Wallabies blacked out in Sydney - Green and Gold Rugby
All Blacks

Wallabies blacked out in Sydney

Wallabies blacked out in Sydney

The Wallabies have suffered a 42-8 hammering at the hands of the All Blacks in Sydney tonight. It was an attacking master class from the All Blacks as they ran in six tries and took advantage of some poor handling and a high missed tackle count from the Wallabies who have some serious injury concerns with Matt Giteau, Matt Toomua and Rob Horne all injured in the heavy loss.

The Match

Bernard Foley opened the scoring with an early penalty goal after three minutes to make it 3-0.

But that lead wouldn’t last for long as the All Blacks threw it wide from a counter attack after Matt Giteau failed to find touch and Kieran Read running in the wide channels on the left wing found Ryan Crotty and he evaded the Wallabies defenders for the opening try.

The Wallabies had injury concerns in the opening ten minutes with Giteau having to leave the field with an ankle injury after bravely attempting to battle on.

Matt Giteau shapes to pass.

Matt Giteau shapes to pass.

Beauden Barrett added two penalty goals for the visitors and were unlucky not to add to their score after being ruled offside from a charge down with Brodie Retallick’s brilliant handling all for nothing just as the All Blacks forwards started to dominate and take control of the game.

The Wallabies had a rare excursion into the opposition 22 on the back of a penalty but the lineout suffered the wobbles and lost two throws in a row and just like that, the All Blacks had gone down the other end of the field and Barrett was over.

The Wallabies just couldn’t get into the game as the possession and territory stats weighed heavily in the All Blacks favour and played the majority of the half in their own end.

Matt Toomua, on as a replacement for Giteau, copped a head knock and he had to leave the field and things only got worse for the Wallabies as a clearing kick from Bernard Foley was charged down by Jerome Kaino and he collected the bounce to all but seal the game for a 25-3 lead with the disjointed backline not helping the Wallabies cause.

If there were any questions over Beauden Barrett wearing the ten jersey for New Zealand, they were put to rest as he found space with ease again in a man of the match perforamnce amongst the Wallabies defence and he sent Waisake Naholo to the line for a 32-3 lead at the break.

Naholo had to leave the field as he injured himself scoring the try just as Rob Horne was leaving the field with a shoulder injury to leave the backline depleted.

all blacks v wallabies2

The All Blacks didn’t take the foot off the accelerator in the second half and were still ruthless as the Wallabies simply had nothing to combat the attack.

Dane Coles, who wasn’t originally named in the 23 due to a rib injury, was on the end of an overlap after an earlier break from Malakai Fekitoa from another turnover and they kept adding more tries as Julian Savea got in on the act after evading the cover defence in the left corner as they All Blacks ticked over the 40 point mark.

The Wallabies tried admirably to score something towards the end of the game and got some help as Kieran Read was binned for disrupting a rolling maul and with five minutes left, Nick Phipps who was having to play on the wing with the high injury toll, scored the only Wallabies try of the night to make it 42-8.

The All Blacks thought they had scored one last try to Israel Dagg as he collected a Barrett cross field kick but a knock in the lead up rubbed that one out but a penalty advantage from an earlier infringement had the All Blacks go for one last score but couldn’t get over the line to leave the final score 42-8.

Nick Phipps in space

Nick Phipps in space


The Details

Score & Scorers

WALLABIES 8
Tries: Phipps
Conversions:
Penalties: Foley
ALL BLACKS 42
Tries: Crotty, Barrett, Kaino, Naholo, Coles, Savea
Conversions: Barrett 3
Penalties: Barrett 2

Cards

73 mins – Read (NZ) – Yellow

Crowd

65,328

Photos by Peter Mitchell

  • Sharon

    Please pass the Rectinol.

    • Brisneyland Local

      Yes I think we were just totally ass reamed!

    • First time long time

      I think your man is cheating on you Sharon because I’m certain he snuck up behind me tonight as well!

  • Obviously you can’t do much behind a beaten forward pack (but you can catch balls passed to your chest) but surely Chieka has to open his eyes to the form of Kuridrani. Give the man a few weeks off to go play in the NRC and see if he can get it back. It’s time we either use Folau at 13 because he was missing tonight at 15, or give Kerevi a shot at bringing his hot form to test level in his preferred position.

    That said, there is no one simple fix that will make up for all the mistakes of tonight. Mass changes are needed in gameplan, defence, kicking and set piece (pretty much everything).

    • BloodRed

      Cheika needs to have his eyes on the unemployed queue. His attachment to players like Mumm, Hooper and Foley and worthless geriatrics from overseas is second only to the total lack of game strategy as a contributor to that limp d1ck performance. The All Blacks were pretty bad themselves but that was good enough to nearly put 50 points on us. Fall on your sword Cheika, let a club coach have a go ’cause they couldn’t do any worse.

      • keith

        Start with Hooper, he isn’t a 7!

        • BloodRed

          Redefining what a 7 does! Like not competing at the breakdown. Like never getting a turnover. Like not slowing down the opposition ball. Like not pushing effectively in a scrum. Yet preppie Martha farkas believe he is an international standard loose forward. Well maybe only wasters with former Waratahs loose forwards as their avatars.

      • Willem Labuschagne

        Wow, let’s not keep anything back! The ABs were “pretty bad themselves”? That statement puts everything else into perspective. Clearly this is about ranting, not talking rugby.

    • yogifj

      yes, Kuridrani probably didn’t do as well as he should (is this the wallaby understatement for this year?) but as play-maker, why is there a lump in my throat every time Foley’s about to kick… isn’t the play-maker’s job to set off our runners… how much of a difference Kerevi would have made, if Wallabies aren’t setting him up to the available channels….

      • Really?

        Kuridrani made 16 tackles and missed one in a side having its butt handed to them – a rugby ball has 2 sides, drop him and how do replace that tackling effort – put that tackling machine Folau in there and you will need a calculator to keep up.

  • RedsFanDan

    Too much dropped ball. How we can drop that much ball cold I don’t know. TK needs a rest, he’s getting no front foot ball, getting no penetration and keeps dropping the ball.

    10 seasons of aimless kicking now? Why on earth you would want to deliberately put the ball in the ABs hands I don’t know. All kicks must be out or contestable.

    Cheika keeps talking about how we’re going to play ball in hand Australian rugby but you can’t do that when you drop the ball or kick it away.

    Credit where credit’s due, the AB’s support play was outrageous, their passing good and their read of the game great.

    • aj

      what gets me the most are those kicks that are 5m further than we can contest and half the time the opposition make back the 5m and more when they land.

    • Kiwi rugby lover

      TK not getting front foot ball is the people giving it to him’s fault. Bit harsh to blame him for that

      • RedsFanDan

        Fair point. I guess what I was getting at is that a power running game is his thing and if we’re not going to give him front foot ball then he’s tits on a bull and a liability with his hands.

      • 30 mm tags

        TK needs to time his run. Dropping the ball,in contact shows he was probably a metre too forward. That’s not coaching at his level of experience. TK is out of form and needs a spell.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Yeah maybe. I agree with a lot of fans here and would like to see Kerevi in the mix. Maybe with Hodge as well. Let’s face it, it can’t be worse

  • Moose

    I blame the ref.

    • RedsFanDan

      I blame the boks

    • yogifj

      I blame myself… What shameful performance did I’ve just witnessed…

  • Who?

    Can someone please explain to me why we brought back Giteau? I’m reading it’s for his tactical direction and kicking. But the first try was directly off him not finding touch, after Foley failed to find touch. And it continued all night – from all our kickers. Can someone please explain to our coaching staff that the game plan shouldn’t include providing broken play ball to the AB outside backs? That’s where it all started… And then it followed the script I expected.
    We were lucky not to lose by more – for instance, the Retallick no try? He didn’t charge that down, Folau just kicked it into him (15m away). So, no charge down attempt, no offside lines created, general play! Feki bombed a try by not popping it to Smith, Savea overcooked his grubber ahead (great work by Phipps there – thought he played a blinder on the wing, also ran a great switch play from there, one of the few times we looked interesting with the ball in hand)…

    • Seb V

      Yep, same old stories. Foley can’t kick, Gits didn’t find touch. Failed to exist our own half again. I thought Bryne would help in this area, clearly he needs more time to fix our kicking woes.. probably at least a couple of years by the looks of it.

      • Who?

        But the fact that they did it time and time and time and time and time again makes it look like it was a tactic. Who’s stupid enough to have an exit strategy where you kick it back to Israel Dagg (who has a monster boot), Beauden Barrett (who’s in special form at the moment), and Ben Smith?!?!?!

        • Seb V

          I wish I knew. We are all stumped at that one. The repetitive poor decisions are the norm these days unfortunately.

        • yogifj

          It seems to be…. But I beg to question,… are (or why not are) the wallabies not training to kick into empty spaces and having a player chase it as if their life depends on it…

      • Kiwi rugby lover

        Mate Bryne took a couple of years with the AB’s to get consistent results – plus getting rid of players who didn’t step up

    • Simon

      >Can someone please explain to our coaching staff that the game plan >shouldn’t include providing broken play ball to the AB outside backs?

      This is surely Rule #1 on Page 1 of the rulebook of How To Play the All Blacks. Avoiding giving their outside backs possession in broken play at all costs. But yet again we did it all night.

