The Transition from Schoolboy Rugby to Colts - Is there a better way?

[forwards4ever]

Maybe they'll have to go and find kids who don't go to private schools? Maybe they'll have to spend time promoting rugby in the state schools in their area (from Year 7 upwards) - I'd like to see that!

There's 1 state school in the Easts catchment area! Good luck with that!

 

[I like to watch]

There are also plenty of private School boys that are still U18 the year out of School.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

I had a trawl across the various Shute Shield Club websites over the weekend for pre-season colts information.

Only Sydney University and Eastwood had anything posted about 2015 season.

The Hobbits site was down for maintenance, but there was apparently some information on that website previously and on their facebook pages.

Pirates have made a post today about thier 2015 Club Information night.

Another poster has stated that Gordon had an information session yesterday.

Things are clearly underway for 2015 but it is a little ad-hoc at the moment.

Best to chase up the Clubs personally via the contact details on their web sites and facebook pages if you haven't received your personal invitation yet.

 

[Quick Hands]

There's 1 state school in the Easts catchment area! Good luck with that!

There are also private schools which don't play Saturday sport and maybe there are boys in Easts area who live in the area but go to state or catholic schools nearby?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

There's 1 state school in the Easts catchment area! Good luck with that!

Do what the other clubs do, and look outside the "traditional catchment areas". This methodology appears to work reasonably successfully with a few clubs in the Juniors, particularly in 14A, 15A, and 16A's, as well Colts.

Do a count up of Colts players matched up with their Junior Club or location of their High School attended, and there is often a rather large proportion of players from outside the Club "catchment" area. Some clubs rely on this more than others.

 

[Quick Hands]

Do what the other clubs do, and look outside the "traditional catchment areas". This methodology appears to work reasonably successfully with a few clubs in the Juniors, particularly in 14A, 15A, and 16A's, as well Colts.

Do a count up of Colts players matched up with their Junior Club or location of their High School attended, and there is often a rather large proportion of players from outside the Club "catchment" area. Some clubs rely on this more than others.

One thing for certain, there are kids out there, but they need to be brought in way before 18 years of age. At the risk of being accused of bashing private schools, this shows (again) the folly of the way junior rugby is structured across Sydney. It removes the incentive for clubs to get out and recruit at 13 and 14 because their teams are full of private school boys. No-one said that it was easy, but it's a hell of a lot easier recruiting 13 year olds than it is recruiting 17 year olds.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

A very funny thing sometimes happens with the out of district boys in certain 14A and 15A teams.

They sometimes find themselves no longer playing SJRU footy and also start attending schools well "out of district" for the 16's and Open XV schoolboy footy, and they start getting talked about on the Hotel California Thread.

 

[Brainstrust]

One thing for certain, there are kids out there, but they need to be brought in way before 18 years of age. At the risk of being accused of bashing private schools, this shows (again) the folly of the way junior rugby is structured across Sydney. It removes the incentive for clubs to get out and recruit at 13 and 14 because their teams are full of private school boys. No-one said that it was easy, but it's a hell of a lot easier recruiting 13 year olds than it is recruiting 17 year olds.

No question junior clubs, not all but many, need to do more to recruit. Senior clubs ( colts) also need to be more supportive of their junior clubs by providing support such as coaching education to club land coaches, and accordingly building an identity with their juniors. It's always harder done than said but it isn't an impossibility.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

The Class of 2014 are now either starting University, at TAFE, gainfully employed, or off on a Gap Year with their Schoolboy rugby careers disappearing into the distance in the rear view mirror of life.

With the 2015 season nearly upon us, the Premier Clubs are in full pre-season swing and with the NSW Suburban RU (and the various interstate equivalents) not too far behind them, is there anyone (or parent/friend/relative/close associate) prepared to discuss how their transition from Schoolboy rugby to Colts rugby went: the good, the bad and the ugly.

Post away. Your thoughts and experiences may be of use to the Class of 2015 and beyond.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Very interested to see how this goes HJ - wouldn't expect too much until they get to their first trial (this weekend?) and realise no one is watching.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

^^^^ Kids from 2nds and 3rds at "the Big Rugby Schools" would be quite comfortable playing in front of small crowds. To maintain 3 Colts grades across 12 clubs, Sydney Colts annually needs an annual injection of more players than just the chosen ones from the School 1st XV's.

One of the challenges that Colts Club Coaches and Managers face annually is dealing with the wounded and fragile egos of players whose expectations of being the "go to guy" for Colts 1 are greater than their abilities, relative to other players at the club. IMHO former 3rd XV and lower players seem to be a lot more resilient and realistic in this regard.

Not sure that there will be trials on this weekend in Sydney. Most clubs are committed to the Kiama 7's, and go into full on trial mode next weekend.

