Monday's Rugby News - Green and Gold Rugby

Monday’s Rugby News

Monday’s Rugby News

Monday’s rugby news has injury updates for the Wallabies, no positives according to Michael Cheika, disappointment to drive Wallabies for the second test and Dane Coles praised by Steve Hansen.

Injury Fallout

Matt Giteau is set to miss the rest of the Rugby Championship with an ankle syndesmosis injury.

“Matt’s got a bit of a break in his leg, at the top of his leg I think and a bit of a fracture in his ankle,” said Wallabies coach Michael Cheika.

“So he’s done a pretty good job on his leg.”

“He’s disappointed but he’s also very realistic.

“He’s a pro, he still knows he’s got to get himself right to get back to his club commitments (with Toulon) later in the season so that’s what he will be doing.”

Rob Horne is also expected to miss the rest of the Rugby Championship with a shoulder injury whilst Matt Toomua is expected to miss this weekend’s match in New Zealand with a concussion.

No Positives

Wallabies coach Michael Cheika said there were no silver linings in the Wallabies record home loss to the All Blacks.

“That would be a lie of me if I tried to find one [a positive],” Cheika said.

“I thought that Will Genia played well in his first game back and David Pocock was outstanding as well in his efforts and some players did that but no I don’t think [there were any positives].

“We’ve got to look forward now, straight away to the next one, that’s the only chance we’ve got.

“There’s no rustiness. When players run at you, you’ve got to tackle and that’s the nature of the game. So when other things don’t work out, that’ll look after you.”

Disappointment to Drive Wb’s

Wallabies lock Kane Douglas says the disappointing performance against the All Blacks will be used as motivation for next weekend’s test match in Wellington.

“It’s (the mood is) pretty down but I think we’ve got to use that for motivation for next week,” he said.

“We can’t be sooking all week with our heads down, we’ve got to use it as motivation to get stuck into training, watch what we did wrong because we did plenty wrong.

“We’ve got to look at what we did in defence because we didn’t defend very well and they scored a heap of points so we’ll have a good hard look at ourselves and come up with a plan for next week.”

Hansen Praises Coles

All Blacks coach Steve Hansen has praised hooker Dane Coles after almost playing a full match with a rib injury.

Coles was a late call up to the bench after Nathan Harris was injured and after Codie Taylor was knocked out in the opening minutes, Coles played almost a full game.

“He was blowing and he’s probably sore, but they’re all sore,” Hansen said.

“He’s tough, there’s no doubt out about that. I don’t know whether that’s because he’s got no brains or he’s got too many. I’m not sure.

“But he epitomises the team I think; he got called in late, he wasn’t really expecting to play because we didn’t want to play him and came out and played really well and left himself out there on the track.

“And when someone does that for you I think you can only pay them the biggest compliment that you can. He’s a champion, and he played like one.”

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  • McWarren

    No comment.

    • Unanimous

      I’ll take that as a comment.

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Gutted for Giteau. Never a good thing to see players injured and especially when he’s taken such a big pay cut to be part of the team. I really wish him well for the future.
    I would say more embarrassment than disappointment and if they aren’t embarrassed then they should resign from the team and go play soccer or some other nancy sport

    • Brisneyland Local

      Here here!

  • Tomthusiasm

    Coles is a legend.

  • Joe

    First injury is the foot. He came back and he broke his ankle. Very poor management here.

    You should do : Genia-Cooper

    • Seb V

      Horne injured for the rest of the RC

    • We don’t have much choice in the backs now. I’d say it’ll be Kerevi-Kuridrani in the centres this weekend unless Chieka wants to give Hodge a go at 12 and drop Kuridrani.

      • Pedro

        I agree, while people will bitch about it, the loss of two and a half inside centres will likely mean Kuridrani will stay. The only other option I could imagine is if Cooper starts and Foley moves to 12 and Kerevi to thirteen.

      • brumby runner

        In an overall sub=par performance and over 30 missed tackles all up, why would you drop a player who made all of his tackles (reported variously as 13/13 or 17/17)? Surely, just asking for more trouble.

        What Kuridrani needs is a hell of a lot of ball catching practise on the training field.

        On Toomua, I would like to see him just take a rest for the remainder of the season. Too many head injuries/concussion for my liking.

