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Monday’s Rugby News

Monday’s Rugby News

Monday’s Rugby News has Tolu Latu in trouble, Raelene Castle telling all, Sam Warburton talking up Wales and a Wallabies camp with a surprise few inclusions.


Mr. Discipline

latu

In case you’re having a bad Monday morning, think about Tolu Latu.

News Corp reported on Saturday arvo that Latu was found by police at 430am on Thursday morning asleep in his car; when breath tested, he came out with a reading of 0.135 and was charged with drink-driving. At this moment, he’s currently getting the hard-copy of the Folau book thrown at him in an integrity meeting.

On top of that, Latu was also driving on a suspended licence, and will go to court to sit on the naughty chair on 6 June. Neither Latu, or the police it appears, informed the Waratahs’ office about the charge.

As the story was only first reported hours before the Tahs-Reds game in Brisbane, Latu, already named on the teamsheet, still went on to play on Saturday night. Action has been swift on Latu, with the hooker also being kicked out of Wallabies camp.

NSWRU CEO Andrew Hore confirmed that Latu couldn’t be dropped because there had been no formal process over his potential breach of the code-0f-conduct.

“We checked with SANZAAR and with Rugby Australia in and around the facts we did have and there was nothing we could clarify that it was a breach of the code of conduct,” Hore said, according to Fox Sports. “As far as we are aware, he’s an innocent man until there has been a formal investigation.”

In an ironic twist, Latu’s currently ex-, and soon to be co-ex-, -teammate Folau is now on the same page as RA when it comes to condemning drunkards.

Ya Just Can’t

Screenshot_2

RA CEO Raelene Castle has said many things about the Folau to rugby.com.au over the weekend. The interview is lengthy, and it goes over a lot of the same ground that’s been run over a million times in the last few weeks.

One of the more interesting parts is where Castle reveals the discussions she had with Folau, adding that she would had to have had a “really good crystal ball” to know that Folau would post again.

“What I had was some conversations with Israel where I believed we were clear that he understood where the line was. From where I sit, he signed a new contract and that contract had the same code of conduct in it, it had the same values, it had the same expectations set out.

“He also completed some significant training around what was offensive in certain communities. So I believed that he understood what was respectful and was disrespectful.”

There was no ‘social media clause’ on Folau’s contract, as Castle says she was sure through the interactions between the two, that Folau wouldn’t do what he did.

“We would have…liked an additional clause that gave us extra protection, but the reality is this is a collective agreement and you can’t add clauses that are to the detriment of the player.

“You can add positive clauses: more money, more shoes, more cars. But you can’t add more clauses that are detrimental to the player unless you have the players association’s and also Israel Folau’s consent.

“That consent was not given from the player so that makes it very hard. Off the back of that conversation we gave to Israel and his manager a second letter that made our expectations of his social media use clear.

“And then I also sat down in person and had that very specific conversation with Israel about my expectations, in relation to his new contract and in relation to the impact his 2018 postings had had. We explained to him we couldn’t have a situation like that again because the impact on the game was just far too great.”

Acknowledging the situation was “sad”, Castle also pressed home why other sports may be looking towards RA’s stance.

“If you (a professional athlete) don’t feel comfortable and marrying up with the values of that organisation, and the expectations that organisation has with your particular views or values, then maybe you shouldn’t sign that contract. And I think that’s a consideration more athletes need to take.

“They often don’t even read the contract. Their player manager puts it in front of them and says ‘Sign this, it’s all good to go’. But this will, I believe, ensure that players need to think long and hard before they sign their contract.”

Warburton: It’s War(burton)

Sam the Man

Former Wales captain Sam Warburton is doing Michael Cheika’s job for him, telling Rugby Pass that Wales are “genuinely the better team” ahead of the World Cup encounter in a couple of months’ time.

“Wales have done a lot of things right in the past 10 years when they have played Australia,” said the 29-year-old, who retired hurt from rugby last year.

“Wales have had the taking of Australia in the last 10 years but when you look at videos back, it’s literally just been one or two examples of perhaps where they might have left a try or not taking a three-point opportunity which has been the difference between the two teams.

“They have beaten them recently in the November series in 2018, which is great from a psychological point of view because you don’t want to be doing press conferences as a player and being asked questions that you haven’t won since 2008, so that monkey has gone, that’s off the back.

“Both teams have been so close in recent years – but Wales are genuinely the better team at this moment in time.”

Wales, the current Six Nations champs and Grand Slammers, will definitely lose to the Wallabies on Saturday 29 September.

Wallabies Camp

Jordan Petaia bundels Cameron Clark into touch

Cheika and the selection panel have handpicked around 41 players to convene for marshmallows and ghost stories this week in Brisbane, under the pretense of a Wallabies camp. The exact list is unknown, according to rugby.com.au it’s because “the player numbers frequently change, and are said to be not neccesarily reflective of a player’s standing as far as World Cup chances go.”

But, there are a few names added onto the usual suspects. Fast-talkin’ Greg Clark’s son, the tough-tacklin’ Cam, will be there;  Alex Mafi, Jordan Petaia, Harry Hockings and Chris Feauai-Sautia are representing the Reds; while Christian Leali’ifano, James Slipper, Toni Pulu and Rob Valentini (Brumbies) and Matt To’omua, Luke Jones, Quade Cooper and Jordan Uelese (Rebels) will also be saying hi.

Big names not there will be Karmichael Hunt; Brendan Paenga-Amosa and Tate McDermott; and Locky McCaffrey and Pete Samu. As mentioned above, Tolu Latu will attend the camp.

The wannabe Wallabies will get together, talk tactics and have a few light training sessions with Cheika & co on Monday morning at Ballymore.

  • Steve

    “Wales have had the taking of Australia the past 10 years”

    Let this be a lesson to all of you: NOONE beats Wales 14 times in a row (RIP Vitas)

    • onlinesideline

      geeze after a 15 year career you’d think he’d have learnt something about laying low, especially after 13 straight loses – like, I dunno, showing some respect to your upcoming opponents and then doing the business on the field.

      • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

        How isn’t he showing respect? Wales genuinely are the better team. They just won a Grand Slam and have won about 15 in a row, while the Wallabies have been horrendous since the last world cup.

        • onlinesideline

          over that horrendousness we beat them 13 times in a row. Ill back Australia, you can back Wales.
          Grand Slam, Grand Shmam

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          We certainly didn’t beat Wales 13 times from 2016-18…

          I never said I would back Wales, but I did say they are indisputably the better side at present. Look at respective results over the last 12-18 months, and there is not even a comparison.

        • onlinesideline

          why is it undisputable ? Lets see them string 15 in a row regularly playing southerners. They have beaten us once in 10 years by 3 points. Under Cheika – In 2015 they couldnt beat us with only 13 players on the pitch, in 2016 we smacked them 32-8, in 2017, we beat them 29-21. One win in 2018 and all of a sudden they have our measure ? I go by their record against us not by matches against other teams. You claim is eminently disputable. Look at the results.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Your final sentence is logic, that would mean Australia are a better team than Wales, but England and Ireland are better teams than Australia, and Wales are a better team than England and Ireland.

          The fact is that the better team is determined by their overall results against the entire field, not single matchups. Otherwise, during the Deans era when we were number 2 in the world, Scotland, who were about number 8, would have been a better team than us during your logic, as they had our number.