BrisVegas Premiership trials are already underway. The interesting thing up there is Colts is currently only Under 19's, although under the current regime many kids finish school as 17 year olds. IIRC the current QLD year 8 cohort will be the first group to finish as 18 year olds (typically) in line with NSW. When this group lobs up to Colts in 5 years time, if they haven't already done so, they may need to consider making Qld Colts go to Under 20's to give the players two years post school in Colts, in line with the other competitions.

 

[Brendan Hume]

Townsville is a very different market to the cities where club rugby is consistent and school rugby less so, but here are a few of the things we've done (at club and regional level) to keep players engaged through to senior footy.
- consistent playing schedule in U17s (about a 20 wk season for 7 - 9 teams)
- the three private schools that do support rugby also tour biannually to the UK
- on the alternate year, the TDRU does a schoolboy tour to Japan which targets players who are likely to be selected in the NQ Schools team
- coaches at club level (at our club anyway) have traditionally been current players, with some support from parents and 'old boys'
- we have an U19 competition that supports the transition to seniors (not sure what age groups Colts are in other areas)
- encourage training activity between U17's and U19's throughout the season
- biannual selection of trainee Development Officers from the U17's comp
- play matches close to U19's match times at the same location as often as possible
- U19's are included in the senior training group at the start of the season and are heavily involved in senior training and during games for the seniors as the year progresses (where developmentally appropriate)

Of course most of our players aren't going on to play Premier Rugby or Super Rugby - we can only offer enjoyment. There are some rep programs which are important for better players, but having a great culture is the most important thing to encourage young people to make that transition to senior footy, and there are studies that show that great referees and coaches are also hugely important.

If you do have a great culture and people are having fun, those that do move away from the sport can be encouraged to return as things settle down in life. The UK had some great success with this in a recent recruitment program aimed at people who had given up after school or college - can't remember the name though.

 

[ghoti]

Eastwood colts have a trial with Penrith this Saturday. No details yet.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I am under the impression easts have a trial in colsts this week

 

[forwards4ever]

I am under the impression easts have a trial in colsts this week

Against Norths at Redmond! And they say Norths don't have enough players for 3 colts teams. Weren't we talking about how good their Colts program was only 2 or 3 years ago. Where did all the players go.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Have clubs been too busy targeting the cream of the crop from the class of 2014, and forgotten that there is a certain quality in quantity?

It is very easy to win games with a roster of talented players, "developed" elsewhere, and that makes "the programme" at that club look good.

It is very hard to develop battlers into bolters, but it can be done. A programme that manages to achieve that is a quality programme.

 

[Quick Hands]

Against Norths at Redmond! And they say Norths don't have enough players for 3 colts teams. Weren't we talking about how good their Colts program was only 2 or 3 years ago. Where did all the players go.

I think one possibility might be that Gordon are now more active and more organised - I'm told they've set up a scholarship relationship with Macquarie Uni. This has allowed them to keep and/or attract players that might have otherwise gone elsewhere.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I think one possibility might be that Gordon are now more active and more organised - I'm told they've set up a scholarship relationship with Macquarie Uni. This has allowed them to keep and/or attract players that might have otherwise gone elsewhere.

They were with UTS last year...these scholarships aren't all they're cracked up to be: a couple of grand at most is what I've been told.
Recruiting at Sydney Uni has moved focus away from the rockstars: experience suggests they create as many problems as they solve was what I was told.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

The Wicks have cornered the former schoolboy Rockstar market with their 35+ scholarships.

Wait until about Round 2 when I do my "Where are they now" analysis of the Colts Games team sheets compared to the 2014 NSW 1, NSW 2 and Combined States squad lists.

Re: How much a "Scholarship" is worth. The vast majority of those on the claimed scholarships are getting petty cash amounts (around $1k - $2k with much of it in contra, job and accommodation assistance, and product as opposed actual cash). Each club with aggressive recruiting strategies will have a couple of superstars who may be getting their education paid for in full. These are few and far between from what I can gather.

The real value of most of the "scholarships" will typically be talked up by "proud" associates of the recipients. The green eyed monster then takes over and reality becomes severely obfuscated.

 

[Quick Hands]

The Wicks have cornered the former schoolboy Rockstar market with their 35+ scholarships.

Wait until about Round 2 when I do my "Where are they now" analysis of the Colts Games team sheets compared to the 2014 NSW 1, NSW 2 and Combined States squad lists.

Re: How much a "Scholarship" is worth. The vast majority of those on the claimed scholarships are getting petty cash amounts (around $1k - $2k with much of it in contra, job and accommodation assistance, and product as opposed actual cash). Each club with aggressive recruiting strategies will have a couple of superstars who may be getting their education paid for in full. These are few and far between from what I can gather.

The real value of most of the "scholarships" will typically be talked up by "proud" associates of the recipients. The green eyed monster then takes over and reality becomes severely obfuscated.

At least some of the Randwick ones involve free accomodation in the colleges and some tutoring and mentoring. This may or may not vary according to the player.

Perhaps, and this is just speculation, the UNSW sponsorship or Randwick might be "in kind" rather than cash? If so, a very smart move by the wicks.