We've fired up Deep Thought again
Here’s a look at some of the key indicators from Saturday’s test at Twickenham
Carries
| Carries | Forwards | Backs | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| First half | 26 | 27 | 53 |
| Second half | 25 | 30 | 55 |
| Total | 51 | 57 | 108 |
| Forwards | Backs |
|---|---|
| Wycliff Palu – 14 | Digby Ioane – 11 |
| James Horwill – 7 | Matt Giteau – 10 |
| Steven Moore – 7 | Quade Cooper – 10 |
| Rocky Elsom – 6 | Will Genia – 7 |
| Ben Robinson – 4 | Adam Ashley Cooper – 7 |
| George Smith – 4 | Peter Hynes – 6 |
| Ben Alexander – 4 | Drew Mitchell – 5 |
We should really take two off Giteau, 1 off Elsom, 1 off Ioane and 1 off Palu for carrying the ball instead of passing when we looked certain to score. Not sure about deducting 1 off Robinson – notice that Bannahan runs interference against Horwill who was looming up in support – the referee saw it and that was the reason for playing advantage, not Elsom getting caught up with Gerahty. I thought Robinson made the right choice to hold on and recycle the ball.
However, it was really pleasing to see the workload shared around this week. The forwards were much more involved than in Tokyo.
Tackles
| Tackles | Forwards | Backs | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| First Half | 25 | 10 | 35 |
| Second Half | 43 | 24 | 67 |
| Total | 68 | 34 | 102 |
| Rocky Elsom – 11 | Ben Robinson – 6 |
| Peter Hynes – 10 | Tatafu Polota-Nau – 6 |
| Wycliff Palu – 9 | Ben Alexander – 5 |
| George Smith – 8 | Digby Ioane – 5 |
| Matt Giteau – 8 | Steven Moore – 4 |
| James Horwill – 6 | Mark Chisolm – 4 |
The defence was excellent and nullified most of what England threw at them. Again a good sharing of the workload.
Missed Tackles
| Missed tackles | Forwards | Backs | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| First Half | 0 | 3 | 3 |
| Second Half | 6 | 8 | 14 |
| Total | 6 | 11 | 17 |
| George Smith – 3 | Mark Chisolm – 1 |
| Drew Mitchell – 3 | Ben Alexander – 1 |
| Digby Ioane – 2 | Ben Robinson – 1 |
| Peter Hynes – 2 | Quade Cooper – 1 |
| Ryan Cross – 2 | Will Genia – 1 |
George Smith’s three missed tackles all came from a step back inside by England backs when he raced out of the line. Drew Mitchell and Peter Hynes and one of those for Ryan Cross might be considered tough marking as they were coming across in cover when they were beaten. I also marked Will Genia hard when he only got finger tips on Haskell as he broke away from loose ball. Quade Cooper’s one miss came from that same run when Haskell ran over him like Lomu used to run over players. Apart from that Cooper and Ioane seemed to work well as a defensive unit.
Breakdowns
| Breakdowns | First Half | Second Half | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Wallabies took in | 38 | 45 | 83 |
| Wallabis won | 34 | 41 | 75 (90%) |
| Poms took in | 36 | 63 | 99 |
| Poms won | 35 | 60 | 95 (96%) |
Of the Wallabies 8 lost balls in the breakdown, 5 were penalties for the Wallabies holding on or entering from the side. I can’t argue about the referee’s interpretation with any of them. Two of the others were balls stolen as they popped out the back of rucks and one was a steal in a maul from a lineout.
What was really impressive was the speed of the ball coming back at most of the rucks. I know England aren’t the All Blacks but the difference from one week to the next was incredible and that allowed the Wallabies to get on the front foot. Genia played really well but with that sort of ball he should have.
Lineouts
I’ll list the stats for England first as it’s here you can really see a pattern developing.