          The facts are that over the last 18 months Wales has a record we could only dream of, are (I believe) number 2 in the world and trending upwards, and have beaten England and
          Ireland and the Boks twice as well as ourselves.

          Australia may win in the world cup as we match up well against Wales and traditionally do well in world cups, but at this specific point in time there is no argument hat stands up to any sort of scrutiny that Australia is better than Wales.

        • onlinesideline

          “Australia may win in the world cup as we match up well against Wales”
          I thought you just said they are indisputably the better team, so how do we or how will we match up well against them ? Strange contradiction dont you think ? Are you now going to tell me our man for man match up trumps their no 2 rankings v our no 6 rankings. They are either better than us or not. What does match up mean to you ?

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          No contradiction. Australia were a far superior team to Scotland during the Deans era but struggled with them due to the match up and the fact they had a mental edge over us.

          I think I was pretty clear why we may win against them, unless you cannot comprehend the fact we may have the mental edge over them and we tend to do well in world cups. Can you seriously not understand that logic, or are you looking for an argument?

          Edit: or we may improve by the World Cup and be a superior team to Wales overall. But at this exact moment, we’re not.

        • onlinesideline

          So I WAS THE ONE who claimed above the Wallabies have the mental edge due to our 13 wins and YOU were the one who implied that was meaningless as, as of today thei Welsh win / loss ratio was excellent and they have no 2 ranking.

          And now YOU claim YOU said above we have the mental edge AND NOT WALES.

          You change your opinion faster than the speed of light mate. Maybe you should look up the word “confused” before you claim a monopoly on “logic”

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          No, all I said is that Wales are indisputably a better team at this precise moment in time.

        • onlinesideline

          You said the below words above as well a few minutes ago.

          “I think I was pretty clear why we may win against them, unless you cannot comprehend the fact we may have the mental edge over them”

          where above were you pretty clear we may win against them ?

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Go look at my comment three comments back, final paragraphs. I’m pretty clear.

        • onlinesideline

          so you’re saying:

          my original and first claim we have the mental edge has no basis
          then you say we DO have the mental edge
          then you say they are far better than us at present” we can only dream”
          then you say we match up well against them

          And you accuse me of not understanding basic logic.

          Okey Dokey then

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I didn’t claim we didn’t have a mental edge on Wales generally, you’re trying to deflect and distract from the initial point, which was me asking you to justify your claim that Warburton was showing a lack of respect to the Wallabies by saying Wales were a better team right now.

          Wales are a better team right now. All results and trends over the last year indicate this.

        • onlinesideline

          where did I deflect or distract ? I answered your question directly the very next comment. I said his comment was disrespectful considering that out of the 14 matches we played agaist them, despite the fact that many were close, we were the ones who won 13 straight. I couldnt have been clearer.

          On that basis, despite them winning the most recent match by 3 points I thought his claim they “have had the taking on Australia” disrepectful and that they were only an option away or a try away from reversing the results.

          You were the one who raised the issue about the present Welsh global rankings which really has NOTHIG to do with my claim that he was being disrespectful.

          Who can deny the are playing well, but what has that got to do with my claim that he was being disrectful ? He trashed our victories over the “last 10 years” – read what he said – You passed opinion on whether he was justified in saying they could take us today. Two different things.

          That is what you call deflection !!

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Why is our results from 2009-15 or even 09-17 results relevant on how good Australia and Wales are in 2019?

        • onlinesideline

          and you accuse me of deflecting – lololol !!!!!!!!

          Where above did I suggest that ?????

          That is a COMPELTELY RANDOM assumption

          After I made an initial comment saying Warburtton’s trashing of our 13 straight victories was disrespectful YOU were the one who introduced the TOTALLY IRRELEVANT TANGENT of the Welshs PRESENT DAY FORM.

          And YOU accuse me of delfecting ?? You have got to be kidding.

          What has the welshs present day form got to do with my claim he was being disrespectful re 13 straight victories ?

          So they are playing well today – so what. I referred to his trashing of our victories over a ten year period.

          You totally ignore every rebuttal and introduce totally NEW and RANDOM and IRRELEVANT questions as your answers.

          Im gonna call it now – YOU TROLL people on this site. Period !!

          Im totally out with you dude, today and in the future. Sick of your daily rubbish.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          But he didn’t disrespect our 13 straight victories?

        • onlinesideline

          Your a troll mate.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Not really, you made a silly comment about Warburton allegedly disrespecting the Wallabies by saying Wales are currently a better team than Australia, and have been unable to justify it.

          The reason being, because Wales are a better team than the Wallabies.

        • onlinesideline

          Your reading comprehension skills are obviously as impotent as your inane “facts” and “logic” you bore everyone with daily.

          I would say the fact that you counter just about ever persons comment on here incessantly makes you the sites only troller. Just look at the statement you make above. Another ficticious and irrelevent tangent that no-one understands but you.

          I would say losing 0 -13 consectutive matches over tens years and then saying, “we have had the taking over Australia for 10 years” is disrespectful in anyones language and to suggest it isnt by you is not just silly, but gratutious countering. You retrofit, twist and turn all over the site.

          You are a troll mate pure and simple. If you have nothing else to do, go for it. If its not me your are trolling you are trolling someone else on here with these painfully tedious never ending threads that never make any sense are never interesting and seem to come from a bloke who needs to get a life. But as I said, go for it mate. You’ll find someone else tomorrow to argue with Im sure. You have flooded the site with your rubbish for years just as your response to my initial comment was utter rubbish as well.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          It would be nice if people went back to actually discussing facts, and reality, rather than their gut feel and emotion. People like yourself saying things like “employers can’t restrict what you can say” or Go the Queensland Reds saying that “once you’re arrested for a crime, you’re guilty of it” are actually just factually wrong. The problem is, when you spread that information, other people might be convinced, and then the ignorance spreads.

          In regard to whether Wales ‘disrespected’ us, 7 of the matches were within a converted try. By definition, they’re games that could have gone either way. While we undoubtedly had the wood over Wales during that period, it is wrong to pretend that the 13-0 record is indicative of how much better we were than Wales over that period. Often, we were very evenly matched teams.

        • onlinesideline

          If you are going to talk about facts, why dont you stick to the content of the comment you are commenting on. That would help a lot of people on this site see you as someone that can read and comprhend a sentence, instead of emotiveley imprinting whats in your head onto whats being said.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          ‘instead of emotiveley imprinting whats in your head onto whats being said.’

          You mean like misinterpreting what one of the modern greats of our game, and someone who has always displayed the highest character on and off the field, as being disrespectful of the Wallabies?

        • onlinesideline

          Modern greats ?? – this great got the ball 3 times in 7 minutes against a Wallaby side with 2 players in the sin bin and he couldnt even come close to scoring even with an overlap and being 15 meteres out. Que RWC 2015.

          Misrepresent ?? – I dont know what else you need to read of what Warbuton said and was qouted as saying above for you to comprend clearly what the meaning is.

          What part of “WALES HAVE HAD THE TAKING OF AUSTRALIA” do you NOT understand. If you are having trouble getting it, admit it.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I interpreted those words as meaning that Wales were in a lot of those matches, and could easily have won if they’d taken their opportunities or they’d had a bit more luck.