  • Nutta

    I’ve watched a full replay now and then a few specific moments on-top to get my head straight. Up-shot: no Boolean maths complexities or Eureka moments. It was simply dreadful kicking, a shit lineout, way too deep (still) in attack and some +30 missed tackles. What I don’t get is that culturally these things are all the things we are historically good at (as a nation). To explain further, I’m not talking about Rugby in isolation but am talking about basic, national skill-sets.

    Flat attack – leaving aside Ella’s, Lynagh, Walker, Larkham’s etc etc as brilliant individuals, how many of us grew up playing touch footy nearly every waking moment we could? Before school, recess, lunch, after school, before footy training etc etc. It’s a fkn national skillset. Now has anyone ever won touch by playing deep? Anyone? It’s a basic national skill-set.

    Kicking – By far and away the biggest winter past-time in this nation is a strange game, but one based on accurate kicking out of the hand. The biggest kids sport is one based off similar skills – being able to see space and kick to it. WTF…?

    Tackling – The 2nd biggest winter sport in the land (plus our own) is built on making the tackle and making it dominant. Again WTF?

    Lineout – Ever since Sugar-Daddy-Jones pulled Skylab Cutler back from oblivion we have always had a good lineout. That’s over 30yrs of good lineouts. Even when our scrum was an international embarrassment we still had a great lineout. Again WTF?

    I’m genuinely lost with this one. Also congratulations to the AIB’s. Absolute deserved winners. Your greatest warrior was our greatest embarrassment – Coles is a gutsy guy. Hats off to him. But how a guy with rib trouble even survived a game vs the Wobblies is an indictment on soft-serve bullshit that came from the Wobblies themselves.

    • Pedro

      With the depth in attack, it’s only advantageous to be deep if it’s one, maximum two players doing it and certainly not the fly half. The late arrival at full pace can often blast through, but only when the initial movement quickly meets the defence, forcing them to be flat footed.

      Lineout is bizarre, get Ben Mowen in to sort that shit out. Really no excuse though.

      Defence is an attitude thing at this level, too much respect for the ball carrier, back yourself and trust the players around you.

    • +1 for bringing yourself to sit through it again.

    • Brisneyland Local

      Nutta you are a better man than I! There is no way I could bring myself to watch that dross again. But good you have made the effort! Cant fault any of your views. Infact strongly endorse them.

      • Nutta

        I watched again as my initial viewing was surrounded by noisy others (great folk, but too much noise & grog to concentrate) and largely was somewhat in shock. I needed to make sure I actually saw what I saw y’know? Checks has real problems here. He could of blooded a whole bunch of newbies and wrote it off to experience, but he chose to play a “here & now” team and was badly stood up. The AB’s were good – no doubt about that – but we were fkn terrible. That said, after the hiding in NZ last year, losing the WC final, losing 3-0 vs the English and now that he does have carte-blanche to wipe the board clean and start again with 3.5yrs to Bill Time to “rebuild”. No one will deny that at least.

        • McWarren

          His selections this week will be the litmus test for me. If we see Mitchell, AAC, Foley, Simmons, Douglas, McCalman, The Pooper instead of Kerevi, Hodge, Tom English, Kelaway (young tah, bad spelling??), Magnay, Timani, McMahon, Jones, Ready, Coleman, Arnold, then I am afraid my opinion of Michael Cheika will be forever changed.

        • Nutta

          Front- Toby TPN Kepu
          Locks- Arnold Dougy
          Loose- Poey Macca Fardy
          In’s- Gins Too’s (if fit)
          Centres- Godwin & Folau
          Back3- Kellaway DHP Two-Dads

          Sio Ready Alalalalatoa
          Coleman Timani or even Houston (if fit)
          Phipps Kerevi QC

        • McWarren

          Not sure I’d agree with all of them Nutta, but we have options don’t we. Its not all bloody doom and gloom if we don’t pick to OS boys or the experienced lads.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Don’t agree with Folau at centre. Might’ve said that before but I agree the pooper is dead. Pick a bloody no8 ffs and let Pocock do just his job. Fucken phips can go on the wing instead of friggen hooper

        • Nutta

          I think Folau needs to get out of FB as he is being isolated there and his kicking game isn’t good enough. So bring him to the centres to get more ball and use his ability to carve-up. Perhaps at 12 then with Kerevi outside him. At a stretch move him to 11 and let him roam.