      Meanwhile, Barrett is putting 50m kicks into touch with laser-like precision.

  • Dumpil

    I don’t think he has any clothes on.

  • Moose

    In anticipation of the festival of negativity I can feel coming in this comments section, I’ve compiled a list of positives as I see them:
    – Read’s yellow card
    – Barrett had an off night with the boot
    – Barrett (I think, correct me please) getting dakked
    – The second half was less awful than the first
    That’s about it.

    • Dagg got dakked

      • Moose

        I stand corrected, thank you. Best dakking I’ve seen since high school.

        • Simon

          Best dakking I’ve seen since Cub Scouts when one of the boys got his pants removed by a leader and run up the flagpole and ran off crying into the bush with his arse bare to the breeze. That was in the 80s, it would be a criminal lawsuit if you did it to a kid these days.

          Anyway, here a few genuine positives I came up while trying to think of ways to avoid having to call Beyond Blue tomorrow:

          – Genia back and looked good. Even went for a couple of runs, once of which nearly broke the line. Clear starting scrum half for mine, which in turn raises the possibility of Cooper at 10 (maybe not next week but against the Boks)

          – Mumm actually had the best game I’ve seen him play in ages, very active, very physical and constantly making metres in contact (the only one of our players to do so). If he can do that every week I will have to stop whinging about Cheika including him in the team.

          – Hopefully a new centres combination next week. Kuridrani must have used up his last life now, and all the 12s will likely be injured, even Horne who has played 12 for the Tahs. And while Horne is clearly totally unsuited to playing 12 at test level I wouldn’t put it past Cheika to put him there. Hodge/Kerevi centres combo next week? Worth a try, we have nothing to lose.

          – And finally, I actually saw some positives in the way the Wallabies tried to play the game, with less reliance on ball-in-hand and actually starting to mix it up with different kicking options. It totally failed, because the kicking was terrible, and it was a clumsy attempt to address the issues brought up in the England series, but at least they are starting to train for it. There were actually a couple of kicks that were nice and contestable, including one where we got the ball back after making 30 metres or so. Going to require serious improvement to actually win playing that game style but at this stage, even seeing the Wallabies do a well-judged contestable kick and regather is a positive.

        • Toadflax

          Also AA debut game showed a lot of promise I thought

  • Keith

    Fuck everything

    • BloodRed

      That comment is more cerebral than the wallabies coaching team

  • Gilbert

    Time for a new coach Cheeks is lost in the wilderness…..

    • ozrugbynut

      mate cheiks and moore – i wonder if they have lost the dressing room

      • Henry Dissmissinya

        YOu know moore has

  • Henry Dissmissinya

    Well, that’s was like broken glass through my intestines. Can someone, and I’m not trying to be rude here, I’m dead serious I think I must just be missing something, why did we Keep kicking to the all blacks in loose broken play? Like what, they kick it back and into touch, they win it back on the line out, or they don’t kick it out and run it back and will probably make more meters then our kick if not a try. And if we put bombs up we hardly contested, Please I think I’m actually slow here

    • Well Bernard Foley can’t kick but the coaches don’t know that so they keep asking him to do it.

      • yogifj

        I just can’t even…..

  • Rebels3

    That’s was officially the worst wallabies game iv ever seen in 31yrs of existence. The line out was terrible but the focus needs to be away from that, we need to get back to basics. Tackling was terrible, passing horrendous and the ability to run onto the ball non existant. Cheika needs to focus on line speed, line speed and line speed. We give them to much front foot ball. Second row is our biggest worry, we must be ranked 15/16th in the world in this area and I’m not lying here samu manoa and Jamie cudmore (USA and Canada respectively are better than anything we have). I understand we don’t want to weaken our line out anymore but I’d rather a weak line out with guys who are dynamic, can bash the ball up and put a few good hits on.

    Foley isn’t as good of a player as Cooper. Infact neither are perfect t but coopers upside is substantially better and has been lampooned for recent performances against the kiwis, both played with weakened sides at his disposal.

    Kurindrani is half the player Kerevi is atm, no arguement is valid against this comment.

    • Haz

      I take issue with your second sentence.

      The line out is a basic. If you don’t have a line out then you have nothing.

      • first time long time

        Cooper has a better test record than Foley

        • Wendy Wills

          Even against the ABs. Bring back Quade!

        • Haz

          Second sentence, not second paragraph. Agree that Cooper is better.

          If you go on the basis of picking the players another team wouldn’t want to play against then I’d probably offer up this.
          1 slipper
          2
          3 kepu
          4 horwill
          5 Coleman
          6 Fardy
          7 Hooper
          8 pocock
          9 Genia
          10 cooper
          11 Mitchell
          12 Toomua
          13 Folau
          14 AAC
          15 DHP

          Toomua needs to sort out his tackling technique though. Gets himself knocked out or concussed too much from my recollection.

  • Fact Cheiker

    For the record, the G&GR writeup fails to mention that the Wallabies scored their try when the All Blacks were down to 14 men.

    As seen in the World Cup Final, the Wallabies are reasonably handy against a 14-man All Black team.

    So that’s something to build on.

    The issue is how to turn the against-14-players performance into an against-15-players performance.

    • Simon

      Or just figure out a way to get an AB red carded in the first 10 minutes of the match. Might be the easier of the two options.

  • DReido

    Hello..oh hi Bill. Sorry I didn’t recognize this number

    • yogifj

      I was ‘googling’ for this…. lol

    • Seb V

      Who was McKenzie’s “attack coach”?

      • Who?

        Jim McKay..?

        • Seb V

          Hire him to replace Larkham, Hire the Hurricances defence coach. There’s a start.

        • Who?

          Why not bring back Link, too..? Link didn’t ever beat the Kiwis, but you had the feeling we were building. The last game, in spite of the shambles in the back rooms, we got within a point. Cheika’s results are going the other way.
          But I don’t know that Link would walk back in that easily. Would take a lot. Maybe we could hire back Eddie Jones, England wouldn’t be paying him that much, would they..?
          Oh well, we’ve got a heap of great young coaches to step up. Like that bloke coaching the Brums, he’s got a good attacking… Oh, wait. Hang on, there’s that bloke at the Tahs… Nah, he wants to coach the ABs. Oh dear.

        • Seb V

          SOS to Jake White? At least then we’d have a solid exit strategy.

        • 30 mm tags

          Yes whilst coaching the Reds in 2011 , maybe longer, it was Jim McKay.. On a separate matter who is the goal kicking coach? Since Elton Flatley left the Wallabies we haven’t had his success. He was coached by Ben Perkins. Maybe Eddie took Ben Perkins.

        • Who?

          Think Gits was consulting with Ben Perkins during the Deans era (at his own cost!!! Deans didn’t have a kicking coach, in spite of losing two Tests (Scotland 2009 and England 2010 in Sydney) due to poor goal kicking from Gits (both times, missed a kick to win it near the end). Don’t know if we’ve got a kicking coach these days…

  • Brisneyland Local

    Well I know I was negative on the team selections! But that was nothing!
    I was barely getting warmed up! Now I an running in full speed with the wind behind me! Saying we were incompetent, is an insult to incompetent people!
    I think the Wagga Wagga Under 15 D team would have put in a better effort than that. All of the players should forfeit their match payments to the fans.
    Because that totally was unacceptable! Total and utter dross.
    Our basic skills of catch and pass are totally farked.
    Tevita Kurindrani, obviously needs to go and hang a giant shit on Cheika’s hotel bed to get dropped, because simply and continually fucking it up on the paddock isnt enough.
    Foley totally blew dog tonight as well. His kicking is no where near S15 standard let alone test standard.
    Our continual dropping of the ball is just crap.
    Our game plan is crap.
    Our line was manifestly incompetent.
    Our scrum was below par.
    There is no real positive there.
    I am genuinely having doubts that Cheika has the minerals to deliver a basic game plan that is executeable by our players.
    I am also doubting that our players have the skills sets to execute the most basic of game plans.
    Wow that was just really bad, I couldnt even finish my beer, it sat there on the table unloved. I didnt even throw it at the wall. I just sat there there with a number of friends stunned and numb! we were totally shit!

    • Kiwi rugby lover

      I feel for you and the rest of the Wallaby supporters mate. That was just embarrassing.

      • first time long time

        The outraged Wallaby supporter in me says save your pity for someone who really needs it!
        but the outraged Wallaby supporter looking back at me in the mirror needs all the help he can get.
        I gladly accept your pity.

      • Tim

        The thing i’m really disappointed about, is that the Kiwi’s normally score brilliant try’s to win. In this game it was just like Australia forgot how to tackle (its a reflection of our super rugby teams!) I don’t mind loosing when brilliant try’s are scored, but really disappointed with the result. It could be a good thing for the wallabies tho we do have a few fresh rookies such as reece hodge who could even be in a starting spot next week with gitz and toomau maybe out.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          I think the AB’s put themselves into the space to score but I agree the tackling was pretty lame at times. I think it’s a great time to bring in new players. If they bring in 6-8 newbies, even if they get smashed at least it’s showing something new and planning for 2019. Going back to the past just isn’t working so there’s nothing new to lose by doing a complete change

        • Tim

          Would love to see Samu at 13 and reece at 12 (only if gitz is injured) but we lack a killer 9 and 10. Would love to see Coleman start of Simmons our line-outs where so predictable. Most of the try’s came from drop balls or 3-4 missed tackles it was like watching a second tier nation because that’s exactly what happens

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          I’d prefer Kerevi at 12. I’d also like to see Timani and Coleman start

        • Big Ted

          …and with this.