          Did you interpret them differently?

        • Funk

          I don’t even know who is going to be in the Wallabies team “at this precise moment”?

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          You could use that logic on any Thursday before the team is announced though. Based on the last 12 months, there’s no evidence we’re as good as Wales. None.

        • Funk

          “You could use that logic on any Thursday before the team is announced though.”…Exactly!!!

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          But using that logic you can never ever compare teams, because they can always differ match to match?

        • Funk

          Yes you can.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          But under what grounds/circumstances does it make sense to do so?

        • Funk

          - key player injuries/suspensions/contracts torn up
          – who are the replacement players
          – emerging players
          – coaches favorites form
          – other players’ form
          – game plan
          – coaching
          – new selection panel
          – undecided coaching team
          – world cup/knock out scenarios
          Should I go on?
          This makes a lot more sense to me rather than comparing the Wallabies Annus horribilis to Wales Annus mirabilis, and the one and only game they have played against each other in the last 12 months where Wales won by 3 penalties to 2 in one of the most dour games of rugby to ever be telecast!!! Then coming to the conclusion that “Wales are indisputably a better team at this precise moment in time”
          I’m not trying to say that the Wallabies are a better team than Wales, rather that there is quite a lot to dispute in your statement that Wales are a better team.

        • onlinesideline

          Be careful mate – thats approaching too higher a level of sense for this thread. Some people can’t take it

        • Who?

          You’re trying to make a prediction based on truly unknown and unknowable factors. I know we could put together a great Wallabies team today, but game plan, coaching, selection panel… That’s all totally unknowable.
          .
          So the only fair way to compare form at this present time is to go off last year. And it’s not just last year as an annus horribilis for Australian Rugby – it’s continuing a trajectory under this present coach. He’s sacked his attack coach – our attack wasn’t our major issue. He still has the same defence coach. The new selection panel has said they’ll given new perspectives for Cheika to consider, but there’s no guarantee he’ll consider them, and they’ve ultimately said he’s got to be responsible for the team. So to say, “We’ve got some great players in form and new coaching structures,” means nothing about certainty of outcomes going forward.
          .
          If – IF – we were to get good selections, good coaching, everything going our way, there’s no reason why with our current playing stocks we shouldn’t go very close to winning Bill. But you’d never get me putting money on it from where we currently sit…… Because that’s too many ducks for Mandrake to align.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Exactly right mate.

          Also, even if we put a great team together, it is more difficult to click after only a few matches than after building for 2+ years.

          Wallabies may well beat wales at the World Cup. But the current evidence doesn’t support it.

        • GO THE Q REDS

          I personally love a good debate. I know others often see this stuff as arguments or fights! Some can’t keep it a debate! Your in a league of your own here…… I’ve often debated Mr Braithwaite and as you’ve very smartly uncovered, he’s all over the place! Harsh…. but true!

        • onlinesideline

          mate you have a sharp eye and you are BANG ON. I took a sceenshot of his comments early on and loe and behold you called it perfectly. I just had a gut feeling today and there you go.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          If you say so. But given some of your efforts to try and explain crimes to me last night, and some of onlinesideline’s efforts, I personally take that as a compliment.

        • onlinesideline

          Dont be too flattered mate. At least I dont retrofit edit my comments 9 paragraphs up to fit my new convaluted, make absolutely no sense, contradictory, totally incomprehensibel gibberish, make sense,

        • Andy

          Give Dazza a break! I like his posts.

        • GO THE Q REDS

          Yeah all good. All’s fair in love n war. Onto the next one….

        • Garry

          Be confident. It’s a brave man who puts his hard earned on the Cheika WB’s to beat anyone, despite any tasty odds.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I think the WBs may well win, we play well against Wales and do well in world cups.

          But that doesn’t mean we’re currently a better side than Wales. There is just no evidence to support that claim.

        • Uncle Tony

          I still don’t think there’s much between these two teams. Outside of Cardiff it’s anyone’s game.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          You could be right. But the results over the last 12-18 months don’t support that claim.

        • Uncle Tony

          Still lots of time to go before the RWC, Ireland have gone from being world beaters to back amongst the pack in the space of 3-4 months.

          I’d like to think that the Aus super rugby teams winning a few games has helped the general psychology of the team.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Yeah, and you could be right, no one knows the future. But we aren’t talking about 4 months time, we’re talking about the present, which can only be judged on recent history and results.

    • Kiwi rugby lover

      Bahahawahaha

      • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

        Wales are obviously a superior team to the Wallabies currently. We’ve lost two home series in a row, haven’t had a winning season since the last world cup, have lost 6 in a row to England and struggled against everyone.

        Wales are currently the best northern hemisphere side, are on a 15 match win streak or something and finally beat the Wallabies.

        Anyone who thinks that Australia are better than the Wallabies currently is ignorant or just a chest thumping patriot letting their emotions govern their opinions.

        • Andy

          I think they are better, no doubt. But there isn’t much between 2-8 in the global rankings and I think if the game were played between the 2 teams today it could still go either way.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Absolutely. I mean, we beat the All Blacks in 2017. Wallabies could easily make a world cup semi-final or a final, and then anything could happen.

          The difference between 2-8 is, I think, that New Zealand and Wales have proven that they can currently perform almost every week. Those other teams can only perform on their days.

        • Hoss

          Come on Sherbert, is Australia really better than the Wallabies though………..

        • Funk

          I think we could take them now that Izzy is riding the pew…

        • onlinesideline

          An irrelevant tangent not uncommon for you. Steve at the top of the thread implied that Warbuttons comment that the “Welsh have had the taking of Australia” as being ridculous. Stick to the content of the comment instead of misrepresenting what people say !

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Warburton’s words were fairly amobigious, and I think you interpreted them in the most offensive way possible, and in a way I don’t think he intended. Seems like you were looking to take offence.

      • onlinesideline

        Steve wasnt commenting about Warbuttons claim the Wallabies are doable today !

        Steve was saying, that considering the Welsh lost 13 straight over ten years, its a bit rich that Warbutton could say “the Welsh have had the taking over the Wallabies for last 10 years”.

        No-one is disputing the Welsh look today.

        • Who?

          I actually agree with Warburton, though. Generally, they weren’t far off taking us most of that time. Most of those games, it was mental edge. Certainly, in 2012, they deserved the win (Beale at 10 scored a very late try for the win, after a very patchy game. Sharpie retired off the end of it, striking his attempt at conversion well, but missing, from memory). 2014, I thought they were close. We had quite a number of rather close games.
          .
          Even last year, if you looked at form going into the game, they should’ve smashed us. And we didn’t play well on the day. From where I was sitting, it looked like two teams trying desperately to lose the game – the Wallabies because they’d fallen out of the habit of winning, and Wales because they couldn’t comprehend they could beat us.
          ,
          I don’t take Warburton’s statement as disrespectful, because he didn’t say that Wales deserved to win in that streak, that Australia was lucky, he just identified there were missed opportunities for a win. And I think he’s right.
          .
          Then he identified that, on current form (as in, last 12 months of Test Rugby), you’re looking at an Australian team who don’t know how to win, and who lost to Wales, whereas Wales beat Australia AND won the 6N’s. On that form, Wales are clearly superior.
          .
          I really don’t know why anyone’s beating this up into controversy……….
          .
          The point about Scotland and Australia under Deans is relevant, because whilst we outranked Scotland, they have been a bogey team for us ever since Deans. In the same way, even when Wales was doing well in Europe and beating SA, we were their bogey team. They couldn’t beat us, even when they could beat England and Ireland, and those two teams have handed us our own backsides regularly, if not consistently (certainly consistently under Cheika, but England even beat us 2 from 3 in 2010 under Deans).