          I’ve never been a fan of Pooper. Let’s take the worlds best 7 and play him at 8 to fit in a guy who doesn’t play 7?!? FFS. I don’t know if it is Hooper himself or Cheks tactics but Hoops at 7 just isn’t cutting it for me. What I wouldn’t give for Mowen atm…

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Yeah but he’s being isolated because his wings aren’t supporting him. Centre has to be a distributor first and foremost and he ain’t that. Maybe wing but certainly taking the kicks. He is awesome at receiving kicks, hardly ever misses and usually able to do something with the ball. He does need support though and lately that hasn’t been there

        • Mike Thompson

          I’ve watched a fair bit of Rugby over a lotta years, and there’s a thread I’ve seen often. With well coached sides, all the players seem relaxed and certain of their roles. Their heads are clear. There’s a surefooted certainty about all the players in the team (even if they are loosing). As a result, I notice that the “skills” come along for the ride. They tend not to make howling mistakes.

          For example, Ewen McKensie’s QLD team. The striking thing about that team was how well the bit players went. Higginbotham Beau Robbinson, Saia Fainga’a. McKensie managed to bring out the best in them. Without McKensie coaching them, these players never looked that impressive ever again.

          Back to my point; when McKensie was coaching QLD all the players looked skillful.They looked clearheaded, certain, intense.

          When you look the the clusterfuck of a game just played by the Wallabies, I feel I’m seeing a monumental failure in coaching. They looked like a confused rabble. Yes, you can point to bad technique, charge-downs, lineouts, etc. But they are symptoms.

          And not for the first time recently. That 2nd game against the Poms was shocking game too. Moore looked looked like an agitated wreck.

          Cheika is not currently producing confident, clear headed, well organised, intense teams who believe. Something is badly off the rails.

        • Nutta

          Clarity and confidence is an outcome of good leadership most surely. And nothing shows that more then when it isn’t working. And considering Checks style against Link or any other ex Wobbly coach is interesting to be sure. To that end I resubmit this for consideration:

        • Willem Labuschagne

          Mate, you’ve really hit the nail squarely on the head.

        • Brisneyland Local

          Mate I had the opposite experience. I didnt get home from work til 7. Me and two old mates sat giant in my living room with Beer and Pizza (Beacause that is what you do). It was silent from about the 8 minute markl and never really got better. In fact one of my mates couldnt bare to watch any more. He left at the 60 min mark and said “Fuck This”. I hope Cheika does at least a 50% clean out and builds, but I think the pressure to produce a win will compel him only to tinker around the edges. I think in general his only strategy to save his own ass is to go for a long term rebuild, and hope that this buys him some time!

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          If he brings in newbies and makes it about the process to Japan then I think it’ll be ok but there’ll be a lot of supporters just wanting a win. FFS make sure you beat the Argies and Saffa’s

        • Brisneyland Local

          If we loose to them I am giving up on the Wallabies for 12 months!

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          I’d love to see that mate but I’m not sure he’s got the balls to do it

  • Seb V

    The amount of mis-matches in the line with NZ backs to Aus forwards was ridiculous.

    • Nick Gregory

      The inverse also rings true, seeing as their forwards have better ball skills than our backs…

  • BrianT

    Not insignificant here in the post-mortem is how well the All Blacks played in that1st half. Their Super Rugby teams showed the way, these guys took it to another level. Somehow though, through 3-4 weeks of camp we did not see it coming. What exactly did they expect?

  • Blackfish

    Pressure off Moore at least. No worse than the rest.

  • Gavin

    No shame in losing to New Zealand, even if you get spanked, but plenty of shame in being undercooked, unorganised and unmotivated.

    Massive pressure on Cheika. He will be the fall guy for this (and deserves criticism) but I fear that isn’t the answer. He’s a top coach. He has made mistakes and should learn from them. He’s the best coach Australia has.

    • jamie

      I did think that, but he’s been making plenty of mistakes of late. Selections, captaincy, team culture (they looked disjointed) and his insistence with horribly out of form players are all on his shoulders.

      • Gavin

        I agree, Jamie.
        Is the answer to sack him for these mistakes? He is a proven coach and he must be more aware of his mistakes than anyone.

        • first time long time

          If he is aware of his mistakes, he doesn’t show any sign of changing to address them.

        • Gavin

          He’s not an idiot. He’s a decorated coach who no doubt knows more than any of us.