        • Big Ted

          Agree with this…

        • McWarren

          Trying to win now and plan for the future by going back to a past that didn’t work either.

        • Parker

          The Wallabies defence was at its best when Muggleton was defence coach, until Dingo ousted him. Is it too late to bring him back from wherever he is?

      • Brisneyland Local

        YEs, lucky I wote myresponse last night (By the way I am very thankful and flattered to GAGR for making me a featured comment), becasue the longer I think about the more scathing I am becoming. It was beyond embarrassing. I am truly saddened. I dont mind losing to the AB’s, tas they truly are the best team in the world. But my favourite games are the tough scrapping lead swapping games the AB and Wallabies used have. The hader we pushed the more you guys responded. We pushed each other to new rugby heights. Now there is daylight between us. A weak Wallabies is not good for Rugby, I I truly belive the All Balcks. This rivalry is what rugby is about. I am soooooooo angry about this!

        • Warwick Todd

          BL I think there are some positives to come out of this debacle.

          Cheika has been exposed! His rugby acumen and scorched earth personality are not conducive to long term development. Smashing things and abusing refs…..the guys a DH.

          Larkham was a great running 10 with an ordinary kicking game (with exception of the 1999 RWC drop goal). At this stage his playing brilliance has not translated to the Wallabies or Brumbies. He was gifted a rails ride to high level coaching and must return to the Brumbies to focus on Super rugby.

          Nathan Grays appointment always concerned me. He’s a good man and was a tough defender but evidence suggests he is not a tactician for modern defences. Someone like Matt Taylor is a better candidate.

          The older players, Giteau and AAC have had their day and will limp away never to return. Although Drew Mitchell did not play he is not the answer unless the question is “who’s fat”.

          Moore must be dropped and replaced with Andrew Ready. I’ve no idea what was happening in the scrums so I’ll leave that alone.

          Hodge needs to come into the side at 12 although I see him as a long term option at 10. I feel for Cooper as Cheika will select him this week in the wake of Foley’s diabolical performance. Kellaway or Magnay need to fill an outside back slot and with Foley likely dropped the side needs a ranga. Kerevi to 13 but part of me would like to see him at 12 running off Cooper.

          The lineout needs to be paid the respect in deserves. Ditch the double 7’s and play Fardy, Timani and Pocock with Hooper to the bench.

          There’s a huge disparity between the nuns locks and the Wallabies. Retallick and Whitelock are devasting in every aspect of their play. In Arnold’s absence we probably have to stick with Simmons as I don’t think Mumms satisfactory effort last night is enough. Having Timani at the back compensates a bit for a “soft” lock. Give Douglas another shot as he was reasonable in 2015.

          It was a shitty night but the sun came up this morning and the surf was beautiful. It promises to be an interesting week.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          You make some great points. Not the least is “How does the ARU develop some good coaches?” Relying on ex players isn’t working and if you look at NZ most coaches, while having played, were not the best players. I think there’s a bit of mindset in the ARU that good hard players will be good coaches but I’m not so sure that’s true

        • Warwick Todd

          Kiwi RL the ARU could do a lot worse than looking at how the NZRU develop and appoint coaches. Australian rugby administration is colluded and very political. It’s broken and the fixes are not obvious.

        • MM

          In the previews that is exactly the back row I said should be playing, Fardy 6 Pocock 7 and Timani at 8, with Hooper and McMahon on the bench. Dropping Fardy to give him a wake-up, or for whatever reason it was done, was just plain dumb, he’s been our most consistent player for the last couple of years, tireless and fearless, make him captain ffs. Douglas and Coleman as locks, and for the good of the team Moore should just simply recognise that he’s no longer up to it and resign now, just walk away from it. Ready in there as a back up to TPN for one more season. I won’t dwell on the backs but Kerevi and Hodge need to be included somewhere. DHP will come good and in time will be great, I think he’s well worth persisting with at 11 or 14. I do think we need to stop selecting the dad’s army guys but I just can’t think of anyone to replace AAC. Genia, eh, 3 steps and pass and by then the defense was well up…… Phipps and Cooper.

        • Brisneyland Local

          You are far more tolerent that I Mr Todd. I agree with all above. I watched a young Qld 10 get screwed over by the Reds (Sam Greene) and I think he might be agood long term investment. But Japan, thanks to Goromaru, have captured the young fella and he has gone. But bringing him in and tutoring him under QC would have been a really good option. Agree totally with Getting Ready in at 2.
          Simmons is one of our only options at 4/5, until Coleman is fixed. Skelton deserves to dissapear back under the rockhe crawled out from underneath until he gets uber fit!
          The Darkness were simply fantastic, and they are barely warming up! Retallick and Read were fantastic. All that and they are rebuilding!

        • Tomthusiasm

          Foley is not a redhead, he’s a day walker at best.

        • Warwick Todd

          He’s within the spectrum……at the edge but within!

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Not always good to take to pen and paper when you’re angry but mate you had every right to be pissed.

        • Brisneyland Local

          Pissed and getting angrier!

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          One of our real worries is a weak Wallabies. We need the pressure that comes from hard games to move forward. You guys need to get it together for all of us

        • Brisneyland Local

          Yeah I know exactly what you mean!

  • yogifj

    Me thinks the wallabies team got strayed and blinded from Dagg’s posterior early on…. Such display must be banned from the playing field….

  • Waterboy

    Please someone tell cheika to shut the hell up and just coach his team. If he knows how.

  • Fact Cheiker

    Whoops! My bad. “Binned”. G&GR had it there, I see from re-reading the article. Sorry, although G&GR has done a bit of a glossing over about the 14-man expertise evident from the men in gold.

    At least after this performance and unlike the World Cup we won’t see acres of internet and newspaper experts saying that the Wallabies are basically world-beaters, based on their really rather good track record against 14-man squads.

    Tactically, the Wallabies need a game plan that leads to Retallick or Whitelock or anybody being red-carded in the first 5 minutes.

    • I think you’ve got a typo in there. You mean Retallick AND Whitelock I think. If they were both red-carded in the first five minutes, the Wallabies might have been close today.

    • Keith Butler

      Phil Kearns had it right. The entire AB pack were off side en masses all night. Who said sarcasm wasn’t dead. Although I have a feeling he was making a serious comment.

  • Joe

    Mais pourquoi prenez vous Giteau ? Le top 14 ne prépare pas à l’intensité particulière des rencontres entre les Australiens et les Néo-Zélandais !! Giteau is not good enough in 2016.

    Ceci dit, de grosses erreurs défensives (Folau ne couvre pas grand-chose en arrière et les ailiers ne prennent pas sa place pour compenser). Pourquoi AAC n’est pas passé au centre avec Kuridrani ?

    You have to stop with Hooper and Pocock together. It does not work !!

    • idiot savant

      il pourrait empirer. le pâté est terminé . il n’y a qu’un foie gras gauche!!!

    • FWIW

      I don’t mind Gits in the side, but on the bench is where he needs to be. He can pretty much cover 9,10,11,12 and 14 which makes him a handy utility. I don’t think moving AAC to inside centre is the way to go, in the modern game I think you need a second playmaking option at 12. I’m sure this will be unpopular, but for mine the most balanced the backline has looked in recent years is with Genia, Cooper and Toomua as 9,10 and 12. This leaves the problem though of not having a world class kicker to slot penalties and conversions, but Foley hasn’t been consistent enough in that regard anyway. To me that remains a massive deficiency at international level (not that it would have helped tonight however).
      For next week I’d be tempted to try Genia, Cooper and Foley as 9,10 and 12 to see if that’s a combo that could work (assuming Toomua won’t play). Kurindrani and Kerevi are almost a direct swap, take your pick.
      I really don’t know what to do with Folau. It would be interesting to see how he goes at OC and get him closer to the action. Not sure who else is as reliable under the high ball though. I think he has to stay put.
      I think Hooper and Pocock do work but once again its about the balance of the pack. The great thing about Hooper is he provides an attacking threat in the forwards and at the breakdown. Defensively solid, he is also brilliant with ball in hand and brings big match temperament to most games he plays in Gold. I can’t really remember him ever having a real shocker. However if Genia gets back to his sniping best, perhaps there is room for a more traditional 8 and moving Pocock to 7.

      • Kiwi rugby lover

        I don’t get this fascination with a 2nd play maker at 12. We’ve never had anyone designated as that. You need someone who can pass and run hard but I really think this 2nd playmaker seems weird to me. All your players need to be able to make the correct decision in attack and defence not just rely on the 10 or 12

        • first time long time

          But Foley can’t do what is required and that is why a second play maker is needed.
          We were spoiled by Tim Horan as our 12 for a long time but thats because he was a great 12 not a player picked to cover the deficiencies of our 10.

        • FWIW

          I think Foley’s a decent fly half but he’s more conservative and defensive much like a Wilko (nothing wrong with that though when its needed). However Australian teams usually win when they are hot on attack with a genuine ballrunner. In short we need more Larkham, less Wilko when the track is dry.

        • first time long time

          IMHO I just don’t think he is up to test level. Sure he has a good game in him every now and then e.g. Eng at RWC but that is how he should be performing on a regular basis.