        • onlinesideline

          I actually agree with Warbuttons assessment we are beatable today. Never denied it. But re the 13 straight loses, I do find it disrespectful to say they “had the taking”. It was 13 consecutive loses and it was over 10 years. Winners are grinners and the aim of the game is to win at the 80 minute mark. We put ourselves in a position to win the close games by being consistently in with a chance and making it happen. The mental edge only came after consistently doing it. Its an added bonus we earnt and it legit as any other reason.

          Its easy to toe the could of, should of, would of line. We have lost a number of matches against the kiwis by 5 points or less over the last 10 years as well. A few by even less. Can we say, we were a try away or a missed opportunity away from getting on top of them in reality. I dont thnk we can. Are the comparable situations. Somewhat.

          Its all about winning and you have to say Warbutton knows it. I thought it didnt respect Autralia enough. It was 13 consecutive losses mate. A team doesnt win that much without having something substantially better going on.

        • Who?

          I don’t think it’d be disrespectful to NZ to say there are games where we had the taking of NZ, but didn’t. Because it’s often mental edge, mental fragility. And in a lot of those tight losses for Wales, that’s where it was. It was the earned mental edge the Wallabies had.
          .
          That edge was earned from 2008, through 2009 (where Gits and Cooper carved them up in Cardiff), through the 2011 RWC 3rd place match. In 2012, we played them four times – in the last three games, Wales were ahead with 5 minutes left in the match, but the Wallabies snatched the games. The December match, Wales lost Halfpenny to injury before Beale scored a long range try to win it after the siren…
          .
          And even last year, you could see they didn’t believe they deserved to win. It was off the mental edge earned from years of wins, reinforced by having the Wallabies steal the
          .
          I don’t see it as unfair to say, “We did enough that we could’ve won, we just didn’t.” It doesn’t imply a lack of respect for the opposition. It does say, “We didn’t win.” It takes responsibility for the loss, without taking credit from the winning team. After all, in saying, “We could’ve won,” Warburton’s admitting that they – especially himself, personally, as captain for so many of those losses – were never quite good enough to get the job done. And that’s gotta sting.

        • onlinesideline

          But Warbutton was implying they had the taking on us for 10 years. I find that very odd that could be the case and yet they lose every time. His comments failed to credit Australia at all. A team doesnt get over the line 13 times in a row no matter how tight without being substantially better. I find the statement, “we did enough but just didnt” etc a denialas to the reality that we all know about sport. That the just “didnt” is everything as is just “doing it” or just “win” itis everything. . The fact that the Wallabies “did it’ counts for substantially higher playing levels, even if it was tight.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I think this has been the cause of our discussions all day. I didn’t interpret him as meaning that Wales were a better team over those years or we were undeserving of our streak.

          Only that plenty of matches could have gone either way, and that Wales were unlucky / Australia were lucky that the Wallabies dominated the rivalry for so long.

        • Steve

          I think one just has to accept results sometimes DBTB. Even assuming the teams were evenly matched (ie the matches were decided by a coin toss), the odds of one team winning 13 in a row is about 0.01%. So at a certain point you have to accept that the Wallabies have been systematically better over that period.

          Would I bet on the Wallabies were they to play tomorrow? No. But they have been systematically the better team over the last decade.

        • Who?

          He said they had the taking of us IN the last 10 years. Not FOR the last 10 years. He said they did a lot of things right, but missed a try or a kick here and there and it cost them. Is that inaccurate? Because, in that 10 year period, there was a large number of those 13 games where it was 5 points or less, where we won tight games, where they mentally weren’t up to it. 2012 is the perfect example.
          .
          I don’t believe that the comments failed to credit Australia. They didn’t focus on Australia, that’s all. It’s like me saying that the Wallabies could’ve won in Dunedin the other year. Does that discredit the ABs for the fact they came back and won, after being 17-0 down? I don’t believe so.
          .
          Getting over the line 13 times doesn’t mean you’re substantially better, it means you’ve got an edge. If many of those games are tight, then it’s clearly a mental edge more than a physical edge, the same way the ABs clearly have a mental edge over us. We aren’t significantly poorer players. We have size, strength, skill. They’re not fitter than us. There’s no reason why they should be smarter than us. But every time we go to Eden Park, the 33 year hoodoo comes out to play.
          .
          Winning by a fine margin on multiple occasions doesn’t prove you’re at a substantially higher level (the years we won big, sure, substantially higher level! But not 2012), it proves that you found a way to win, and did enough when it mattered. It’s not skill, not size, not talent. It’s psychology.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I remember under in Deans era, bemoaning the fact that there were so many matches against the All Blacks where we were right in it, but we almost never managed to get over the line in them. Just got a bit unlucky at times, and they had the mental edge.

        • onlinesideline

          The ABs were / are clearly fitter than us, definitely have better technical skills than us, work as a pack better than us, have better and faster counter rucking skills than us, have better decsion making under pressure skills, have man for man more power speed and size than us. How long you got Who ? Its all these that got them over the line in the tight matches. Self belief as well. Pysch skills as well. Its a bunch of stuff. And its the same with the Wallabies. We beat the Welsh consistently because we had better skills ie gits and Quade, we were clearly fitter tahn them for a while as evidenced by our ability to go the extra leg under fatique. These are all aspect of a better team. For that I find it hard to accept Warburtons assessment as denying the reality they were consistently beaten by the better team.

          Ill leave it up to you guys to take it from here. I have a days work to begin here in ole Buda.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I actually think I more or less totally agree.

        • Who?

          It depends on when you’re talking about the ABs. Are you talking 2011? Going into the RWC SF, we’d won the last two, we were every bit as fit, our pack had dominated their pack in the previous game.
          2014? We drew 12-all in Sydney, in a game where Foley stood so deep that Phipps couldn’t pass it to him on the full. People pilloried Phipps, but Foley was worse. They certainly weren’t better at the breakdown than us then.
          .
          If you’re talking 2016, 17, then there’s an argument, but there’s equally an argument that Grey’s openside wing defensive plan requires so much extra fitness compared to your opposition that it’s completely unrealistic at the top level. I’ll give you that they have been more skilled than us the last 4 years, but before that, I’m not nearly so confident.
          What has definitely been consistent in our battles against the ABs is that they are much stronger psychologically, and have an edge over us there. Brad Thorn was on record in 2010 (I think) as saying, when trailing with a few minutes to go, “We all just knew that as long as we did our jobs, we’d get over the line.” That’s the sort of confidence that comes with a winning record. It wasn’t about being better, it was confidence.
          .
          You’re saying we beat the Welsh consistently because we had Gits and Quade. That’s 2009, 10, 11, 13. 2012 we beat them four times, with either Barnes (briefly Mike Harris) or Beale at 10. Beale – especially under Deans – is/was not an international 10. And that was a year when they won the 6N’s, as was 2013. 2014 on, I don’t know that there’s confidence we had better skills or were fitter (given we were consistently said not to be fit enough through 2016/17). But by that point, even when we were losing to Scotland (2009, 2012, 2017 – twice), they couldn’t get close to us.
          .
          I’m not saying we weren’t better than them, I’m not saying that we weren’t occasionally significantly better than them, but I’m definitely saying there were opportunities for Wales to win (which is all Warburton claimed), but they couldn’t do it, and I believe that a good part of that was psychological, as it wasn’t about skill (looking at the team sheets from 2012), it wasn’t about a poor Welsh team (who’d just won the 6N’s, and would repeat the feat). We were their bogey team, and that’s always got a strong psychological edge (just as Scotland have been a bogey team for us, while other teams regularly whip them).

