The Wallabies Thread

[KOB1987]

Yeah, nah wam. It's never the 1 on 1 defence where the ABs beat us, it's the counter attack and running wide. The myth that is Beale's poor defence is a story from 2012.

That said, I'm in no way advocating the dropping of Khunt for KB (Kurtley Beale), just that your rationale is wrong. I'd like to see Hunt At 12, KB (Kurtley Beale) at 15 and Folau on the wing. I won't be surprised if KB (Kurtley Beale) gets named on the wing though, but they will share the responsibilities up back.

 

[Tomikin]

Yeah, nah wam. It's never the 1 on 1 defence where the ABs beat us, it's the counter attack and running wide. The myth that is Beale's poor defence is a story from 2012.

That said, I'm in no way advocating the dropping of Khunt for KB (Kurtley Beale), just that your rationale is wrong. I'd like to see Hunt At 12, KB (Kurtley Beale) at 15 and Folau on the wing. I won't be surprised if KB (Kurtley Beale) gets named on the wing though, but they will share the responsibilities up back.

Yeah I think KB (Kurtley Beale)'s form oversea and just before he got injured here is too good to ignore, and this is from someone who never really rated him.

where to play him, is the next question 11,12,14,15.

 

[Gnostic]

Honestly, id expect "professional" athletes to eat/diet correctly and if needed go for a run. On their own terms.



Id expect our coaches to not need to worry about laziness but concentrate on skills, plays, improving players strengths, fixing weaknesses but strength and conditioning is one coaches managing and the players responsibility

I agree but even the best performer needs an outside critique at times to show them an error in their technique or where extra improvement can be made, otherwise even the very elite performer thinks they are doing their best but in reality they can be reinforcing bad habits, and in terms of skill execution making the issue worse by repetition.

As negative as many would like to believe I am I actually truly believe that most of the Australian players are as talented as anybody else in the world, in some case they could be the very best. What I have also believed for many years is that the systems in Australian Rugby of which coaching is a big part are a limiting factor not one of development.

 

[wamberal]

Even though we are competing for players against a very rich local competitor?


If we could take our pick of all the best kids playing either our code or the other one, I would agree. But we just cannot, sadly.


Would Fifita, for example, be "as talented as anybody else in the world?"


If he is, what use is that to us?

 

[tragic]

Yeah I think KB (Kurtley Beale)'s form oversea and just before he got injured here is too good to ignore, and this is from someone who never really rated him.

where to play him, is the next question 11,12,14,15.

Or 10??

 

[Tomikin]

Or 10??

Yeah possibly.. Ive never rated him at 10..but maybe it would work.

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[Muzza]

we have the same problem every time. Teams pin us in our 22 with good kicking. we try run it out, they put the rush defence on us, we drop the ball, they get the ball back and score. every team plays the same tactic on us.
We have hunt and hallypetty who can kick well. WHY THE HELL ARE THEY NOT KICKING !!!!!!!

 

[cyclopath]

Or 10??

No. Far better at 15 and roving around. I really think Foley or Cooper at 10, Hunt 12, Kerevi or Kuridrani at 13, Folau and Naivalu / Speight on wings, Beale at 15. Or DHP with Beale on the bench.
Will it happen? Probably not.

 

[wamberal]

Naivalu is out, reportedly. For 6 weeks.

 

[cyclopath]

Damn.

 

[TSR]

No. Far better at 15 and roving around. I really think Foley or Cooper at 10, Hunt 12, Kerevi or Kuridrani at 13, Folau and Naivalu / Speight on wings, Beale at 15. Or DHP with Beale on the bench.
Will it happen? Probably not.

I dunno, I reckon it could. For all the criticism of Cheika he is not an idiot and he is a fan of Beale, Hunt & Folau. I thinks it's quite plausible he'll look to pick all 3, and I think the most obvious way to do that is Hunt at 12 & Beale & Folau filling 15 & 14. My preference would be Folau on the wing, but the way wingers and fullbacks interchange I think either way can work.

 

[tragic]

Yeah possibly.. Ive never rated him at 10..but maybe it would work.

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No. Far better at 15 and roving around. I really think Foley or Cooper at 10, Hunt 12, Kerevi or Kuridrani at 13, Folau and Naivalu / Speight on wings, Beale at 15. Or DHP with Beale on the bench.
Will it happen? Probably not.