          Cracked record time I know, but his generally kicking is average to poor and his game management is sadly lacking and he finds himself out of position at crucial moments.

          His defence is not great either or he wouldn’t be hidden away at hooker on defensive lineouts, which only a couple of years ago would have made him unselectable.
          Also, on the off chance we get a lineout turnover our “backline general” is on the blind wing.

        • Who?

          If Foley’s like Wilko, he’s a very poor Wilko. Wilko showed more spark. Foley’s movements are very deliberate. I don’t think he wants to be conservative, he just doesn’t execute with the pace and spark (most of the time) to create what he wants.
          And if he’s Wilko, he’s Wilko with 40% of the boot (bearing in mind that Wilko could kick off both feet, and had more length and accuracy).

        • FWIW

          Nah mate am not saying that, he’s not in Wilko’s class and his kicking accuracy is obviously not up to scratch. Just contrasting the more traditional Wilko style vs. attacking Larkham style of flyhalf. Foley seems, to me anyway, to play like the traditional organiser in the Wilko mold which has its merits in certain circumstances. He’s not as rubbish as he’s being made out to be, but maybe is not the long term answer if we want to run the ball.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          I think part of the issue is that he’s relied on as the only playmaker and so the pressure gets to him. All players need to be able to take advantage of the situation, not just one or two designated as such

        • first time long time

          No argument here.
          And I definitely agree that the pressure gets to him and that is part of the reason why I don’t think he is up to it at the moment.

          Spare a thought for me….. I am flying to Wellington on Fri to watch this horror show unfold. I think I will have to put the lube in checked luggage as I will need way more than they allow in carry on!

        • MM

          Tip – wear black clothing.

        • First time long time

          Even bitter I’m going to weer blick clothing eh

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Good luck mate. Take warm waterproof clothing

        • Joy

          So we really had one play maker on the field ie Gitteau/Toomua. This is the crux of our attacking problem. No vision and no idea at first five.

        • FWIW

          Defences at International level are very good these days, you need attacking threats all though your backline. Playing what’s in front of you doesn’t work this side of the ditch, we’ve tried it before

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Surely having attacking threats all through your backline goes against 2 playmakers. Every player at this level should have the ability to create plays when it’s on.

        • Joy

          Kiwis went to a 2nd play maker last night. I should have said 4th because Dagg and Ben Smith were also on the field.

        • Kiwi rugby lover

          Just my point mate. Every player should be able to make decisions on what is in front of them

  • Kokonutcreme

    Thought Nick Phipps played with a lot of passion and spirit tonight and never gave up in a losing side. He’s not the greatest halfback but he plays above his weight and covers a hell of a lot of ground.

    Not going to say much about the Wallaby effort tonight as there will be plenty of negative and reactive comments about them.

    The All Blacks handling skills, both with their catch and pass as well as their offloading in contact was absolutely superb. I saw Owen Franks pull of an unbelievable catch and flick under enormous defensive pressure that summed up for me the gulf between the two sides at the moment. The Wallabies want to play an expansive, ball in hand running game but their ambitions exceed their abilities at the moment.

    • Moose

      Agree on all fronts. Full credit to the ABs, their skill levels are something else. It would be a pleasure to watch if they were playing someone else.

    • First time long time

      One thing we can be sure of from tonight….. Phipps is a better winger than Hooper

    • Sideshow

      The All Blacks handling skills are what I expect from full time professional rugby players who practice and practice these skills every day for hours. The Wallabies handling skills are what I expect from a 5th grade club team that take the drinking more seriously than the game, and turn up to training on Thursday nights, and maybe Tuesdays too if they feel like it.

  • Queenslander

    Kicking is the province of the coward. Hard phases with lots of contact and keeping possession is how you win. Kicking the ball every time you get it to a very skilled All Blacks team who rarely give up free possessions is just shit house. sorry won’t wear the apologists who talk of kicking being ok so long as it is contested is a bunch of bullshit. Kicking gives a freebie to the opposition and MAYBE you might win 10% back. Fkn sick of it. What muppets are strategising here. Sack the lot of them especially the coach who is responsible for that debacle

    • Seb V

      Maybe you should watch the England series again. Especially game 1. Hard phases with lots of contact and possession clearly doesn’t always work.

      • Queenslander

        Perhaps Seb but 100% can’t win when they have the pill

        • Seb V

          Absolutely. Nearly all our kicks are poorly timed, poorly executed, or just the wrong decision in that situation. I think 99% of our kicks gift the opposition position and not only that half the time they don;t even relieve pressure they actually put pressure back on us Eg. Not finding touch. Kicking straight to the fullback, going for a cross field kick when we got an overlap, though the hands the better option.

        • Who?

          Queenslander, do you remember the 2011 Reds? You remember the ones – the ones who won the Super Title, playing Running Rugby? They kicked it 44% of the time – second highest in the comp, behind only the Crusaders.
          There were two clear issues with our kicking tonight. First off, no one on the field – or directing the game from the box – has a clue what a ‘contested’ kick is. When it stayed in, it wasn’t ever contestable. Secondly, no one seemed to have a clue about the value of ‘touch’. You know, that weird place where, if you put the ball there, the All Blacks back three don’t have a chance to run the ball back, and your forwards get a chance to catch their breath as they meander to the ensuing lineout.
          You don’t need pill to win – England won with under 30% possession. It’s how you use the ball when you have it. And our uses of the pill were abysmal.

        • Queenslander

          We will have to disagree ( and yes love the Reds ’11 ) and not disputing your facts but for most games of any type possession is 9/10ths of the law? I like a team with little kicking, phase rugby, running in pairs, pop passes, rock hard D. Passes from the base to a man on his own, no dummy runners, no changes of angle, no sleight of hand just punching up like a game of mungoes is dead set shithouse. Why is it that with the game lost there was a passage at the end where we hit, drooped, pick and goes, big clean outs, looked great for 13 seconds. You would think an ex Randwick player would do better at coaching some exciting rugby but get this shite dished up.

        • first time long time

          Amount of kicking is not the issue, it is quality, accuracy and contestability that are.

          As we know the reds of ’11, kicked as much or more than any other team, the Highlanders in’15 kicked more than anyone else and they were both the exciting attacking teams in the competition.

        • Who?

          Arguably territory is more important than possession… Arguably.
          I completely agree about needing guile, deceit, options, and forcing defences to make a decision, rather than just a tackle. But a good kicking game is a game that creates that doubt. It’s a part of the whole. A team that runs the ball all the time is what Cheika gave us in June. It doesn’t work, even if the attack had been better than it was. Because a better attack requires more runners, which makes it harder to secure the ball (because it’s harder aerobically). Even if it’s a better attack, it’s still playing with a hand tied behind its back.

    • Kiwi rugby lover

      Bit harsh mate. Nothing wrong with well placed kicks as part of a plan. The issue was this aimless kicking with no follow though

  • Seb V

    No intensity at all, horrible effort.. This is unusual for a Cheika team which was the most disappointing part for me. Then theirs the usual lack of skill and execution which I thought would be a bit better with Bryne, but obviously no improvements there either.

    • The problem with blaming Byrne is that he really hasn’t been there long. Under pressure teams revert to what they know and the All Blacks put the Wallabies under pressure throughout. We saw them revert to poor kicking – not kicking to touch, kicking too long and letting the deep defenders just catch the ball and run it back comfortably and so on.

      If you watched Wales v NZ Biggar has rarely done that throughout his career and rarely did it against the All Blacks either. He’s famously often the one chasing and catching his own kicks. Wales still lost of course but not because of that. But Foley (despite playing against Kiwi opposition a lot more often) kicks pretty aimlessly from hand at Super Rugby level and carries that through to International level. He might well be a better exponent of “ball in hand” rugby than any other fly-half in Australia though. There must be some reason the IRB’s Coach of the Year picks him…

      • Who?

        Barrett, near the end of the game, showed the same dedication to chasing his own kicks. It’s a sign of discipline.
        I also don’t blame Byrne. But I don’t accept it’s reverting to type. Because I don’t think they reverted – they started that way. Which makes me wonder if it wasn’t a Cheika tactic, not only to avoid throwing into our own lineout, but to avoid all lineouts. Regardless, it was sheer stupidity.

        • I agree it was stupid. They might have been trying to avoid lineouts (given how well they went, that’s not particularly stupid) but the kicking in-field was poor from the start. But the pressure of the defensive line speed was always high. Although I think Savea is a better 7 than Cane, Cane is very good at pressuring the 10, so is Barrett. Suddenly Foley isn’t thinking “nice gentle kick to space” he’s thinking “Damn, wallop the ball down there” and you’ve got a long kick to Dagg or Ben Smith and a load of trouble… from minute 1. In that sense I think he’s reverting to his old habits rather than what the new coach is trying to install in him under the defensive pressure.

        • Who?

          But I’m not sure that Mick the Kick is working on his tactics in where to kick. And Giteau’s kick that led to Crotty’s try was under no pressure at all. I genuinely think they were trying to avoid lineouts. But who cares if it’s their lineout..? Better to concede possession for territory with a defensive set piece than concede possession for likely less territory and broken play.
          I think the Australian coaching team needs to give an explanation. Not a “We didn’t do what we wanted.” Because what I saw – kicks into the backfield without pressure, before Cane and Barrett got it figured out (which became a whole heap easier when both Giteau and Toomua were injured) – was game plan based, not pressure-based.