England
1st Half
1 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 5 – Won by England – Wallabies didn’t compete
2 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Elsom
3 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster but at same height as Chisolm
4 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Elsom
5 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by Australia on the tap down – Jumper was up faster but Chisolm disrupted and loose tap down from England
6 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by England – Jumper was up just in front of Chisolm – much better
7 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up at same time and height as Chisolm – much better
8 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Elsom
9 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Elsom
10 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 6 – Won by Australia – England communication failed – no jumpers
2nd Half
1 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Elsom
2 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Chisolm
3 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Horwill
4 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by England – Jumper was up faster and higher than Chisolm
5 – 6 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Wallabies didn’t compete on own line
6 – 6 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Wallabies didn’t compete on own line
Our jumpers were much slower getting into the air and on most occasions they didn’t get to the same height as England’s jumpers. If this was for one jumper only, it would suggest that the jumper was not dynamic enough but it was happening with all jumpers, which suggests to me that our lifters are the problem.
Australia
1st Half
1 – Won by Australia – Channel 10 footage missed lineout
2 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by England – Throw was straight but England got jumpers up at #2 and #3 with one lifter each and got in front of Chisolm
3 – 4 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by England – Throw was straight but England got jumper up in front of Horwill
4 – Hynes took quick throw – Won by Australia
5 – 7 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Elsom
6 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Elsom
7 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Chisolm
2nd Half
1 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Elsom
2 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 4 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Horwill
3 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Elsom
4 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by Australia – Throw was good – clean ball to Elsom
5 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by Australia – Throw was good by TPN – clean ball to Chisolm
6 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 3 – Won by England – Throw was good by TPN – England got a jumper in front of Chisolm
7 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by England – Throw was good by TPN – Pressure by England – loose tap down by Elsom
8 – 5 in lineout – thrown to # 2 – Won by Australia – Throw was good by TPN – clean ball to Chisolm
The 2nd and 3rd lineouts in the game on the Australian throw were terrible. England clearly out jumped us. Was this a timing issue, not enough dynamics from the jumpers or a problem with the lifters again? Or was it poor calling? Not sure but at least they fixed it pretty quickly, which suggests to me that it was a calling issue again as for the rest of the game we clearly out thought or out jumped England.
The good news was that all our throws looked were straight.
Overall, England won 14 from 16 (87.50%) and the Wallabies won 11 from 15 (73.33%) so still plenty of work to do on our own ball and we need to do much better defensively.
Overall
I was impressed with the work rate of Elsom and Horwill who, although I wasn’t measuring involvements at the breakdown, appeared to me to be everywhere.
The speed of the ball coming back from the ruck was obviously vital.
I also liked Ioane’s running lines at #13 – he straightened the attack much like Mortlock used to.
Tags: statstics
Loading ...
Brilliant analysis – must have been a real effort to get together.
Particularly like the lineout stats – was a bit worried about our chances against Ireland but it’s really just the 2nd and 3rd lineouts that I remembered. Sounds like things were much smoother than I remembered. Great to see that TPN was throwing straight, I’d be happy with either him or Moore in the starting XV now.
Damned good analysis. Thanks
Interesting that Hyne’s and Mitchell only had 11 carries between them whereas the the rest of the backline had at least 10 each except for Genia and AAC who only had 7 apiece.
Some of the carries, of course, were from broken play but it seems to beg the question of whether our wingers are being brought into the play enough.
I’m not saying this is the case, but it’s food for thought.
Hynes would have had 2 tries if someone would pass him the ball!
The carries for Hynes and Mitchell were largely kick returns or broken play.
I recorded Hynes with no carries from ball received at the end of a backline movement and Mitchell had one at 43.05 on the game clock.
Giteau and Cooper took the line on inside and Ioane was then used as a straight runner in the #13 channel. Ioane was effective in gaining metres in this role but it did take away opportunities to give the wingers a run.
I meant he was standing outside the man unmarked twice when the tried to score. Once was elsom I can’t remember the other
Absolutely – the other one was Ioane when he knocked on over the line. Elsom and Hynes were both outside him unmarked.
Good stuff, Scotty. One thing you raise that no-one else has, is the speed of lifts. Chis and Kev to fat for our props? Or have our lifters spent too much time on the heavy bag and not enough on the sped bag?