          This “blame everything on the manager” mentality is unbecoming of rugby union supporters.

        • first time long time

          You infer that I am blaming everything on Cheika to suit your point of view. Wrong.
          Poor selections
          Poor tactics
          Poor substitutions
          Sorry that is on Cheika

          You haven’t seen unbecoming YET ; )

        • jamie

          I can’t see him being sacked. I wouldn’t, but what would I know?

          I could see Bernie Larkham getting the sack though, and is Nathan Grey really the only bloke we know that can coach us how to defend?

          The 2014 Cheika needs to come back. Where’d he leave those golf clubs…

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Mate read a story today where Grey said the defence was an easy fix – been looking for an hour and can’t find it now – but seriously WTF. If it’s an easy fix then what the fuck was he doing letting it get so bad.

    • Kevino

      That’s five loses in a row, 4 of them on home soil.

      Credentials aside, that’s not a good thing for Australian Rugby. Losing games away from home is one thing, but to lose 4 in a row at home in a Calendar year is unheard of for the Wallabies.

      Time to trim the fat, radical change and planning for RWC19 would be accepted. Playing a side that’s building to nothing and losing is just a waste of time.

      • Gavin

        Agree, and it will be 6 losses on Saturday.

        I do think that on occasion sacking a manager is done to appease emotional reactions and distract responsibility from the people running the game. Not sure sacking Cheika is the right call. Big changes are needed of course, not sure if that change is required.

        • Kevino

          I did not say sack the manager, I’d be more in line to drop anyone over 29 years of age who won’t be at the next World Cup. There is enough experience with out these guys that bringing in some new fresh faces will help with culture.

          The current crop managed to get a manager sacked and while they did perform at the RWC have been very poor since. AAC, Mitchell, Gits should not have been bought back.

          Would love to see:

          9) Phipps
          10) Cooper
          11) A real wing with speed
          12) Hodge
          13) Kerevi
          14) DHP
          15) Folau

        • McWarren

          Kevino, What about Tom English at 11. he has speed, good hands, can tackle, intensity and works well in tandem with Hodge.

        • Kevino

          Couldn’t do any worse than the weekend.

          Once Sefa is qualified it will be one less issue for the Wallabies for a few years. His work rate and commitment are outstanding.

  • Gavin

    #12 is a massive issue now.

    Too bad that the ARU missed a beat on getting Ben T’eo back over. He’s going to be massive for England and after a dodgy start at club level has turned out to be one of Europe’s better inside centres/

    • Grant NZ

      It be some consolation that it’s also a massive issue for NZ now with SBW, Crotty, Ngatai & Moala now unavailable.

    • Haz

      He won’t be massive for England.

      Will lose his place in the squad to Tuilagi if he’s fit.

  • Keith Butler

    It was interesting see the Aussies in the dressing room at half time with Cheks ranting and finger pointing. Not what I expected from a top international coach no matter how badly his players performed, which as professionals they would be well aware of. Contrast with Ledesma making points with far more control.

    • Willem Labuschagne

      Good point. When things are going wrong, players need cool heads and a confident coach, not one who seems on the verge of panic.

  • Redfish

    My thoughts are two fold. First, Just read Nathan Grey’s comments that the loss will “certainly going to fuel the fire for the week”. Grey, if you don’t have a fire in your belly playing in front of 70k people for the 1st game of a Bledisloe at home …. when will you …my goodness! Saw the same thing said in the TV interviews … need more courage … motivation … was good to hear at least Sharpy putting things straight. Other teams (like Abs) also have courage, motivation …. it’s NOT exclusively an Australian trait! ….. it’s not a lift in these things that is required … it is better execution of game plans, better skill execution under pressure, minimising mistakes under pressure …. not more huff and puff talk like motivation. Doubt much can be improved in 6 days. Second, Best bet I think is to bring in 3-4 new guys to bring an element of surprise, retire some old dogs (like Moore) and build for the future. One thing the ABS have always been good at is being ruthless with selection (Shelford, Cullen etc). Time of Australia to cut the deadwood for better fruit later ..

    • Blinky Bill of Bellingen NSW

      Frankly the way things are looking, if Christan Cullen was an Australian he’d be selected.

      I’m as down as most Wallaby fans, and like most fans, I clearly do not know what the answer is. I think I can see the problem, but ‘what to do about it’? That’s the real question. How did it get this bad?