      • Seb V

        Wasn’t blaming him, just noting 4 weeks time with Bryne has zero improvements. It will probably take a couple of years with this lot.

    • Gun

      I can’t understand why Byrne can’t share his All Bkack secrets. Isn’t that what coaches bring, their IP?

  • yogifj

    so we get first attacking lineout in All Blacks 22mtr… let’s throw to Hopper who is against Read (correct me if i’m wrong), Read has taken the 2nd highest no. of lineouts and taller than Hooper… sums up the entire night for me….
    (what tactical nous and smart rugby we’re known for!!!!)

    • Seb V

      Poor decision making as well as execution seems to be the norm for us now.

  • WBGL

    Gees I’m glad we picked a side with mongrel and all that experience. Would have hated to see the score if we hadn’t

  • Seb V

    Surely the end to the Pooper, at least as starters. Both great but can’t have both, bite the bullet put one on the bench.

  • ozrugbynut

    what can you say after that..ive said ‘that’s enough’ many, many times but I’m clearly being punished for something i have done in a past life… get rid of TK, BF, JS and WTF has our defence coach been doing that past four weeks… line speed and physicality was shockingly bad. We looked poor in every facet tonight.

  • Seb V

    We need to hire the Hurricance’s defence coach.

  • Bulldog Sing

    Where was the pig work?? . Loved seeing Moore chicken out and pass back to Geneva.

  • Grumpy

    Australian rugby has deluded itself with the trajectory it was on. In all honesty we should have been knocked out in the RWC QF by Scotland that’s where we fall in the pecking order.

    How different the landscape would be now if it actually happened. Maybe we wouldn’t still be banging our head on the wall with the same game plan over and over again because we think we have this magical elixir that can best any team.

    Simply not the case. If my mum can read exactly what we are going to do in attack while sitting in the stands next to me your not doing it right ….

    Stephen Larkham is the Brad Fitler of Rugby Union, great player…. rubbish coach

    • yogifj

      We need to start talking about Cheika now…

      • FWIW

        Its a poisoned chalice, this Wallaby coaching gig

      • Sambo

        I think it’s equally as much to do with the level of talent in Australia… the whole super rugby season was a shambles for Aus

    • Your mother is an astute rugby fan who taught her son the love of the game…
      The Wallabies are stuttering, but they are not losing on purpose..
      I expect them to fight hard in NZ..
      The Blacks must beware…

      • onlinesideline

        beware ? of what ? – the slippery road , beware of the wallabies – in NZ – I dont think so mate

  • Blinky Bill of Bellingen NSW

    Well extra time together didn’t quite go according to script eh?

    Silver lining number 2 – Newly appointed Wallaby Skills Coach Mick Byrne, can start absolutely anywhere he desires, and it has to be an improvement.

    • Brisneyland Local

      Yep agree BB, Mic Byrne has a clean skills sheet to start with.
      Because after last night it is apparent we dont have any skills.

  • Boby

    Did anyone else notice the game plan?…. Put Ben Mcalman at 8 but put a 6 one his back.. hooper will play seven but never enter a ruck…. pocock will play 6 disguised as an 8 and our 6’8 locks will run decoys to lift hooper in the lineout. Genius

    • Keith Butler

      It was Cheks cunning plan to fool the opposition. As for his ranting and finger pointing at half time, I’d expect something a bit more constructive from an international coach no matter how poorly the team was performing.

    • Kiwi rugby lover

      Didn’t notice it at the game but watching it today I did. Seems weird mate, 8 playing at 6, 6 playing at 8 and 7 playing at 11. I thought Pocock was pretty good but had to work on his own which limited his play. NZ loosies work more as a team and play their role not swapping back and forwards

      • adastra32

        The mucking around smacks of desperation.

  • Haz

    The thing that shocked me most in this game was a line out around the 70th minute on the near side that was thrown to the front and lost. Douglas vs Retallick.

    Retallick is watching Douglas like a hawk and Douglas does a dummy jump. He does no then reset in the sunk position. When he starts to drop down for the actual jump, Retallick reacts and beats him into the air. That’s shocking stuff. There’s no excuse for that. If you’re jumping at the front you start in the sunk position and just go straight up.

    My age grade coach would have murdered me for that.

    • 30 mm tags

      That is a very good comment. Your grade coach must be astute. Who is coaching our line out? Why are we not having L/Os that are say 4 or 5 man L/Os in two pods ? Surely we can avoid losing 4 or so on our own throw?

      • Who?

        But Mumm came on and fixed our lineout. Well, he did if you read the Ratings article…

  • Gus

    Geez that was painful.

    Clearly Chieka has to make changes but injury forced ones will limit his scope. Falau has to come into the centres now with toomua if he’s ok. Is moore’s position sustainable? I’d start TPN. I know it won’t be popular but Mumm was a better option than Simmons. Mccalman is not a test player. Fardy has to start. God help us next weekend.

  • jamie

    You were saying, Hugh?

    Next week:

    Sio
    TPN
    Kepu
    Douglas
    Coleman
    Fardy
    Pocock
    Timani
    Genia
    Cooper
    Hodge
    toomua
    Kerevi
    Folau
    DHP

    Seriously, I think I’d rather fucking James O’Connor in the backline at the moment

    Fuck the old guys. They can’t help us win shit. Fuck Moore. Fuck hooper. Pathetic efforts. Foley? Well. Decent rugby player. Fucking shit 10.

    Phipps did okay on the wing. Mainly because he didn’t have to fucking pass

    • Who?

      Been saying that for years about Phipps! Great attitude, good pace, our best player (along with Genia), playing on the wing…
      Don’t want Cooper for next weekend, though. If we pick him, then when we replicate last night’s loss, we’ll blame him for it. And all whine that he can’t play in NZ…
      I don’t think Foley had a great game last night. His kicking was poor. But I’m certain – given every kicker did it – that not finding touch was an instruction, and a 10 isn’t the person you blame for a 34 point loss at international level.

      • Brisneyland Local

        OTher than the fact that Foley has been kicking shit for the last 6 Wallabies outings! I agree that they bring in Cooper, we loose it will all be his fault, But I reckon Cooper would do a better job!

        • Who?

          I completely agree that Foley’s been poor all year. Saying that he was anything other than fantastic last year is dangerous though – might get you banned. :-P
          Cooper has a bigger boot, and is a pretty handy tactical kicker. But I still don’t want him in Welly, purely because his presence allows many to gloss over the many larger issues in the team.

        • Brisneyland Local

          True. I must admit I am a real Cooper fan. I have been to many Rookies to Reds days and watched him with the kids, and he was just brilliant. Genia, he spent so much time with 7 year old daughter and really inspired her. I love watching him play, but am not imune to his weaknesses. But yes you are right, if he comes on board, and things work well, for what ever reason, it will paper over the cracks instead of fixing the structual weaknesses that exist in our team.

        • Who?

          I think Cooper’s attacking vision is completely unmatched by any of our alternatives. I’m more than aware of his foibles. And if it were a straight shoot out between Foley and Cooper, I’d pick Cooper every time. But that’s wrong labelled as provincial bias, by people who point to mistakes largely made half a decade ago as evidence that he’s flakey. He was our best 10 under Deans, our best 10 under Link. And he’s had a horribly interrupted period under Cheika.
          But again, there are many, many bigger issues at play here. Cooper’s a small part of a massive puzzle, which starts with Cheika, Grey and Larkham, and works through from there…

        • Brisneyland Local

          Mate keep talking like that and I will make you the Wallabies Coach! But I dont think you would take the job, and I dont think you would be alone in that one!

        • Who?

          GAGR would veto it. :-P I’d consider it… Not saying I’m any good (the junior team I manage – not coach, manage – this year has a record barely better than the Wallabies), but I don’t think I could do much worse! Same as most on here… Even those with whom I often disagree.

    • first time long time

      Throw Campbell Magnay on the bench and just tell him to cut loose when he gets on there.
      No pressure or blame if it doesn’t come off. Lets see what he can do.
      We can’t just rearrange the deck chairs but I much prefer you’re team to that slop Cheika picked.

      • first time long time

        Sorry, the deck chairs I am talking about are the non performers and I don’t want them just moved to the bench.

    • Jim

      You had me in total agreement until you picked Cooper

      • jamie

        So you think foley still deserves his spot after that abomination?

    • Parker

      Second your call for O’Connor. Put him at 12 with Kerevi or Folau outside him.

  • Canuckruck

    Oh you guys are grumpy in here today and with good reason.

    I’m bummed that I was up at 4 am to watch that poor Wallaby performance. The good news is that, as a Canadian, while cheering for the Wallabies, it was easier to appreciate the great performance of the All Blacks.

    Dropped balls, aimless kicking and just plain old shit play is no way to win against the ABs. Maybe you can bring some of the 7s girls into the team as backs subs?

    • Nutta

      I’ve been waiting for the chicks reference. Not without validity though.

      • Kiwi rugby lover

        It took longer than I thought it would to get mentioned

      • first time long time

        Better hands
        Better vision
        Better coached
        Faster
        Harder??? at least mentally

    • Toadflax

      Seriously though. In terms of commitment and grit the women’s team has it all over them.