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          This is the reality. It has been a great rivalry for Australia, but one we were very lucky, as well as smart, to dominate for so long.

        • Custard Taht

          I have always thought the Welsh have looked good, though I am hardly impartial….I just love tighty whities, though sometimes the brown stains on their tighty whities are a bit of a turn off.

  • Patrick

    Is Raelene Castle admitting that she wanted to expressly ban what Folau did, but he said no so they couldn’t, and didn’t???

    That’s a really bad fact to take to court with you…

    • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

      Don’t think the case will turn on that. It will purely be on whether there is law in the jurisdiction that applied to Folau and says he cannot have his contract terminated for sharing a religious view.

      • Huw Tindall

        The question is ultimately that simple hey but the answer is not! Assuming there is some protection for freedom of expression it’ll be interesting to see how it stacks up against discrimination/vilification. Pity this distracted from what I’d argue are the two best rounds of Super Rugby in a decade.

    • Pearcewreck

      Yep.
      There wlll be lots of facts that are really bad for RA to take to court, if it gets that far.

  • Cameron Rivett

    But, there are a few names added onto the usual suspects. Fast-talkin’ Greg Clark’s son, the tough-tacklin’ Cam, will be there

    Hoss, if you’re reading this – we called it buddy!

    http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/israel-folaus-contract-terminated/#comment-4418376902

    • Hoss

      Sometimes the word ‘genius’ just fits Rusty.

      It’s a burden you and i must carry in private contemplation mate.

  • Custard Taht

    The Aus conference is pretty much still in play for all 4 Aus teams. The Brumbies have the momentum, the Rebs have the talent, the Tahs have the most Wallabies and the Reds have…….

    Only one Aus team is going to make the finals and I think it will be the Brumbies. The Rebs are just not good enough, long enough, they zone in and out of games too much.

    Prediction for the whole shebangabang, is a Crusaders v Bulls….Crusaders to win.

    • AllyOz

      the Reds have… the capacity to score 2 more tries than their Wallaby stacked opposition but still manage to lose because their kicker couldn’t hit the side of a barn and they gave away too many penalties.

      I really enjoyed the game on the weekend (despite the result). Unfortunately the attendance was only just over 12K (and to be honest it looked like much less in some of the tv shots) – in years past this would have been 30K. I don’t know what that means for the future of the game but if we are only capable of attracting those sort of crowds to a NSW vs Qld derby with both teams still in contention for the finals then I think we have some major worries (not that this is telling you anything you don’t already know).

      • Custard Taht

        I am going to put the Reds issues down to youth. As their experience grows I expect the discipline to improve along with their ability to absorb and handle pressure. Brad Thorn appears to be growing into his role, certainly better than Wessels.

        The crowds for the Reds and super rugby in general are disturbing, but if the Reds continue to play attractive rugby and start banking more wins, the crowds will improve, Brisbane will get behind winners.

        • AllyOz

          Yes I think you are right that the crowds will come back, at least to some degree, with a more consistent winning effort and I think this young side and their coach is starting to come into their own. I am keen to see how they develop further but a loss of Kerevi could impact them heavily next year. Hegarty has been good generally but with only one goal on the weekend his kicking was costly (but no more than the four penalties).

        • Custard Taht

          The loss of Kerevi is huge, however no person is irreplaceable. There is plenty of talent in Qld, and in some ways could be a positive, as it will force the Reds to expand their attack further. I have faith in Jim McKay to transition the Reds away from dependency on Kerevi.

          It has taken a long time, but I think the Reds may have got the right coaching pieces right post McKenzie. I was unsold on Thorne this season, but I think he is developing quite well.

      • onlinesideline

        this site was feverishly debating the future of Super rugby a year ago, now in 2019 with the Fox deal a year closer no-one is talking about it. But boy is it crook. Sadly I suspect a complete overhaul with the saffas going north a pipedream.

        • Custard Taht

          The new deal with foxtel will be interesting, given foxtels financial position.

          I hope Raelene is more competent then she has shown herself to be. The new offer from foxtel probably isn’t going to include more money.

        • Andy

          I really think they need to do what they can to get the product on free to air. Probably won’t happen but that contributed to the Big Bash being so successful.

        • Custard Taht

          Free to air is essential, but alas suspect you are right in that probably won’t happen.

        • Perth girl

          There is going to be less money from Fox not more. They are broke themselves! RA will be broke after they have paid the lawyers and Izzy but I bet Clyne still gets a bonus next year! Of course they could always try cutting another team, that worked pretty well last time they did that didn’t it?

        • AllyOz

          we have been focused on other things lately

        • onlinesideline

          yeah tell us about it

        • Custard Taht

          I quite like debates about freedoms/rights, politics, religion etc, but fark me, even I have had enough. Then throw in the, what almost feels weekly, poor off field behaviour, Cheikas coaching drivel and RAs general incompetence, it is just making it harder and harder
          to remain excited about Rugby.

        • onlinesideline

          Im just holding my breath until post RWC – then it will hopefully all be over.

        • GO THE Q REDS

          I honestly don’t see it ending for a long long time IF Folou takes this to court and looses. That would be massive and effect ALOT of things! Probably not just rugby either…

        • AllyOz

          Don’t get me wrong, I think the reason why there is so much focus on the Folau issue is that it is a very interesting issue and covers so many areas. employee/employer rights, social justice, politics, religion, the legal process, corporate activism, individual rights etc, values, sport and rugby specifically. I am very interested to see how it works out. However, in the last week or so, because there hasn’t really been anything new (apart from confirmation of RA’s initial position/decision) so we are largely hoeing the same ground as we have for the past few weeks.

        • Custard Taht

          That is it in a nutshell.

        • onlinesideline

          The amount of Fox articles on this daily is beyond belief. If every there was clear evidence of a media strategy to milk something for all its worth…..

        • AllyOz

          While at the same time talking about the damage the media coverage of the comments has done to the game.

          Also a lot of non-rugby commentators have felt the necessity to have a say, while they normally don’t have any interest in rugby.

        • Gun

          I think the evidence is in, the crowd numbers indicate the comp is farked. On the back of a reduced sponsorship dollar from super sport and Foxtel I think we will shrink and have to grow the game from the tribes ie clubs. Hopefully the whole thing gets torn down and rebuilt in such a way as it can succeed domestically. At least it will be cheap to sell to FTA and hopefully an internet entertainment company that has worldwide coverage.