      Sanchez post interview suggested 7 days is plenty of time in sport. And that’s fine if the opposition are taking a holiday break. We need to work on the current troops with their skills, while at the same time looking to the future. That’s how I’m seeing it anyways.

  • McWarren

    It lunch time, I’m bored and sick of being angry, so here is my team for the weekend coming.
    Kepu (Captain)
    Timani/McMahon (or Leroy)
    Phipps (or Frisby for the experience)
    Debraceni (if its raining I might start him with instructions to boot the shit out it)
    Kelaway (young tah fella)
    Yep a completely new mix in the tight five, so the scrums will be crap (just accept it for now). 4 Lineout options. Plenty of hard hitters. No defensive structure necessary this weekend. Just let the boys go out and put big hits in, let them get used to the feeling of knocking an AB a over t. Start with Keiran Read and carrying it on after the tackle, rub his face into the dirt.
    First backline move is ‘hands’. Just spin to the wing,making sure to catch and pass and if available run at a hole. Also make sure your backrow know what you intend on doing.
    When in defence just bloody rush them. Tackle on suspicion in open play and bring them down first, let the second defender go high, real high with.

    • Willem Labuschagne

      There’s more to rugby than aggression, mate. This is not league. Have a bit more faith in the Players and coaches to sort things out and get some organisation into the team.

      • first time long time

        Its not league you are correct, but i wish someone would tell the wallabies that because they are so one dimensional at the moment they might as well run out at leichardt oval

      • McWarren

        Well if catching, passing, kicking, running at holes, hitting hard in tackles, every tackle, turning up as a professional ready to play, using your head to adjust a game plan, performing the basics of your sport with ease, if they are league traits then I’m off to watch the it now.
        Your right this isn’t League this union, a game built on agression and controlled mongrel. A game of dynamism, a complex game made simple by perfecting the skills involved.
        I get sick and tired of rugby being afraid to be agressive, to have a mongrel edge. Of being accused of being a Leagie just because I want the players I support to belt the opposition hard, and fair, and drive them backwards, not to be afraid.
        I’ve waited now since Cheika got the job for this mess to be sorted out and yet here we are, again, still. You can harp on all you like about the RWC being a success, but lets face it, we came up against a crap English team, a Welsh team on the day who couldn’t score in a brothel and yes Scotland was robbed. Making the final has painted over the cracks and allowed Cheika to fool himself that bringing back the has beens from Europe was a master stroke.

  • first time long time

    My team and don’t care about Giteau rule as that is now obsolete.
    And I also don’t care that there is no chance of it happening but I reckon they would give it a good shake.

    1. Slipper/Smith/Sio/Alaalatoa (I don’t know who)
    2. Ready
    3. Kepu
    4. Coleman
    5. Simmons (despite the howls, agree or not you know why I picked him)
    6. Timani
    7. Pocock
    8. Higginbotham
    9. Genia
    10. Cooper (sorry Quade, thrown to the wolves again)
    11. Folau
    12. Hodge
    13. Kerevi
    14. AAC
    15. DHP

    Finishers/guys Cheika might use

    Sio/Slipper/Smith/Alaalatoa (I don’t know who)
    Phipps because he is now our best utility back
    Toomua if fit

    All guys on that bench could have a significant impact in the last 20 – 30 mins

  • Brisneyland Local

    1. Slipper (Sio off the bench)
    2. TPN (Ready off the bench)
    3. Kepu
    4. Simmons (Yes I know I know, hopefully assisted by Coleman)
    5. Coleman
    6. Fardy
    7. Pocock (Hooper off the bench)
    8. Timani
    9. Genia (Frisby off the bench)
    10. Cooper (Toomua off the bench if available if not Jack D from the Rebs, anyone but Foley)
    11. DHP
    12. Kerevi
    13. AAC (Phipps off the bench because at least as a winger he doesnt have to pass much!))
    14. Morahan
    15. Folau

    For the rest of the bench still not sure yet!

    • first time long time

      Yes I like Morahan!
      Gives you that chip and regather option that no one else except Cooper can do.
      For some reason he seems to always be on the outer with coaches.
      Not sure why he didn’t get more air time at the reds and now gets 2mins against Eng not to be seen since.