I know it wasn't a success when tried previously but he has a lot of history in this position and foley hasn't made it his own. Realistically it's too late now but 10 is a big issue and I can't see any other option except QC (Quade Cooper).
The AB v BIL game showed how important a good kicker is. I think I saw only one kick exiting the 22 that didn't make it past the 10m line. Even the box kicks made 40m.
I'd like to see hodge at 15 taking all the penalty kicks for touch, and at first receiver for all the kicks in our 22. I would also have him take a crack at long range shots for goal in the 40-55m zone - every 3 point opportunity will be vital in TRC.
Which leaves Folau on one wing. I'd have Naivalu/ Speight on the other as we need some genuine pace in the back 3.
With kerevi at 13 that only leaves 10 or 12 for Beale.
And I think hunt deserves his position more than foley.

 

[TSR]

If Cheika was going to pick Hodge at 15 & Folau on the wing, we would have seem it during the last 3 games.

Realistically, if he was going to pick Beale at 15, I reckon we would have seen DHP there and Folau at wing.

I would assume that If selected (and I think he should be) Beale will be a straight swap in for either Hunt or DHP. I did toy with the thought of Beale at 10, but it doesn't play to his strengths.

 

[cyclopath]

I know it wasn't a success when tried previously but he has a lot of history in this position and foley hasn't made it his own. Realistically it's too late now but 10 is a big issue and I can't see any other option except QC (Quade Cooper).
The AB v BIL game showed how important a good kicker is. I think I saw only one kick exiting the 22 that didn't make it past the 10m line. Even the box kicks made 40m.
I'd like to see hodge at 15 taking all the penalty kicks for touch, and at first receiver for all the kicks in our 22. I would also have him take a crack at long range shots for goal in the 40-55m zone - every 3 point opportunity will be vital in TRC.
Which leaves Folau on one wing. I'd have Naivalu/ Speight on the other as we need some genuine pace in the back 3.
With kerevi at 13 that only leaves 10 or 12 for Beale.
And I think hunt deserves his position more than foley.

Don't forget Beale is a pretty good long place kicker too, and probably better from hand distance wise than Foley. So while not as long as Hodge, might sort of cover those issues too? Just a thought.

 

[TSR]

One thing I found intriguing, in the modern age where role definition is so much less defined by the number on a players back, we did we continue to give Foley the job of kicking for line on penalties. Hunt or DHP both have longer kicks and have pretty trusty boots. It would seem to me such a simple thing to hand this responsibility over to one of them.

 

[tragic]

If Cheika was going to pick Hodge at 15 & Folau on the wing, we would have seem it during the last 3 games.

I'm sure you're right.
But I think makes a lot of sense to play hodge at 15 and have mentioned it a number of times since last years internationals. Remember it was getting pinned in our 22 till we gave away points that lost us the series against England. (Usually a penalty goal was our exit strategy)
It ain't going to happen but I'd still like to see it given a chance.

 

[tragic]

The other thing that was very apparent in the AB vs BIL match was every kick was contested. For both teams. On multiple occasions the kicking team regathered the ball. Yet the kicks were generally longer.
I'm not sure whether that represents better kick placement, better skill and commitment from the chasers, better communication, better fitness, or all of the above.
But there was a very obvious difference from any wallaby game I've seen for a long time.
Our poor kicking and our poor chase just puts us under so much pressure, and gives the opposition multiple bites at the cherry before we finally crack.
Even if we defend our line and force a turnover we're invariably defending our line again 2 minutes later after a lineout just outside our 22.

 

[wamberal]

One thing I found intriguing, in the modern age where role definition is so much less defined by the number on a players back, we did we continue to give Foley the job of kicking for line on penalties. Hunt or DHP both have longer kicks and have pretty trusty boots. It would seem to me such a simple thing to hand this responsibility over to one of them.

Maybe in the vain hope that his kicking will improve. Who has ever heard of a Test level 10 who kicks like a girl, some of the time, anyway.


Apologies to girls who can kick.

 

[KOB1987]

Just out of curiosity, what would be the pecking order for 10s if we had a diabolical run of injuries a la the hookers a few years ago.

1. Foley
2. Quade
3. Kurtley
.......what's after that? Harmichael possibly, or Godwin. But I shudder at the thought of both of those.

( I left Lance out because I think he's injured but he'd probably slot in at 4 if not).

EDIT: Lilo played for the Brumbies the other night in KL or Singapore didn't he? He could find himself back in the squad sooner rather than later. i.e. for the RC.

 

[tragic]

Lilo played for the Brumbies the other night in KL or Singapore didn't he? He could find himself back in the squad sooner rather than later. i.e. for the RC.

Great to see him back.
But a bone marrow transplant is a huge insult to the body.
I would be gobsmacked to see him playing at a high level before next year.