      • Bernie Chan

        Hegarty kicked to Rona (?) like he had a target on the guy…

    • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

      Brumbies and Rebels have the advantage of having the Sunwolves still to play.

      • Brumby Runner

        Sunwolves in Japan are no easy beats.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          They haven’t won a match at home this season?

        • Hoss

          But apart from that.

    • Brumby Runner

      Likely a little bit of inconsistency with the predictions. If the Bulls beat the Brumbies this weekend, which you’d think is likely if they are the second best side in the competition, then the Brumbies will most likely drop out of the top 8 in favour of either the Rebels or the Tahs if one or both of them win, or even get a bonus point loss in the case of the Rebels.

      If the Brumbies beat the Bulls, then I can’t see the Bulls getting to the final in a few weeks time.

      • Custard Taht

        Yeah understand that, I see the Rebs winning 1 from 3 (Sunwolves), Brumbies winning 2 from 3 (loss to bulls), and Tahs winning 2 from 3 (Jags and Rebs) but can easily see them losing to the jags.

        • Brumby Runner

          Brumbies are yet to play the Bulls, Sunwolves, Tahs and Reds. 4 games, and I’m pretty sure each of the other sides have four games left too. Those extra games could spell trouble for your calculations Custard.

        • Custard Taht

          Yeah there are 4 rounds left, the fixture page I looked at cut off the last round. Still backing the Brumbies to beat all of those but the Bulls, and still see the Rebs only beating the sunwolves.
          The Tahs I see beating the Rebs and maybe the Jags, but see them losing to the Brumbies and Highlanders.

          As long as the Bulls top their conference they are a chance as they will be the 2 seed. As things stand the Hurricanes are on track to play the Crusaders in the Semis.

      • Pearcewreck

        The Bulls beating the Rebels has helped the Brumbies chances.
        It is tough for the SA teams to back up again after a big win on the road.

    • Keith Butler

      Unfortunately the Rebs blow hot and cold, at the moment decidedly cold. The Wolves this weekend will be a tough one. Even if we get a result I cannot see us knocking over the Tahs and Chiefs at home let alone come close to the Saders. I have a double or nothing side bet with Hoss on the Tahs game and I reckon i’m going to be down 2 bottles of Tassie’s finest wine. Brumbies to make the final the rest out of it.

      • Brisneyland Local

        Bay of Fires Pinot Noir?

        • Custard Taht

          Nah, Coolabah Cask Riesling!

        • Brisneyland Local

          Lady in a Boat!

        • Keith Butler

          Given Hoss’s penchant for stirring up our religious brethren I’m thinking Devils Corner. And a nice drop it is to.

        • Brisneyland Local

          Good idea, and not a bad drop!

        • Hoss

          I was going to ask for a ‘fruity number’, but recent events have me worried they may have all been sent to hell.

      • Custard Taht

        Gotta have faith that the Rebs can turn it around, but there is no evidence to suggest they can.

        • Gallagher

          What do you mean no evidence? How about getting our best pack back? With Jordan Uelese, Adam Coleman, Luke Jones, Isa Naisarani and now Matt Toomua… I’d say we get them back and that’s enough evidence to show they could and will be contenders…

        • Custard Taht

          I would say 1 win out of the last 5 matches is more evidence of their status, than a team that looks good on paper.
          They beat an out of form brumbies twice early in the season. Since their last win against the Brumbies, they have not beaten any actual contenders. They are paper tigers.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Think that’s discrediting them a bit. There only really seems to be two contenders, the Crusaders and Hurricanes.

        • Custard Taht

          Maybe, but they have lost to the Bulls, Sharks, Lions, Stormers and Waratahs . Apart from the Brumbies twice at the start of the season, they have not beaten any decent teams. I firmly believe they got lucky playing the Brumbies so early in the season. Not sure they would beat the brumbies now.

          I maybe discrediting them a bit, but with the team and talent they have, they are discrediting themselves and their fans more.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Didn’t they beat a Saffa team a few weeks ago?

        • Custard Taht

          Pretty sure apart from the sunwolves, the only other o/s team they have beaten is the highlanders. They came close against the lions, lost by 3, but the other 3 saffa teams won comfortably.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Yeah just checked and you’re right. They’ve certainly had a poor second half to the season eh?

        • Custard Taht

          Yep, started great and then faded, and have continued to fade. That is why I am not sure all those returning players will make a difference. As you mentioned, Genia’s form probably has probably had a big impact on the Rebels form.

          The Brumbies are in the box seat, and seem to be getting hot at the right end of the season.

        • Gallagher

          If you think about their back line, they have all performed well overall this year with no major discussions on poor performance, its all been the forwards not being big enough and getting dominated by the larger teams i.e. saffer teams, no solid fetcher or maul either. Hodge and Haylett-Petty missed chunks of the year also. Bring back the Wallaby bulk in Uluese and Coleman and the excellent performed Wallabies in waiting in Jones and Naisarani and the pack is seriously bolstered. They have not capitulated, bar Hurricanes first half, but they have done that to everyone.
          I for one think if their big boys can get back in the last few games, they are seriously in the hunt… Sunwolves and Chiefs should be a walk in the park (two worst teams), that should be enough also considering Highlanders above them are a game ahead and only three points ahead. Throw in a competitive wins/losses to Saders/Tahs as well and they are deep into the top half of the overall ladder…

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Problem for the Rebels is that Genia has fallen out of form and istakig so much time away from the backline, and putting so much pressure on Quade.

          Of course they’ll be much better when they get their three best forwards back. Hard to compete when you lack those guys.

  • Yowie

    “What I had was some conversations with Israel where I believed we were clear that he understood where the line was.”

    “He also completed some significant training around what was offensive in certain communities. So I believed that he understood what was respectful and was disrespectful.”

    “And then I also sat down in person and had that very specific conversation with Israel about my expectations…”

    Hidden camera footage of the conversation uncovered!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2f5MvVx8RM8

    • Damo

      Yowie, so much of what happens at Rugby Australia is scarily Pythonesque. I have a vision of Michael Cheika hanging from the rugby coaching cross for the last 3 years singing “Always look on the bright side…”

  • RF

    I am not sure if this has been covered here but Stephen Larkham has interviewed for the backs coach role at Munster.

    It would be a shame to lose him to Australian rugby.

    • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

      But at least we would keep Cheika happy. Seems to be what matters most to RA.

    • Custard Taht

      I think it could be good for Larkham to go overseas for a few years, and learn things outside of Australia.
      RA and the states have pretty much shown zero aptitude for coaching development. Personally, I think he would come back a more well rounded coach.

      • Kiwi rugby lover

        I agree mate. He isn’t growing here and I think he needs to

      • Andy

        Agree. Better he gets some experience with a top team like Munster who a genuine competitors in the Heineken Cup and come back to Australia at a later date.

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Thanks Nick,

    Boy it’s the gift that keeps on giving. To be fair to Raelene, I’m not sure there’s too much more she could have done as I don’t see Folau ever admitting he did anything wrong. It’s certainly a fucked situation and I don’t see any winners in the long term.
    I hope there are no injuries from this camp, interesting names not involved and may be a pointer to some people missing out who may have thought they were a shoe in.
    Love the way the media is starting on the RWC discussions with players. Of course it’s all meaningless bullshit that will lead to nothing except winding up supporters. Until the players are on the field I don’t care what they say.