      • Gavin

        Honestly, no sarcasm, why do you think he is on the outers with the coaches? Why didn’t the last 2 Wallabies coaches that he was fit to play for not want to pick him? Why did Laporte not pick him? Why is there no scramble amongst the franchises to sign him?

        Is it rugby reasons, is it character reasons, is it bad luck or is it a conspiracy?

        • McWarren

          I think he was referring to Morohan? You’ll have to save your QC bashing for when he is picked this weekend, with any luck.

        • first time long time

          Honestly don’t know. Wish I did because when he is hot he is awesome and has genuine gas which we are sadly lacking at the moment.
          Maybe its attitude. But I don’t get why he was picked against Eng only to drop him after 2 min play.
          Thats what has me baffled.

  • Robbo_76

    I’ve enjoyed reading everyone’s vents about the weekend…my turn :)

    – Despite what some contend, I don’t think Simmons was the problem on Saturday night, Moore’s throws were out by about 2m. Simmons ended up with far more tackles than Douglas and i can’t believe he was replaced when he was. I don’t mind if we make a change here (I would retain Simmons and elevate Coleman), but Douglas was so unimpressive that i would move him to the bench.

    – I like Hooper, but he was quite ineffective on Saturday – time to give Pocock back no. 7 and get some taller options in the back row to support the line out. It is a shame because he tries to hard, but he is not as good as Pocock and we do need to move forward.

    – Moore…we need to try others here, not TPN who is a good bench option, but either Chibber or Ready

    – I really can’t find a place for Phipps in the team…good on him for his efforts which exceed most others, but he is blocking Frisby or Stirzackr…one of them must play with Genia this year

    – Mumm – please can we move on from him

    – Foley – i have no idea why he keeps getting selected….people’s anti-Cooper approach has blinded them to thinking that Foley is our best option. Foley is so far off the boil. I’d like to see Foley return to the bench where i think he can offer some finishing that our 3 defensive back selections fro the weekend would not have been able to even without injuries.

    – Kuridrani – i agree he needs a rest, either Folau to replace him or Kerevi, but Kerevi must be in the side as either 12 or 13

    – We really need some speed on the wings – not sure how far away Speight is, but it would be great to see him back. Morahan is worth investing in for the short term

  • Adrian

    6:2 Bench: Ready, Robertson, Alaalatoa, Douglas, Houston, Hooper, Phipps, Hodge

    • Kevino

      Two back bench after last weekend? Really not sure about that.

      • Adrian

        True, but backline injuries don’t happen like that very often. Hooper can cover centre and wing at a pinch.

    • McWarren

      No McMahon? Is he injured or don’t you rate him?

      • Adrian

        No, I do rate him, and it came down to a toss up between him and Douglas for the bench…mainly because of Douglas’s size and weight. IF such a team ever got picked, McMahon would be cover for both Pocock and Hooper.
        The idea is to have more lineout options, from strong guys

        • brumby runner

          That’s got to be a joke Adrian? More lineout options with Skelton (no option) and Timani (half an option). If anything, that lineout lineup would fare worse than last week’s efforts.

        • Adrian

          Not a joke, because guys like Simmons, Carter, Mumm are totally ineffective when put under pressure.
          Coleman, Douglas, Timani, Leroy Houston because of their physical attributes are better under pressure. You can therefore have Skelton, who won 9 lineouts this year (1 less than McCalman). My team has Hooper on the bench.
          My points are all about how they go under pressure, not how they go at training. The fact that we have these episodes of loosing imports lineouts when Simmons and Co play, but not when Skelton plays shows.
          I predicted exactly what happened in GAGR last week.

  • Gavin

    You know things are bad in Australian rugby when the calls for Quade Cooper to be included are more prominent

    • Brisneyland Local

      Gav from your comments so far it is fairly evident you are not a Quade fan. What other option do we have?
      Foley isnt one, which is evident from his last four matches. So who?

      • Gavin

        We can’t conjure a great #10 out of thin air. Foley is not in good form and I would prefer to select someone more likely to play well. Foley is capable of more and he is capable of controlling a game.

        To propose that the answer is Quade Cooper makes no sense. Cooper is not capable of delivering at this level, he has proven time and again and his career has fallen off the rails since he last put on a Wallabies jersey. There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Cooper will be an improvement on Foley, and everything to suggest that he won’t be. At least if you stick with Foley you know there is a chance he will be better than last weekend.

        If Foley is to be thrown to the lions to please the galleries then the only option is Debreczeni, and he has had a poor 2015.

