The Wallabies Thread

[Braveheart81]

Did I say it was unimportant?

1 player in that list is ineligible. 2 players very likely to be in the starting team didn't play Super Rugby.

Cowan isn't there and Sio is likely to start. He has been our first choice LHP for a while and spent a fair bit of the year injured so pretty unlikely to make a team of the season.

Let's assume McMahon starts at 6. He was also injured for a lot of the season.

I think just about everyone selecting their best team would take a team largely based on the season's form and then tinker a bit based on other factors.




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[dru]

Yes, I think your implication was that it was unimportant.

RUPA providing a group this different from the coaches/selectors view is in my mind not insignificant. Albeit the (almost) (possible) 2/3 agreement.

 

[jimmydubs]

2 Tahs vs 5 or so. Huge difference.
That's only a partial troll BTW.

 

[Slim 293]

RUPA providing a group this different from the coaches/selectors view is in my mind not insignificant. Albeit the (almost) (possible) 2/3 agreement.

Well, it's not a team provided by RUPA - it's a fan poll.........

And it is fairly insignificant........ it identifies a number of players who have had a good Super Rugby season, but they're not necessarily the best players who should be selected for the Wallabies.

 

[Joe Blow]

With Hunt out we assume that Beale starts at 12. That means it is not possible to carry Kerevis defense at 13. Logically TK will start there.
But......what if Cheika wants to go down a new path and we see a centre pairing of Beale and Rona?

Possible or not?

 

[Joe Blow]

And on the back row.
McMahon has been OK in the past but not great against the ABs. He is probably a good sub to come on and inject some pace into the game. We need to start with a genuine lineout option at 6, probably Hanigan but I would have preferred Higs, Fardy or even RHP.
It is unfair to expect much from Hanigan or Korszyc against the All Blacks at this point.

 

[Killer]

I'm not sure Beale will start, as most think, what about like for like, just slot Meakes in for Hunt. He will take a lot of decision pressure off Foley too.

RHP should be in the team, I have never got the continued McMahon selection, just doesn't seem to perform at Intl level.

 

[fatprop]

He wears 8. He doesn't play like one. Well, not a traditional 8.

When Read started out, he was often criticised because he didn't play a traditional bash & crash no 8 game. Now he would be considered a stereotypical wide running back rower.

I'd like us to put more pressure on the opposition breakdown, but for me the problem starts with our passive defence line. The current interpretation of the laws is really making it tough on pilferers. Even George Smith this year gave away a truck load of penalities.

Yeah the ABs use that "crazy" concept of balance in the back row that lets Reid play to his strengths.

I agree about the defensive line speed, but I have a sneaking suspicion that that will improve with better fitness.

You can't play a high tempo running game and a high tempo attacking defense without a big motor. but I expect more focus on dominant tackles and counter rucks than pilfers - you don't get penalised for counter rucking

 

[kiap]

I expect more focus on dominant tackles and counter rucks

That would be nice.

It was yellow and soft in June. I can't believe it's not butter.

 

[Braveheart81]

With Hunt out we assume that Beale starts at 12. That means it is not possible to carry Kerevis defense at 13. Logically TK will start there.
But..what if Cheika wants to go down a new path and we see a centre pairing of Beale and Rona?

Possible or not?

I'm reasonably confident Kerevi will start. I think him getting named in the leadership group is significant. If he doesn't, I certainly think it will be Kuridrani.

 

[A mutterer]

I'm not sure Beale will start, as most think, what about like for like, just slot Meakes in for Hunt. He will take a lot of decision pressure off Foley too.
Fairly harsh judgement. He has played very well at times but was probably let down by a soft right give who should probably be described as a soft soft five. I still don't think
RHP should be in the team, I have never got the continued McMahon selection, just doesn't seem to perform at Intl level.

Fairly harsh judgement, he has done well in past games alongside some passengers.

 

[Brumby Runner]

That the majority of the punters' team of the year are likely to end up starting for the Wallabies.

Brumbieman made an assertion that it would be a stronger team than the Wallabies which is an impossible comparison given the substantial similarities.

It also suggests that largely the Wallabies will be based on form and a lot of our best players are also the form players.

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BH, you'd really like to think that the punters' choice would also align closely with the coaches' choice, as we watch the same players go round all year, and possibly watch some more than the coaches do.

The notable point I see in the above side is that it contains two only Waratahs, Foley and Hooper. While I would personally also include Folau, I think otherwise it is a better reflection of the form of our Super Rugby players than the first Bledisloe Cup side will turn out to be. The likely differential can only be explained in terms of the assessed suitability of the various players to the game plan the coaches want to implement.

We'll see soon enough if that game plan is anything more than a pipe dream as it has been almost entirely ineffectual for the past two years.

 

[Braveheart81]

BH, you'd really like to think that the punters' choice would also align closely with the coaches' choice, as we watch the same players go round all year, and possibly watch some more than the coaches do.