      • Canuckruck

        No shit! Dug deep and played some great rugby

  • Qualify

    To this day I cannot understand your countries obsesion with Simmons. For as long as he keeps on playing you can kiss any hopes for any cup goodbye. “Lineout Specialist” pfft the man is dead weight. Bring in Holloway, Tumani and Coleman.

    • The Big Lebowski

      Agreed. Holloway is the future at No.8 Sadly cruelled by injury this year. Timani and Coleman need some game time.

      • Qualify

        Look the way I see it you should scratch this year as an experiment and blood as many young guys as possible. Coleman Tumani Holloway Arnold Godwin Kerevi Haylett-Petty McMahon… to name a few… should get as much games as possible. You are not going to win games with Simmons Fardy McCalman and Mumm. Not one of those players strike any form of worry or fear into the other teams. And play Folau at 13 ffs! At leat he can catch a ball!

    • Adrian

      Exactly Quality. Simmons is a “specialist” who can’t do his speciality when it really counts, and can’t do anything else

  • The Big Lebowski

    When I was at boarding school we used to play touch footy any chance we got. Before school, recess and lunch breaks, between dinner and study and at study breaks. The combinations developed over six years for many and four years for me. It was natural to expect a certain play or pass from a player, and we knew where to be in support. Consequently, the schoolboy comp was ours with relative ease and we had six players in that year’s Australian Schoolboys team.

    That’s how the All Blacks play – like every spare minute they are playing touch, developing combinations and working out ways to score against their opposite number.

    The Wallabies, however, look to be so bogged down in structure – how many times have we heard players and coaches say “trust our structures” – that they have genuinely forgotten to play rugby in a way they can beat their opposite number. They “trust the structures” so much that they have outsourced the need for skills. So much that they play the game at about a quarter of the pace of the opposition. So much that they repeat the same inane tactics that can be defused mid-field, behind the gain line time after time.

    It’s absolutely fucking crazy.

    The gap in widening in many positions, and it is time to select players with whom there is at least a chance of the gap closing over the next few years.

    And it needs to start at the top.

    Stephen Moore, you’ve been a great servant to Australian rugby, but you are not the future – time to hang the boots up.

    The gap between Moore and Dane Coles is widening. There is nothing more that I would like to see than Coles’ smug face being turned inside out (where is Brendan Cannon when you need him?) But he is a seriously good player, and he is leaving Moore in his wake. Time to pick some of these young, hungry blokes in Super Rugby that don’t have this massive “Paul Gallen” complex hanging over them.

    Kepu can retire and give Alaalatoa a serious go. I don’t know if he’s up to it, but he’s young and big and looks like he could handle himself. Again, no PG complex.

    Keep Douglas and Simmons, but for god sake get them to play tight.

    Hooper – love you mate, but sorry, Sam Cane is picking up where McCaw left off. We need seriously contenders at the breakdown.

    Pocock – seriously below form and realistically isn’t going to play much of a part for the next few years.

    Find a Jerome Kaino clone and stick him at 6 – Lopeti Timani anyone?

    Genia acquitted himself well, but again we are like robots. When Genia ran it forward he looked dangerous.

    Foley – well, this just goes to show that we have no fucking depth in this position. And don’t say QC should get a game. We are atrocious in the 10 shirt.

    Midfield – Kuridrani looked like a second-rate league player out there at the moment. Folau in at 13. And for the love of god draught in Reece Hodge, Kyle Godwin or Kerevi for 12.

    DHP – slot him in a 15. Piss AAC off and bring in the two fastest wingers in the comp. Their skill level can’t be any worse than the current mob.

    Bench – Horne is not a test player. Toomua, continually disappoints (either he underperforms or gets a knock)

    I’d rather get flogged with a team that might get better over time, then get flogged with a team that is getting worse.

    Fucking atrocious.

    • Who?

      The only way that your suggestions would have any hope of happening is for Cheika to be sacked…
      And whilst you’re complaining, some of the positions, the complaints aren’t right. Kepu’s good against any opposition. He might’ve had a poor night last night, but the solution isn’t to feed Ala’alatoal – a LHP who did ok last night against a scrum that most Kiwis don’t rate (as Bray mentioned, their bench LHP didn’t even have a contract earlier this year!) – to the Pumas.

      • The Big Lebowski

        You’ve picked one position I singled out….any more?

        Remember, Kepu is one of the merry band of brothers that have returned prematurely from Europe. Maybe that’s more indicative of attitude and selection of the group than ability and form.

        My general point was that why pick a bloke when the chance of actually closing the supremacy gap that the ABs now enjoy in every position is negligible? Why select players past their peak? By definition it means they will get worse.

        • Sideshow

          Not quite sure why you’re shitting on Pocock. Love the touch footy story though, that rings true to me too. I’d add that all warm up laps should be done in pairs with a ball, practicing passing.

        • Who?

          Sure. Pocock did ok, all things considered. The penalty against him was wrong – the first infraction was entry from the side by two ABs (can’t believe Peyper missed that, given they entered a ruck from around him!), and after that, given Pocock wasn’t bound, he was effectively play halfback and there’s no law against halves using their hands.
          I actually agree about Lopeti – I’d have him at 8, with Pocock at 7 and Fardy at 6 (but looking to find a replacement, as he likely won’t make 2019).
          Folau to 14. DHP to 15. Kerevi at 13, Godwin at 12.
          Completely agree about AAC, and Horne. Toomua doesn’t deserve the aggro, he’s generally done ok.
          The reason I’d flagged Kepu is that he’s an exception to the rule about older players. Genia, I’ve no issue with him coming back, as he’s under 30. But props mature later. There’s no one pushing for his spot. Ala’alatoa’s a Loose Head, not a THP. He did ok, but he was scrummaging against a guy who didn’t have an NZRU contract in March…

    • teach

      Didn’t Deans say something about playing what is in front of you? He may have been on to something……

    • Willem Labuschagne

      I think most of the wailing and gnashing of teeth is a bit over the top. I get it, Australians don’t like to lose. But having rewatched the game, I don’t think the Wallaby team that ran onto the field was bad.
      Giteau on one side and Genia on the other are the keys to getting the best out of Foley, who is a dangerous running fly half when he is confident enough to stand flat and take it to the line.

      Until Giteau was injured, the Wobblies were actually chugging along smoothly. Yes, both Foley andGiteau had kicks for touch that didn’t go out, and an AB counterattack resulted in a try, but the Wallabies were also creating chances and sharing territory. It was after Gits went that Foley stood deeper and crept into his shell, and Genia’s lack of match fitness began to tell.
      In the forwards, Pocock was actually magnificent, stealing 6 balls!
      The real question marks are: How could a scrum that was so good at the RWC become so innocuous? And did they not practise any line outs during the 4 week preparation? Who had the brainwave of making Hooper, with his short though strong and comely little arms, into a line out jumper? And finally, where was Folau during most of the match? (Oh yes, hanging around the back waiting for kicks when he could have been in the thick of it if he was playing at 13.)

      • 30 mm tags

        Yes, Folau is over it and we are over him. As I said in the post reply he was 40 metres out of position when the first try was scored. He is a player who never hunts but must be given the ball or have it kicked to him before he starts to motor.

    • 30 mm tags

      That is comprehensive analysis. Is Higginbotham injured.LopetinTimani or Jed Holloway need to be unleashed? So much better than McCalman. Mc Calman is magnificent on the line in defence but he is no attacking threat.
      The elephant in the room is Folau. Unless he has a ball kicked to him or he gets a ball passed to him he is useless. The Emperor actually has no clothes! Chris Latham would run rings around him. 6 tries by the AB. Where the hell was Izzy. His time is up. He must have been 30 m behind the play when that first try was scored. Play Phipps or Nick Frisby on the wing and tru Haylett -Petty at 15.. Both Phipps and Frisby are ferociously fast and show more commitment than a dozen others. Maybe the others are unfit? Maybe tired but my border collie chases a stick with more enthusiasm. So many changes needed

  • Brorannosaurus Rex

    All this Cheika talk is misplaced. The man was a genius last September. He’s a successful coach that made a rod for his back with last year’s mirage.

    The problem is the playing group. They lack the speed, strength, confidence and most of all skills to match it with class teams. The ARU hasn’t been investing in high performance and it shows. A new coach might result in a short term bump but we’ll revert to this again.

    ultimately we are wasting the majority of our union talent on rugby league. Not sure we can ever rise to the top while league is the dominant code

    • Who?

      Who picked the playing group..? Who’s responsible for the game plan..? Was there any sign of good coaching in that game?

  • Blackfish

    Did Simmons take the field or did he fall asleep on the team bus?

  • dsb

    time to clean out the team and even
    coaches. worst wobbles game in decades. Genia was about the only on to show his class. Foley Kundra Phipps should be dropped. the pretty boys at the back of the scrum were in effective. we need bigger ugly men of the fardy ilk.
    pick young keen fast and flexible young blokes

    • wilful

      Everyone says Phipps played well, considering. I wouldn’t know, I couldn’t bear to watch the second half, but you’re the first person to complain about Phipps.

      • Hutch

        Phipps was the only back making inroads in the second half. I’ve always said he is a great Rugby player, just not so great at passing the ball.

        • first time long time

          Spot on…Phipps is a much better winger than Hooper!

        • sideshow

          Clearly Phipps is a better winger than halfback!