        • Brisneyland Local

          Yes he is, he has more wins as a 10 Against the All blacks than Foley. Foley has never been the 10 for a victory over the all blacks. So to say he is not capable of delivering at tis level is a completely eroneous and emotive statement.
          The last 4 matches Foley has demonstrated that he does not have the kicking game to play at this level. Even all my die hard Warratahs mates are saying he has to go, so this is not the bleeting of a Queenslander!.
          That said he (Foley) has a good distribution game. I am not a Foley hater, but he is not cutting the mustard, so until he gets his form back we put someone else in. Cheika wouldnt have him in the squad if he didnt think he offers us something.

        • Gavin

          “Foley has never been the 10 for a victory over the all blacks”
          Foley started at #10 for the last victory Australia has had over the all blacks.

          Foley is not the best #10 in the world and is in bad form. The answer is never to replace a player in a short spell of bad form with a player in a long (years) spell of bad form. At some point when you play poorly for so long is it because the player is in poor form or the player is just poor? There are no tangible rugby reasons for selecting Cooper right now.

          If he wants to prove that the last 5 years of his career were a blip then he needs to roll up his sleeves and get back to basics at Super Rugby or against lesser international opposition. Throwing him into the lions den is not going to do him or Australia any favours. It will just kill any hope of seeing the 2010 Quade Cooper again.

        • Brisneyland Local

          We will agree to disagree, and I reckon we will see next Sat night, because Foley has already been booted.

        • Gavin

          In fairness, we won’t agree to disagree that Foley has never played in a side that beat the all blacks, the premise of your argument.

        • Brisneyland Local

          Not the premise but a major part, yes I have one statistic wrong. How many victories over the All Blacks has QC been the 10 for prey tell? That is the tenent of my argument!

        • teach

          To be fair, how many 10s of any team can claim to have a victory over the ABs in recent years.

        • Adrian

          Has team been announced, or are you guessing Brisney?

        • Brisneyland Local

          I am hearing things! From insiders! So probably as accurate as guessing!

        • first time long time

          Good as gospel for me! At least it is something to hold on to.

        • jamie

          Gav, we were on the way to losing when Foley was at 10. Toomua (and Nic White) coming on was when we won that game. Not Phipps-Foley.

          Toomua’s (@ 10) grubber to AAC and then Nic White’s snipe were the only tries the backs had any part in, and Foley was off the field for both of them.

          And I back Cooper. Foley has been disappointing ever since the England game in RWC15. Against Argentina he was good, but apart from that, he’s just coasted off the Forward’s (or Izzy’s individual efforts) actually scoring tries, for the most part.

          Cooper’s ceiling is higher than Foley’s, but so is his worst.

        • first time long time

          Banging head against wall here.
          The guy you are saying is in a long spell of bad form has a better test record the Foley.

          Also Foley started in the last victory over the ABs but we were behind until he and Phipps were replace with 1/2 and hour to go.
          Not a resounding enforcement of his game that night.

        • Willem Labuschagne

          Good point – I had forgotten Nick White’s heroics!

        • first time long time

          it is blatantly obvious that Foley cannot control a game on a regular basis.
          He kicking is terrible.
          He is often out of position.
          He is hidden away in defence.
          The list could go on.
          Cooper isn’t going fix all our problems but give it a go

        • McWarren

          Gav, his form is very hard to gage since that Autumn tour. He has been injured a lot since then, when he came back for Reds after injury he was, I feel, expected to be the fix all. I said it a million times, if we had persisted with Cooper the way we have with Foley we’d have a 10 we could build a game around. If our forwards had shown some heart during the 2011 RWC and stuck up for him he could have led the wallabies for years.
          I am a fan of Foley, I am but he could do with competition that Cooper will bring. I think Foley hit his straps when under pressure from Cooper. Our lack of backline options in all positions should dictate we keep both in the squad and both given opportunities.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          You make some good points although Cheika himself said Cooper had the X Factor – whatever that means – and then didn’t pick him at all. I think you’ll see him this week but I agree it may not be the best move

        • Willem Labuschagne

          Foley is good when he is confident and terrible when he is not. Cooper is good when he is confident and terrible when he is not. How can we improve the confidence of whoever plays 10? Give him experienced players around him to help process the rapid flow of information. We’re not going to be able to do that at 12 because Giteau is injured. But at 9 we have Genia. Who will benefit more from Genia’s brain? Not Foley — Cooper! They have a long history of collective problem-solving. So Cooper should logically play. QED.