The notable point I see in the above side is that it contains two only Waratahs, Foley and Hooper. While I would personally also include Folau, I think otherwise it is a better reflection of the form of our Super Rugby players than the first Bledisloe Cup side will turn out to be. The likely differential can only be explained in terms of the assessed suitability of the various players to the game plan the coaches want to implement.

We'll see soon enough if that game plan is anything more than a pipe dream as it has been almost entirely ineffectual for the past two years.

As it's a fan voted poll there is quality control on people's votes. Some people may vote multiple times and some might vote entirely for the 15 players in their side, ignoring form altogether.

As I've mentioned, one and maybe two players likely to be in the starting XV (Sio and potentially McMahon) were injured for a lot of the season so it is not surprising they missed out on the team of the season. The test team picked in August isn't a team of the season though. It is picking the best team now. Form from the first half of the Super Rugby season is pretty much irrelevant now.

We have two players likely to be in the XV who didn't play Super Rugby. Certainly Genia will start at 9 and is one of the vice-captains of the side. Beale will probably also start. Let's leave aside Beale for now as he polarises a lot of people, but if the same punters were asked to pick their stating XV for the Wallabies I bet the consensus answer would result in Genia at 9, not Ruru.

Clearly Mafi isn't eligible for the Wallabies.

I would only include 3 Waratahs from 2017 in the first test starting XV (Hooper, Foley, Folau). I think there is a chance that it will be 4 with Hanigan starting but I hope McMahon will get the nod.

Overall I think this is a good side selected by the punters that is a pretty fair representation of the form Aussie Super Rugby players. I also think that the players from here that miss out on the starting XV won't really be hard done by as there are generally good reasons why the player who will be selected ahead of them is.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Let's leave aside Beale for now as he polarises a lot of people, but if the same punters were asked to pick their stating XV for the Wallabies I bet the consensus answer would result in Genia at 9, not Ruru.

I also think that the players from here that miss out on the starting XV won't really be hard done by as there are generally good reasons why the player who will be selected ahead of them is.

Paradoxically, if the same punters were asked to pick the current Wallaby they would most like to see punted, I bet the consensus answer would result in Genia, based on the predominance of anti-Genia posts on this site.

Good reasons? Selecting players just returning from injury or just returning from overseas without significant game time here at the expense of players in good form who have given their all for the Super Rugby sides all year does not look like "good reasons" to me, just the belief that they will perform in the coaches' current game plan. As I said above, I believe the current game plan is a shambles as it has delivered more failures than successes over the past two years. We'll soon see if it has the wherewithall to turn things around in the upcoming TRC. I have strong doubts.

 

[TOCC]

The three big ones for me, and which many on this forum have asked for.. is DHP at 15, Meakes at 12 and Fardy at 6...

We all know Fardy won't play since Cheika considered him not necessary, but I'd like to see the other two play in those respective positions.

 

[Braveheart81]

The three big ones for me, and which many on this forum have asked for.. is DHP at 15, Meakes at 12 and Fardy at 6.

We all know Fardy won't play since Cheika considered him not necessary, but I'd like to see the other two play in those respective positions.

That is incorrect regarding Fardy. Ross Haylett-Petty is the 6 in the team of the season.

Obviously a large number of people (myself included) would have him in the Wallabies squad too.

 

[Brumby Runner]

My only concern with Meakes at 12 is that it might deny Hodge the spot. I firmly believe Hodge should be in the starting as his long range goal kicking could be used as a threat to the opposition sides and just might let the Wallabies play with a bit more freedom around the centre of the park. His ability to peel off larger gains in territory on penalty kicks (if allowed) would also be a positive to the Wallabies.

I wouldn't mind seeing him have a run at 13, but he is more experienced at test level at 12 and probably should have first go at that spot with Hunt unavailable.

 

[fatprop]

And on the back row.
McMahon has been OK in the past but not great against the ABs. He is probably a good sub to come on and inject some pace into the game. We need to start with a genuine lineout option at 6, probably Hanigan but I would have preferred Higs, Fardy or even RHP.
It is unfair to expect much from Hanigan or Korszyc against the All Blacks at this point.

So who has been good vs the AB's?

 

[fatprop]

My only concern with Meakes at 12 is that it might deny Hodge the spot. I firmly believe Hodge should be in the starting as his long range goal kicking could be used as a threat to the opposition sides and just might let the Wallabies play with a bit more freedom around the centre of the park. His ability to peel off larger gains in territory on penalty kicks (if allowed) would also be a positive to the Wallabies.

I wouldn't mind seeing him have a run at 13, but he is more experienced at test level at 12 and probably should have first go at that spot with Hunt unavailable.

We aren't going to beat the ABs by a long range goal kicking

 

[Killer]

Meakes is getting some exposure on Qantas Wallabies Twitter account after Cessnock training. Throwing my chicken bones I'd say he is in?