    • Brisneyland Local

      It will still be the team that Cheika picks!

    • Hoss

      What are some of the names mate ? I missed that. Being battling the crusaders at the gates.

      • Kiwi rugby lover

        From the article mate; Karmichael Hunt; Brendan Paenga-Amosa, Tate McDermott; Locky McCaffrey and Pete Samu.

        • Hoss

          Thought you had some inside dirt. No Mc Caffrey, Hunt or Samu is a ball scratcher ? The others are about right. BPA has fallen from grace, McDermott too soon but his time will come.

        • onlinesideline

          I really rate Hunt. Not just big game experience and big reputation, he has a good work rate, good defender and has lots of attacking smarts and vision. You can see plain as day he has bucket loads of experience and is a natural. He’s not lazy. Opposition rate him. Big mistake leaving him out. He also has a point to prove. Madness.

        • Hoss

          He may be a victim of his versatility mate. You’ve got Toomua, Beale & Hodge all offering coverage over a number of spots – all of them vying for 2 bench spots in my XXIII. Then you have plenty of options at 13 (if fit i would pick Pataia) – Kerevi’s my 12 and best player in Oz this year, plus i like the Red’s ‘combination’ at 12 & 13.

          We really have got some depth and options in the fairies this RWC – take out the white noise around the code and the Wallabies squad is fairly impressive in comparison to previous years.

        • onlinesideline

          There is no doubt Kerevi is a different athlete on the pitch this year. I still have recurring nightmares of the AllBlack (I think it was Dixon) out sprinting Kerevi down the touch at the ANZ staduim and thinking he is just too slow. Maybe it was Grey’s fault and we were out on our legs. But he looks really good this year.

          You’re right though re Hunts versatility. Shame coz I get a good gut feeling of assurance when he is on the field. We saw so little of him in Gold. I persoannly think there is a place for him but yes its crowded.

          Yeah your comment about depth. Dont know mate. We lack a 1st XV going into a RWC, we are still subject to Cheika ball, and if Qaude fizzes out, we are going to be left with a very ordinary and predictable 10 -12. You are the eternal optimist but I have real worries. My only hope is Johnson / Oconnor influence.

        • John Tynan

          I think Hegarty is the most Foley-like 5/8 running around in Australia, and maybe he’s a smoky for consistent style of Cheika play?

        • Hoss

          What are you still doing up – aren’t you still on Hungarian time ?

        • onlinesideline

          yep 7.39 am – Ive had an all nighter – Im sick as dog and cant sleep, so I’ll load up on codeine and settle in for a day behind the laptop till about 7 tonight then try and get an all night sleep. Miserable outside, spring keeps retreating back to winter here in Budapest.

        • Who?

          But Hoss, we usually look like we’ve got some pretty handy depth in May…. Even through the Wallaby squads. We don’t look thin until Cheik starts naming his teams.
          .
          Oh, and in the same manner, I don’t think that anyone missing from this camp is necessarily out of contention, just as I don’t think that anyone in the camp is guaranteed selection.
          .
          Lastly, for everyone (not Hoss), I should note that the line in the ‘camp’ section saying Latu’s included is a typo – if you read under the Latu story, it clearly says he’s been kicked out of the camp, which he’d otherwise be attending.
          My own ‘conspiracy theory’ is that if Latu’s anything like close to having his charges downgraded, Cheik will do whatever he needs to do to get him available for the RWC. He’s long put his money on Latu, and I can imagine he’d think he can get the young man on the right track, as he did with Beale in 2014/15 (let’s not talk about the company Beale kept in 2016… Sniff sniff).

        • Hoss

          Afternoon Dr and welcome.

          I’ll take looking good in May from where we came from in 2018 and plus we have Mandrake & The Schnoz now involved.

          Interesting to see the ‘point of difference’ in our play at RWC. Segall alluded to this about 2 months back before Voldermorts latest ‘activities’ and so has Mandrake – 2 weeks back about most teams playing similar styles these days.

          One does forget we did manage a silver medal in 2015’s Tourney of Champions, ultimately beaten by Mr Owens whistle…………..

        • onlinesideline

          Are you convinced Rodda is our man? There seems to be number of locks on the fringe that look far more intimidating than Rodda. You look at some of the Argies going about town and Rodda comes across as an overgrown schoolie to me in comparison.

        • Hoss

          I’d have him before Coleman mate. Coleman gets in on ‘could be’ but isnt. Rodda fronts up – since you asked, here is my XXIII

          1-3 All Brumbies: Sio / Slipper, Palestine. 7A’s
          4 Rodda
          5 Jones
          6. Mc Caffrey
          7 Lee Magors
          8. Poey – no i dont like it, but who am i kidding
          9. Sanchez
          10.Quade
          11 Sefa
          12 Kerevi
          13 Pataia
          14 Maddocks
          15 DHP
          16 Mafi / Uelese / Latu
          17 Sio / Slipper
          18 Kepu / Thor
          19 Simmons / Coleman / Philips (i am a fan of this guy)
          20 Naisarini / Valentini
          21 Phipps / Powell
          22 / 23 Gilbert, Hodge, Toomua

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I think Simmons pretty comprehensively outplayed the Reds guys on the weekend, and Kepu was much better than Thor.

          I’d probably start Simmons and Kepu would be my backup THP.

        • Hoss

          Simmons has been the most consistent lock in Oz this year, but gets no love on GAGR.

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          I’d go Simmons and Arnold, plus Jones at 6. That’s about as strong of a line out as we could hope for.

          What about you?

          Gilbert was impressive at fullback too. And allows the two Ks centres a bit more easily too.

        • Hoss

          Can certainly live with that mate. I’d still start with Sauce, I 100% believe Gilbert can win a test with 25 to go. Dancing feet, tiring defences and like him at the back. Even as a Tah’s man I don’t think he should start. It’s just his mental strength or rather his fragility (ability to drop his bundle) that keeps him out of my starting XV. DHP has been very good since his return and he is solid under the highball, good on D, good kicking and – mentally stronger than KB. But they’re both in my XXIII

        • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

          Yeah my preference at this point would probably be for Sauce at fullback, Banks on a wing and Hodge or Speight on another. But hope we see Beale given a do at fullback in the rugby championship, as he might have another 2010esque season.

        • Hoss

          One things certain mate, there’s gonna be some big names miss out.

        • joy

          No problems 1-3 unless 2 doesn’t have a tiny ponytail. Rodda will walk in, Philips for Jones because he is uncompromising and has equal hands, McCaffery – for me, debatable – I’d choose Jones for better hands, Hooper for Lee Majors, Naisarani because he never loses the ball in contact and because Pocock has run out of spare parts, Genia is Papua New Guinean and much better than anyone from Spain, I kiss you for Quade, Seffa is an expert at being out of position – Koreobeti is fast improving and his acceleration is world class, Kerevi (with Quade) all good, Petaia has run out of time to displace Kurindrani who has belatedly discovered what support runners are there for, Maddox is my pet but gets lost in pressure games – he needs time -DHP, Folau for fullback as RA will be disbanded. Anybody from the rest is good for finishers. We are in a good position to pull off a few surprises but not all.

        • Who?