Should we rename you Jake “The Muss” Heke?
You can break the speed issue down further – 1) speed across the ground to react to movement of jumpers and 2) speed of the actual lift.
I went to a session with Michael Foley when he was coaching the Wallabies forwards and his view was that in defensive lineouts you watch the lifters, not the jumpers because no matter how much the jumpers move around or fake, they need lifters. So if a jumper fakes in a position where there is no lifter, you know it’s a fake. Don’t have any hard facts on how the lineout was performing then but my memory is that our lineout was much better at that time and his ideas made sense to me.
With that in mind I looked at England’s lineouts again and the only ones they moved jumpers or lifters around were their 4th and 6th in the first half and their 2nd and 3rd in the second half. Of those they won all and we only got close on the 6th in the first half. That suggests we weren’t reading the movement quickly enough.
That leaves 12 England lineouts where there was no movement in the line – jumper just went up in their original position. Of those we didn’t compete in the 1st of the first half and the 5th and 6th of the second half. There was also the 10th of the first half where England failed to jump. In the other 8 England lineouts, their jumpers outdid us in 7 and we only got close in the 7th of the first half. That suggests we had problems with timing – as everyone was in a static position it was all about the jumper calling the lift on the throw, whereas we appeared slow and started our lift when the ball was already in the air. Interesting that in 4 of th 7, Elsom was our defensive jumper and in the other 3 it was Chisolm.
Defensive jumps rely on reading the opposition jumpers and responding quickly. Its the jumper’s responsibility to read, communicate to his lifters and for all of them to respond quickly. I think its combinations although Horwill should have his combos already.
Gits shouldnt have 10 carries. I would estimate that at least 5 of them are taking it from first receiver and going himself. Not good enough.
We have good attacking wingers out there, but they can’t do anything without the ball!!!
Nice analysis, but it will be a different story against Ireland. We’ll smash em by heaps. (i hope)
Chisholm seems strangely absent from the stats. no carries, no tackles just one missed.
Chisolm is listed for 4 tackles in the list but I must have missed him when typing in the carries – he had had 5 carries (3 in the first half and 2 in the second).
Top Stuff Scotty. This is excellent, and meaningful analysis.
Another first for G&GR!
Scotty,
This is going to get confusing.
Good analysis. Interesting to see Hynes made 11 tackles – I thought he got involved a lot and was often helping out in cover – which I why I rated his game pretty high, although others seemed to completely disagree.
Identity theft!!! Have asked for my sign in to be changed to avoid confusion.
I wonder if Jim & Dingo read this blog and get their best shit from it…
Scotty,
Great stuff – really enjoyed it, Someone should send the link to Jim Williams.
The problem with this Scotty is that it is so good that we will be expecting the same from you after every test match.
That’s a very interesting point you shared with us about what Foley told you: that lineout defenders should watch the position of the lifters. It doesn’t seem like rocket science though, does it? It’s the type of thing that one thought was happening.
By matching them based on that; or better still – to be 1/2 a metre ahead of them, will not guarantee that we can be competitive in every lineout – but the probability becomes greater. It would produce a higher spoil or steal count than just a guess.
I have a feeling that we are missing input from Sharpe on the park in this area. Vickerman seemed very good at it too.
One thing I noticed, that you have confirmed, is how high their players got up, especially early in the game. Their lifts were towering and the receivers looked imperious.
It’s good to see that the throwing was better but there is still a lot of work to be done. It is all very well for our props to perform well in the scrum but there is more to rugby set piece work than scrummaging.
I wonder if any of our props have got unfavourable selection treatment because they didn’t work well in the lineout lifting and choreography department?
And if not, why not?
Thanks Lee – I will provide the stats for all the test matches.
New video analysis on the way to better show the issue of jumpers not getting high enough.
Nice work Scotty….. Now get some sleep before the match…
great work scotty – good clear stats/analysis. Am I wrong, or has the lineout declined (further) since Baxter was scrapped – an ordinary (inconsistant) prop in the scrums, lousy at the breakdown and in the loose, but a great lifter!?