        • first time long time

          Sorry already used that one last night when I was drunk! but it still holds true

      • dsb

        Not his performance on the night as a winger, after all he scored the try. He is probably a nice block but he is not test rugby or world class. Genia is and we should be seriously considering our options for who has potential to shadow and replace Genia when the time comes.

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Mate I agree. The fans want to see some improvement and if there is a loss but a clear plan forward it would be accepted better, but this continual losing while moving backwards is just shit

  • onlinesideline

    this is bad, really really bad.

    PS … shit

  • Toadflax

    There is a lot of understandable grumpiness this morning but let’s not lose sight of the key point from last night. The Darkness were amazing. A totally deserved win and they should be congratulated for it. Back to the drawing board (and the Valdoxin) for us I am afraid.

  • Fatflanker

    Becoming fairly obvious that the Wallaby’s biggest weakness is the coaching. Chieka needs to get a grip and show some self-control in the box. How can the team hold it together if the coach is losing his shit like a 3YO five minutes into the game? – he will lose the change room and the rugby public.
    Notwithstanding the injuries, its hard to see what meaningful contribution Bernie is making as assistant coach.

  • first time long time

    We will always be on a hiding to nothing when the first picked players demand certain other players are required to compensate for the must pick’s deficiencies.

    Cheika’s must picks;
    Hooper – requires that arguably the best open side flanker in the world has to play out of position making it harder for him to do his job properly.
    Foley – requires that you pick someone else who can manage the game and kick because he is rubbish at both
    I am tired and disillusioned now.

    I thought it was pessimism after the 2nd test against England when I said we were potentially looking at a domestic test record this year of 20% FFS we will be lucky to get that on the back of that performance.

    Surely Link can rebuild Christchurch and coach the Wallabies…… we wouldn’t be any worse off.

  • Garry

    The Wallabies undoing all the good PR work done by our ladies in Rio. Not many youngsters wanting to become a Wallaby after that.
    This team reminds me of Bart Simpson and the cupcake electric shock. Same, same, bzzzzzzt.

    • first time long time

      I think more would be considering a sex change so they can play for the women’s team at the Tokyo Olympics!

  • Mart

    I can cop loosing to the All Blacks they are the top team But not like that!
    Really really poor performance from professionals.
    A few average selections that turned out to be exactly that.
    These guys should be apologising to the fans.

  • Harry

    Last night was the worst performance from a Wallabies side I’ve ever seen and I saw Tonga beat Australia at Ballymore in 1973. The Wallabies were bereft of ideas and basic competencies like catch and piss, kick, defence and lineouts. Clueless and no proper game plan. Several individuals and the collective unit gave up a bit too early as well.

  • Adrian

    The Lineout, the LINEOUT

    Last week I mentioned it, and I’ll mention it again.

    Our lineout “SPECIALISTS” CAN’T WIN LINEOUTS WHEN IT REALLY COUNTS.

    They win well at other times, but not when it counts

    Adding another “specialist” bean pole who can’t do anything else will make matters worse.

    Need athletic, physical guys who’ll front-up in shorter lineouts. The athletic physical guys can also “man-up” in general play.

    Bring in Coleman, Timani, Skelton, and maybe Houston and/or McMahon.

    No more tame forwards

    • Really?

      How the hell can you have the words lineout and Skelton in the same post, you should be on the stage

    • Haz

      Houston second rate. One of the worst 8’s in the prem. Never an international.

  • first time long time

    I posted this yesterday……….

    What will we see tonight…..

    Qu 1. A Wallabies forward pack wading in knees and elbows, belting the black jerseys at the breakdown with accuracy and intent?

    Qu 2. Parity/dominance in the scrum and lineout for the men in gold?

    Qu 3. Forward runners at near full pace and the advantage line when they receive the ball?

    Qu 4. A back line who’s general thrust is toward the All Black’s try line, not the side line?

    Qu 5. Smart proficient kicking when required to clear our 22 and take advantage of space behind what is likely to be a fast advancing black wall?

    Qu 6. Dare I hope for at least 1 cross field kick for Izzy each half?

    Forget the team now, if the answer to 4 of the first 5 Qu’s is YES…… Wallabies by 5.

    If you grant me a YES for Qu 6 as well…… Wallabies by 12

    I forgot Qu 7….. Blind optimism?……YES

    I guess now we know that the answer to all except Qu 7 is a resounding NO!

    The big issue for me is that Qus 1,3,4,5 and 6 were completely in our hands not reliant on how the AB’s performed. Yet we failed at them all.

    Qu 8. What is the remedy??

  • Unanimous

    Lots of negative comments, but still I don’t think they adequately cover the problems in the Wallabies game last night.

    What was going on on the Wallabies’ right wing in defence? Was there any plan behind the attack? Is Foley disappointed that he can’t give opponents a chinese burn so he kicks into their forearms in some attempt to achive the same outcome?

    Postives? We counter rucked well at times. Falau was good on the whole. Can’t think of anything else.

    I did learn though that Phipps is just as good on the wing as Hooper. Not sure what use that knowledge is.

    • Haz

      Folau was good on the whole.

      Except for the fact that he still can’t kick. Which puts pressure on the players around him and limits the options when he is kicked too.

  • onlinesideline

    whats Graham Henry doing these days ?

  • reggie

    biggest concern for me was our defense. the first try was a perfect example, it shouldnt surpise us that the ABs will spin it wide on the counter attack, yet we were to slow to react. england also scored a lot of tries against us. the ABs rushed defense squashed our attack. if we’re putting no pressure on the oppositions attack whether it be with rushed D or big hits (like chek did at the warratahs) then its a given the opposition will make meters and score points. we can take heart that this can be fixed or at least greatly improved. the question is whether this will happen. nathan grey is cheikas man and ive seen little chek to expect a bold decision like replacing one of his assistants. i believe cheika is the man for the job but if we dont win games against SA and Argentina and put in much improved performances against the ABs then perhaps the ARU need to step in and mandate who will be cheikas assistants. a quality defense and attack coach. as the GAGR boys raised on their podcast the AB model is now that assistant coaches are no longer developing or junior coaches they are quality coaches in there own right ie wayne smith.

  • idiot savant

    Like most Australians I’m in shock.

    Firstly congratulations All Blacks on an outstanding performance. And thank you for re-inventing the way the game is played and making it an entertaining spectacle. I have been thinking that the game had become boring since forward packs stopped being coached to all get to each ruck (which left space for the backs). Now we have endless forward punch ups and recycles which can often be like watching paint dry. Now I know why Rugby League got rid of unlimited tackles. Some rugby games are still boring because of this but the ABs have shone a light on a way out of that tedium. And as we saw last night we have some catching up to do.

    What to do about last night? Well I think probably the only thing Cheika got right was his analysis that the defence was lacking. Obvious when you’ve had your line crossed 9 times! I think the way to show character next week is to maybe aim to cut that down by two thirds. Forget attack. We’ve lost 5 tests in a row after preening ourselves in camps about attack plans. Lets earn the right to attack.

    I dont think wholesale changes should be made for 2 reasons. One, all the players who havent played are going to be more off the pace than the group last night and two, id be worried about the mental scarring of blooding talented youngsters against the worlds best side in world best form on their home track. I’m praying for sleet and gale forced winds.

    The only yardstick for replacement should be can they tackle better. So I think the entire week should be devoted to defence from basic technique (Horne, Toomua please pay attention) to defensive structure. Whatever plan they had was a complete failure. Thats probably more than enough homework for the week.

  • Gun

    Too true

  • Qualify

    1. Sio
    2. TPN
    3. Kepu
    4. Coleman
    5. Arnold/Fardy
    6. McMahon/Hooper
    7. Pocock
    8. Timani
    9. Genia
    10. Foley/Cooper
    11. Mitchell
    12. Hodge
    13. Folau
    14. AAC
    15. DHP

  • HighPlainsDrifter

    The only thing that was worse than the Wallaby performance was Phil Kearns pre game musings , he is wasted on Fox Sports …needs a gig in the Canberra press gallery parliament house – I think he’d fit in swimmingly . Wouldn’t be surprised if Chieka went for broke and flew in Johnny Knoxville , Wee Man , Stevo and Preston Lacey to “harden up the squad” .

  • Globalfan

    Could have been worse….

  • McWarren

    Ge all that experience pulled us through to its inevitable conclusion, added to our much hyped mongrel and attacking genius it’s no wonder we crossed late.

  • Grant

    It’s a sad day when you go to the Bledisloe and the AB supporters go away disappointed when their team won 42-8. Be they an AB or Wallaby supporter the punters pay very good money to see a great game of rugby and they were ripped off on Saturday night. I took my family of 5 and the boys brought a mate – 7 tickets I paid for plus the obligatory chips, beers, Maxibons and Krispy Kremes. This is premium priced entertainment and the ARU need to pull their socks up and deliver a premium product that justifies the prices they want to charge. Cheika is breaking the wrong records and has shown he is not the magic bullet the problem and the solution are well beyond the coach. Someone needs to organise an intervention.

  • Henry Dissmissinya

    I saw abrasive and physical mongrel out there. It was the darkness romping making shattering tackles, didn’t see much of us doing it,

  • Brisneyland Local

    Yep, I would be getting my EA to sharpen up my CV if I were Cheiks!

