships, not taking them away.
I like to watch
David Codey (61)
It's not automatic that they are fact getting a better education.
Some do make the best of the better facilities/support on offer.
Many do not.
Also many are not actually playing the sport they love,they already have contracts in another code when they are drafted.
Some do make the best of the better facilities/support on offer.
Many do not.
Also many are not actually playing the sport they love,they already have contracts in another code when they are drafted.
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
According to the code of practice "talent based scholarships" don't exist, have never existed and member schools have committed publicly and in writing to that as recently as 2013.(I presume you mean ones based on sporting talent)
As they have never existed, nothing is being taken away.
behindtheshed
Billy Sheehan (19)
Years ago I knew of a fairly loosely-organised program at a Sydney private school where a family could volunteer to discreetly pay the fees for another child in addition to their own. It was not a bursary scheme as such, and it was devised for entirely decent, charitable reasons - so a student could continue at school despite a sudden change in circumstance like family breakdown or job loss. I knew a family who paid the fees of other kids for years: they were financially comfortable, loved the school and had only their last one going through. They wanted to give back. They never knew who those students were who they supported; the students never knew them. Some may never have been aware that their own parents weren't footing the bill. A really commendable deed.
My point is this: no matter how closely "scholarships" and "bursaries" are scrutinised, there are still ways around it. You can't insult people by asking to see their banking records so no-one can know who paid any boy's fees. Secretly anyone could pay. The off-the-books bursaries (devised for all the right reasons originally) could so easily be corrupted and no-one would ever know. It's difficult to get around privacy laws regarding children even if you teach them, so there's no way that kind of information would ever come out.
You could, however, have a record of when a family approached a school; or whether the family approached the school at all. Their application (with date) could be required by AAGPS to prove that the kid was not recruited/cold-called. It's the recruiting that is so immoral. There's no problem with a Year 9 boy having a long-standing application in to attend a GPS school in Year 10, doing the interview and receiving a scholarship or bursary; and when he arrives at that school, trialling for sport like everyone else. Why shouldn't he play in the A's if he has the ability? He wouldn't be excluded from an A class or from the top level band if he's good. Therefore having restrictions on the number of boys on scholarships playing in the Firsts is not the answer, nor is there much value in detailing their playing history. It's hardly the boy's fault anyway. It's the recruiter who should be answerable.
My point is this: no matter how closely "scholarships" and "bursaries" are scrutinised, there are still ways around it. You can't insult people by asking to see their banking records so no-one can know who paid any boy's fees. Secretly anyone could pay. The off-the-books bursaries (devised for all the right reasons originally) could so easily be corrupted and no-one would ever know. It's difficult to get around privacy laws regarding children even if you teach them, so there's no way that kind of information would ever come out.
You could, however, have a record of when a family approached a school; or whether the family approached the school at all. Their application (with date) could be required by AAGPS to prove that the kid was not recruited/cold-called. It's the recruiting that is so immoral. There's no problem with a Year 9 boy having a long-standing application in to attend a GPS school in Year 10, doing the interview and receiving a scholarship or bursary; and when he arrives at that school, trialling for sport like everyone else. Why shouldn't he play in the A's if he has the ability? He wouldn't be excluded from an A class or from the top level band if he's good. Therefore having restrictions on the number of boys on scholarships playing in the Firsts is not the answer, nor is there much value in detailing their playing history. It's hardly the boy's fault anyway. It's the recruiter who should be answerable.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
Spot on.
Recruiting young sporting talent and offering financial inducements to attend a GPS school seems to be happening earlier and earlier in the age groups. It's not just the Year 9-10-11 entrants who are on bursaries etc: Year 6 is the new target group, entering the school in Yr 7.
That puts pressure on the recruiter - will the boy still be a super star in Yrs 10-12 after so much money has been spent on him?
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
The system can only work based on trust.
That's the problem with breaching the trust.
Brainstrust
Watty Friend (18)
Bursaries and Scholarships are very different things. Bursaries are generally provided to students who come from backgrounds of social and financial hardship are are given to provide a better opportunity in life for those lucky enough to receive it. Scholarships are generally awarded to children who show excellence in various pursuits from academic to music to sport etc. there will always be cases of children starting late, and in many cases that is totally acceptable as many families can't meet 6 years of fees but want to give their kids that opportunity to finish their schooling. The real test for the genuine nature of a schools bursary program is simply to look at what % of bursary students are playing A level sport. A normal distribution of students may be 5-10% of students are A quality sportsmen. So simply if a school has a variance way outside the normal dustribution then regardless of the financial position of those families receiving assistance, it would be fair to say that the schools intent for awarding those packages is not in the spirit of the associations objectives. It is totally reasonable for a bursary student to be a good sportsman, providing its within the norm then no issues.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
An amusing comment during the Fox telecast of Rays v Stars NRC game: while doing a profile of Stars centre Jim Stewart, they mention he "is a product of The Scots College High Performance Unit".
Another pathway to Gold?
Another pathway to Gold?
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
Just a pathway to world domination
.Maybe he was one of those "talented sportsmen" mentioned by Dr Donaldson?
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
Just a pathway to world domination
Maybe he was one of those "talented sportsmen" mentioned by Dr Donaldson?
A top young man who went to Scots from (I think) St Augustines and did pathways. Hope he goes far.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
A good case study for we commentators to separate schools' actions from the individuals.
Correct - we should never criticise the individual, nor the family, for being involved in the process.
From their viewpoint, it is what it is - a splendid opportunity (or a better opportunity in this case).
From the point of view of the schools, it is what it is also, but it is a view that some in certain schools' associations seek to hide from, or disguise to, others.
.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Regular readers will detect the subtlety, if not the ambiguity
Brian Westlake
Arch Winning (36)
Or the irony?
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Well I suppose the fact it took a week means that the irony was subtle.
Man have i heard some stuff on the subject of this thread over the last week - rugby union clubs paying schools fees;
- 8 boys from the NSWPSSA side (only one of whom knew where Bellevue Hill is) going to a school in Sydney's east;
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
Just to finish off from your pause at the semi colon:
; A Brumbies Junior Academy player moving to Scots very soon, going into Year 10.
Totally unsubstantiated conjecture at the moment, but I'll keep my ears to the ground for emerging facts.
Brian Westlake
Arch Winning (36)
I have been trying to stay away from all the frivolities occurring at the moment, but yes Mr Shoulder, it was subtle, well aimed and still remained ambiguous.
I think I might take up Stand Up Paddle boarding this Summer to keep me away from all of this
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