  • Adrian

    I hope Carter doesn’t join Simmons, with Mumm on the bench to supposedly “fix” the lineout.

    That’s like picking 3 club medium pacers because you don’t have a fast bowler……or picking 3 medium pacers in Sri Lanka because you don’t have a spinner…

    Unfortunately, right now we don’t have lineout guys who can withstand pressure, though Coleman and Arnold may come good.

    I’d cop Simmons etc (who cant make an impact in anything else),….if they could win when it’s really needed, but they can’t.

    • Willem Labuschagne

      Why are we not talking more about Arnold? He did pretty well in Super Rugby against NZ line outs.

      • Adrian

        Think he’s injured.
        I like him too

      • Adrian


  • rossco

    since when do Wallaby Wingers so routinely get burned off on the outside?

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Sorry guys but too funny not to post

    • first time long time

      There is something not right about that picture……..
      Thats it, how come Foley and Hooper are still in it? ; )

  • first time long time

    For anyone who cares and missed this on my other post, here are the stats behind my statement that Cooper has a better test record than Foley.

    By these numbers and Foley’s current form we would be crazy not to give Cooper a run. What have we got to lose? Whats another record loss?
    Tell you what, it will hurt more if we get pumped and didn’t try anything different.

    Cooper 63% form 58 matches
    at home 72%
    away 52%

    Foley 53% from 31 matches
    at home 54%
    away 43%

    Bledisloe cup
    Cooper 22%
    Foley 21%

    Rugby Champ
    Cooper 57%
    Foley 55%

    v Argentina
    Cooper 100% from 4 matches
    Foley 80% from 5 matches

    v England
    Cooper 33% from 6 matches
    Foley 16% from 6 matches

    v New Zealand
    Cooper 20% from 10 matches
    Foley 21% from 7 matches

    v South Africa
    Cooper 67% from 12 matches
    Foley 50% from 2 matches

    V France
    Cooper 67% from 3 matches
    Foley 75% from 4 matches

    v Ireland
    Cooper 50% from 5 matches
    Foley 0% from 1 match

    v Wales
    Cooper 80% from 5 matches
    Foley 100% from 3 matches

    • first time long time

      for the percentage purposes a draw constitutes 1/2 a win

  • Keith Butler

    Much as I think LT is a very good player with loads of potential I don’t see him as a lock but as a 6 or possibly an 8. Dean Mumm doesn’t cut it for me. Coleman and Arnold would be the future pairing for me. Tall timber and young with 3 years to develop into a top class pair in time for the 2019 RWC. Stephen Moore once a great player but past his use by date. Still not convinced by the back row. Think we need a genuine 8 at 8. Really odd to see McCalman packing there all evening (until he went off) with the 6 jersey on – go figure. Masterclass of lock play from Retallick by the way. That lineout take from Douglas was clinically awesome

  • Gavin

    Cooper would be a foolish choice on every level.

    If Cheika caves into the knee-jerk demands to pick a washed up player who has proven time and again to be out of his depth at test level and has played f.a. rugby in the last year then he may as well resign now.

    If Foley is to be axed then you would be better off calling in someone like Debreczeni. He had a bad year but at least he has potential.

  • Brisneyland Local

    Not that I know of, but I do have terrible amnesia!

  • first time long time

    Certainly need something significantly different and that might work.
    I know you pick players to compliment others but usually it is to compliment and augment their strengths not to compensate for their deficiencies.
    Honestly I don’t think there is a team selection that will win us the game on the weekend (did I mention that I have coughed up a chunk of change to fly over for it, more fool me) but we have to pick some guys who are going to attack and defend with real intent.

  • first time long time

    If I wasn’t married I’d wear gold in the hope of a sympathy root! But she’d probably beat me up too!

  • McWarren

    Look I realise it’s a stretch, but these guys should have been in the training camp at the expense of the old and out of form. We can’t get those 5 weeks over again. So get these young blokes on the bench or in the team for the rest of the RC. They get experience before heading to Europe. I won’t quibble over which new faces but there has to be carte Blanche change from now.


Wallabies, Waratahs and Northern Suburbs supporter. Twitter: @Hughadams01

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