  • yogifj

    too harsh on Cheika?!?!… seriously… Deans era was judged on less merits (and I’m not even trying to defend Deans)…. and he didn’t even have the opportunity to field Euro players like Cheika…
    These are world class athletes and Cheika is a Test coach… all the weaknesses displayed now is what we’re talking about for a couple months now… kicking, decision-making, chasing kicks, multiple game plans, (Folau up and under in opposition 5 mtr)….

  • Brisneyland Local

    Love your sarcasm. I know some people say it is the lowest form of wit, but I find it truly funny. But I must apologise. I have no sense of humour about this. Am soooo angry! But great comment Baz. tip of the hat!

  • yogifj

    you’re trolling me, right!!!
    Because of my hurt and diminished senses….(And if you’re not…) They’ve had a “dress rehearsal” during the world cup against All Blacks, and then against England for set pieces esp. lineouts a couple weeks ago.

  • ozrugbynut

    hill runs? thats the job of the s15 pre season.

  • yogifj

    Which is why Steve Hansen wants “honest review needed into Olympic sevens flop”…. dude, get off it.
    They were beaten by Japan!!!, and would have not made it to quarter-finals had USA beat Fiji,… This is FIRST EVER MEDALS for Sevens we’re talking about…

  • Jamie

    NZ are also the most successful Sevens nation ever! How many Sevens circuits have Aus won? The Kiwis have won 14 of them. No one else comes close. Add that to 3 Commoneealth golds and two Sevens WC titles.

  • yogifj

    Of course they are… but are they the most successful Olympics Sevens team….??? NO!!!!….
    (the reason) Do you know much much $$ they invest into sevens compared to Samoa, Tonga and Fiji, Kenya, PNG, etc… (put together; while Island Nations players get European contracts after season or two after sevens), NZ players stay in Sevens Team for many seasons while Island Nations players leave…
    Compared to NZ, do you know how much AUS invest in Sevens program… please do not compare oranges vs apples…. you have no idea!!!!!

  • Grant NZ

    Uh, NZ players leave too. They get a Super Rugby contract and that’s it – happened with Victor Vito, Cory Jane, Liam Messam, Julian Savea, Ardie Savea…the list goes on and on.

  • The Big Lebowski

    Yeah, Cheika has lost his way, but dropping him is a bigger disruption then, say, canning Moore.

  • yogifj

    Yes, they do leave but NZ players actually are fully contracted by NZRU… Messam and Vito were the only ones who actually spent some seasons with sevens team (I think Jane too)…
    ….but the point of this chat was does/doesn’t NZ give a shit about Sevens…. they very much do… that’s why Hansen is calling for a review on the failed RIO Olympics games….
    ….and secondly, NZ are the most successful 7’s team ever, yes (well, in the 7s circuit era now… before that it was Fiji)… and compared to how many circuits AUS has won… ARU doesn’t look into sevens with the same investment as NZRU…

  • Who?

    Don’t forget Mealamu and Woodcock. ;-)

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    A bit rough when they can’t blame McCaw’s cheating anymore

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    I think you’re right, the quick fixes like “the pooper” have been worked out by the opposition and there’s nothing new. The Wallabies need a more traditional loose forward pack, after all every other team playing it that way do it for a reason. Basic skills need to improve and they need a game plan that uses the strengths they have not some aspirational dream that the players can’t execute

  • The Big Lebowski

    Look, you’re probably right but boning Cheika mid-comp is not going to be productive for the new coach. Clearing the odd poor performer is akin to an interchange.

    All I want to see go is those robotic, mistake-factory structures that he seems to put in place, are predictable, can be defended against with ease. Whatever it is that the ABs do, it feels like they have 30 on the field. Can’t do that with rigid structure because you don’t have players following the ball.

  • I’m pretty certain Baz was being sarcastic.

  • Bizzare

    Maybe there-in lies the problem, the ARU are so focused on the Wallabies and the less support and recognition they give Club Rugby and Junior Rugby the worse the Wallaby results. The rise of Women’s 7s is brilliant, but this and Viva 7s is not the panacea that fixes Australian rugby. A holistic plan anyone?

  • Sideshow

    Yes! Players following the ball, especially after a break, is seriously devoid in the Wallabies. The All Blacks do this en mass, with excited enthusiasm, like a pack of wild dogs closing in on their prey.

  • Joy

    No, he’s not right. We lost because we were bashed. And we will never win it because we wont bash. Simple as that. Cheika is dead right to focus on this issue but you can’t make a silk purse from a sour’s ear. He might be able to toughen Simmons, Mumm and co up for a few games a year but they will always revert. Backs need to physical at gain line and crunch their tackles. Cheika needs to find tough bastards fast then work on their skills, not the other way around. All the other woes stem from this failing. We desperately need a robotic factory structure. One called bashing.

  • first time long time

    Ahaaaaah! so you finally admit that he was cheating.
    I always thought you were a very liberated kiwi.

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    No mate. I just said you can’t now blame him TBH all players cheat when they can, he just knew the rules so well and was so quick that he did things no one could believe so they labelled him a cheat

  • Grant

    We knew the old guard was hanging in to the RWC, who knew the AB’s has such speed and talent to replace them.

  • first time long time

    I liked you better when I thought you were coming clean ; )

  • Brisneyland Local

    I couldnt agree with you more. My view is it is a number 7’s role to cheat, it is up to the referump to police it! Some you get away with some you dont, and you adjust accordingly. What pissed us Aussies off was that he was just better at it than most, and we wished he was ours, or we had one as good it as he was!

  • Tomthusiasm

    GOAT.

  • Grant NZ

    They do care about 7’s but it’s very much the red-headed step-child. Even this year when they said they were gonna allow contracted XV’s players to devote themselves to 7’s, they had the rubbish 3 tournament thing that meant the players were neither Arthur nor Martha. Only Akira & Ardie were really success stories as far as going back to 7’s this year and Ardie then changed his mind when he realised he was in with a chance of AB selection.

    But my comment was based on your claim NZ players stay in Sevens team for many seasons. Yes, the likes of DJ Forbes etc do, cause they can’t get a Super Rugby contract. And yeah, the playmakers available have generally been the best for the job but for the most part in the last decade the NZ 7’s team has had its strike players like Vito or J Savea available for a couple of seasons only before they move on to XV’s.

  • Brisneyland Local

    Tip of the hat, good sir! That is the winning comment!

  • Brisneyland Local

    Well said that man!

  • Adrian

    True Jacko
    But right now we don’t have the players to put in the lineout (and win our own ball). The guys not there (eg Carter) are similar to Simmons, no matter how many we have. They still loose against quality pressure. The Brumbies demonstrated this several times.
    What having both Hooper and Pocock does is make it so he can’t pick Skelton, who was by the way effective in 3rd test v England.
    Coleman and Arnold might end up being the tight types, and I’d pick them if available.
    In the meantime, we need different lineout tactics. Shorter lineouts are messy and hard to attack from, but better than no ball at all, at crucial times.
    That frees us up to attack thin with big brutes, and to attack their maul

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Pocock and Hooper together were a good surprise packet that took care of weak No 8 stocks, but like all surprises the smart coaches work out a plan to nullify it. All other teams play a loosie combination because that gives you the best options in a game. The Wallabies need a good solid 8 and personally I’d have Pocock, Fardy and Timane starting.

  • reggie

    im not saying constructive criticism shouldn’t be made but to at least balance some of the commentry let me put this out there…it’s clear from comments made by chek and the players they worked really hard in the lead up to this match. they made no excuses. the wallabies are our team and if the players are putting in, then we should get behind them. take giteau, the guy forfeited a large sum of money to represent the wallabies. that is due some respect. lets also remember that even on our best day, the ABs are much better then we are

  • Willem Labuschagne

    Sorry, Joy, but you’re confusing rugby with that dumbed-down version called ‘league’. There was urgency and energy in the AB defence, but there was no bash. It’s about a positive attitude, not being tough.

    Cheika’s main mistake is that he’s emphasised the mongrel aspect instead of the things that make a rugby team more than a line of armoured knights charging to bash one another — technique in the tackle (which helps avoid injury), organisation (which helps two on one tackles, and ensures someone is always backing up)’ and the subtle skill of off-loading at the right instant.

    Bash has very little to do with it — or have you not watched Argentina play and lose?

  • Parker

    That’s mungo ball.

  • jamie

    Skelton played half a game against England and was shit.

    Coleman, Douglas and Arnold are our best locks atm. Timani is an 8.drop hooper after that

  • Joy

    I think you’re confusing rugby with ballet.
    All Blacks not tough!! All Blacks don’t bash?? What game did you watch last night?
    Asked how to beat them before the match Brad Thorne simply replied “Bash them”. I agree because we have no hope of out thinking, out running or out skilling them.

  • Warwick Todd

    ‘Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, but the highest form of intelligence.’ – Oscar Wilde

  • Brisneyland Local

    Touche! Old Boy!
    Touche

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Yeah not sure where all that came from but it is half back, 1st 5/8, 2nd 5/8, centre. Sounds fucken weird when you think about it

  • Kiwi rugby lover

    Absolutely! Maybe spending time on game plan, decision making and tackling may have been more productive.

All Blacks
@steve_l15

Canberra born and bred Rugby fan brought up on Canberra Kookaburra and ACT Brumbies Rugby.

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