          I know you don’t like Hoss’ nicknames…
          You’ve asked for Hooper at 7 – he is Lee Majors. The $6 Million Man.
          You’ve asked for Genia at 9. His name is Sanchez William Genia. No joke!!! I was shocked when I first learned it… Sanchez has been a standard G&GR nickname for him (if your real name can ever truly be a nickname) for what must be a decade. It’s like referring to Viv Richards as Ian (Ian Vivian Alexander Richards).
          Hope that helps. :-)

        • Keith Butler

          Some interesting picks Hoss. Jones at 5? Cheika will find a place for Ned somewhere so I don’t reckon LJ will make the squad. Pity because that spell in France has hardened him up.

        • Who?

          Thanks Mr Cartwright.
          It just frustrates me that, in May 2018, in May 2017, May 2016, we had some pretty handy looking players, and each year, it appeared to be quality players with increasing depth, too. So it’s really hard not to be a bit cynical.
          .
          Honestly, I think we’ve mostly had the players to do better than we have most of the last decade… We just haven’t ever been a team where we – as the ABs often are – were more than the sum of the parts on the field. Too often, we’re less. Not for lack of effort, occasionally because players’ skills have let them down, but mostly, it’s just dumb play, dumb plans.
          .
          That silver medal in 2015? One of the few times we performed as more than the sum of our parts (though I still question whether we picked our best teams that tournament), we were lucky in patches (Scotland), and the final appeared closer than it really was (we scored zero tries when they had 15 on the field). McCaw said that from the kick off in the 2011 RWC semi final, they knew the Wallabies were mentally beaten. I’d venture the same was true in the big dance in 2015. We beat them in Sydney (off the back of a great forwards’ performance – Foley was truly horrible that day), got our tails handed to us in Auckland (situation normal), and then got smashed in Bill. Very similar story to 2011 – beat them with a great forwards’ performance in Brisbane (I was there, the backs didn’t do that much), then lost our edge and lost in Bill.
          .
          We’ve got the players to have a real crack in Japan, I’m just not holding my breath. Twice bitten is more than a little shy. Mr Bush was wrong when he mixed The Who into the old saying, “Fool me once.” But I’m yet to be convinced The Who were wrong – from the same song, “Meet the new boss, same as the old boss!”

        • joy

          I’m not here to decode you nicknames.

        • Who?

          Schnoz has been Michael O’Connor’s nickname since the early 80’s (because of his broken and crooked nose).
          Seagall is Cheika – because he’s perpetually ‘Under Siege’.
          Mandrake (the magician) is Johnson.
          Voldermort, I’m guessing that’s a new one for Folau…
          Mr Owens is Nigel Owens.

        • joy

          It’s just PC at work. Makes me sick.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          No inside dirt. I tried an email to RA playing the “kiwi” card but they said there’s enough kiwis in RA

        • Hoss

          Sure you didn’t ring Centrelink in error ??

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Good point. They are on speed dial

    • Huw Tindall

      McCaffrey is injured, BPA can’t get a run on at Reds, Hodge is the utility, Tate would be like 6th in line (although great promise) bur no Samu is a head scratcher as his form at the Ponies has been excellent.

      • joy

        It could be that Samu is a certainty. Not for me though because we have an abundance of small good backrowers.

    • joy

      Folau is an obvious winner. His God comes before rugby as it should.

  • Pearcewreck

    Raelene: Hey, Izzy, just wondering if you would let us add a couple of incredibly restrictive clauses that could be used against you at any time in any way we see fit, to allow us to completely control any part of your life that we don’t like. Oh, and they have zero chance of holding up in a court of law.
    Izzy: No.
    Raelene: OK then, lets just forget about it then, …. oh, and Israel, do be good a boy and live your personal life exactly as we see fit.

    • D. Braithwaite’s The Brumbies

      Do you live your life according to the requirements of your employment, or do you get to do whatever you want?

      • Pearcewreck

        At work I live my life according to the requirements of my employment.
        In my private life I get to do whatever I want.

      • joy

        I’d get another job. I feel Izzy is quite comfortable with that.

    • GeorgiaSatellite

      Except Izzy quite obviously answered “Yes” and went back on his word. There’s faith and there’s good faith.

      • joy

        No way. He listened and said nothing. That’s the Christian way and there is no doubt he is devout.

        • GeorgiaSatellite

          So if he said “yes” or nothing at all, he still had no intention of adhering to their explicit expectations. Very Christian indeed. As Raelene says in the article above, ““If you (a professional athlete) don’t feel comfortable and marrying up with the values of that organisation, and the expectations that organisation has with your particular views or values, then maybe you shouldn’t sign that contract.”

  • Pearcewreck

    As a Brumbies fan, all I can say is I’m still celebrating a great victory over the weekend.
    My father in-law, a Waratahs fan, is mourning a surprise loss.

    • onlinesideline

      Wouldnt be suprised to see Ponys excel in next 3 weeks and onwards. They have a habit of doing that.

      • Brumby Runner

        Not sure he’s referring to rugby.

  • Pearcewreck

    Has anyone listened to the full Raelene interview?
    Did anyone at rugby.com.au ask her to reveal the full extent, in detail, of her conversations with Alan Joyce RE Israel’s post?
    If she is prepared to reveal all about her Folau talks, should she not also disclose her discussions with Alan Joyce?

    • Greg

      I think
      1) No
      2) No
      3) No

  • srsly?
    Big names not there will be Karmichael Hunt; Brendan Paenga-Amosa and Tate McDermott; and Locky McCaffrey and Pete Samu. As mentioned above, Tolu Latu will attend the camp.

    • AllyOz

      Tolu Latu will attend the camp…but someone will need to give him a lift.

  • Greg

    Mr Folau elected not to appeal the RA finding.

    https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-union/folau-contract-torn-up-as-appeal-window-closes-20190520-p51pag.html

    Time will tell if he decides to go after cash through the courts.

    • BigNickHartman

      Can’t Alan Jones give him some cash?

      • Greg

        There was actually an interesting article teh other day that asserted the ATO was vigilant re donations via religious institutions.

        • Who?

          I can’t imagine anyone would bother donating through there. It’s not like the donation would be tax deductible if given through the church anyway (I think donations to churches are tax deductible in the US, but they’re not in Australia).
          .
          Apparently Telegraph reported the other day that he’s going to go to the courts. As he says, no point staying inside RA’s system when the path with the best chance of his success isn’t to debate whether he’s violated the code of conduct, but whether the code of conduct is able to have effect in that area.
          It’s good for us as fans, too, because it removes a step from the long, drawn-out process. So maybe it’ll be done in a year, rather than 14 months…

        • Greg

          By which time he will be, what, 32? He might be better to pull stump sand look for another employer if he is keen to play.

        • Who?

          Yeah, I agree, if he wants to play, he needs to find somewhere else to do it. That’s been a known result since the day it hit the media.
          .
          And it may not be a year – it could be five – I’m plucking a figure from the air there, just pointing out that one (small) step has been eliminated from the process. Thankfully.

  • GeorgiaSatellite

    To an additional clause in the contract, not the subsequent meetings and letter about understanding expectations, which is how you couched your imagined conversation. Please stop flogging a dead horse.

Rugby

Hopes to play David Pocock in the inevitable biopic. Lifelong fan of whoever Jarrad Hayne is currently playing for.

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