AIC Rugby 2018

[Garry Owens]

Anyway .......initial thoughts are I think this is a fantastic outcome for all AIC Schools . It shows some courage in the decision that has been made and a big dose of progressive pragmatism. No confusion at all.

The increased level of choice for the boys is a huge boon

I doubt that the decision will lead to a big spike in numbers from families that otherwise would not have sent their son to an AIC School - just because AFL and League is now on offer .

The action for AFL and League , formatively , is still ( and will continue to be ) in the Clubs and flow on into Franchise Academy programs ( Lions ) and then the raft of Cups / Competitions and Pathway Management that already exists in what league offers - AIC , in terms of quality of competition against those structures that currently exist will have to prove itself , and frankly , that is a long road

Yes , I think it undoubtedly makes AIC Rugby weaker , however , from what I have been able to observe over the last 5 years or so - it has felt like a larger base of fee paying AIC constituent families and their sons have had a greater interest in league and maybe to a smaller degree , AFL . That traditional bind of Rugby as it was 20 to 30 years ago has been loosening year on year

It is up to Rugby , as a Sport , to respond and engage better more broadly and there is plenty of recent evidence that Rugby is trying to do this . The recent overhaul of Opens Schoolboys trials to level the playing fields for AIC and CSS Schools is a good example

Maybe too little too late

 

[Garry Owens]

I couldn't say definitively Reg, but yes I think they do. That's why schools invest in their programmes because they know they are going to attract good athletes into those respective sports.

If Brisbane Grammar played League instead of Union and there was no rowing, I know plenty of dads who wouldn't be sending Billy there.

Don’t you mean Sebastian or Rupert ?

 

[Galloper]

A near sighted move by the AIC. Yes, the "demand" has been there for years but rather than trying to enhance the Union competition, they have now squeezed it into term 2 with barely a trial game before a 7 week competition.

And this is a pathway?

• How much $ has the AFL and the NRL given to the AIC ?
• Why only one team per grade? What will other boys do?
• Why not extend the Union comp to a home & away over 2 terms? (like NZ schools rugby)
• Where will some boys' focus be in the last few weeks of term 2?

I am sure this move will have its positives with the likelihood of attracting more RL boys to AIC schools but they will only play if they are able to make the top team. Maybe the GPS schools lose a few boys who play both codes? I don't know.

But I expect the AIC schools to lose a few Union boys with the AIC now clearly confused on what their future direction should be.

Hey PH

I'm just a bit lost as to why you seem to think that the AIC rugby programs are likely to be significantly affected by the introduction of AFL and RL.

Are you suggesting that the pre-season trials or preparation will be disrupted by boys with AFL commitments? I certainly can't see that happening with anyone trialling for the First XV, and in the lower grades/age groups will it really matter if some boys are having fun trying a different sport on a Friday night?

In fact, with cricket and volleyball also being played in Term 1, I think they might even find it difficult to fill the AFL teams, at least initially.

The AFL games in the AIC competition will definitely be well below the standard and intensity of club games, so it's far more likely for AFL to be played by boys for enjoyment than prestige, they can play both AFL and rugby for the school and serious rugby players in the Opens almost certainly won't be allowed to play anyway.

As for RL, I find it difficult to believe that boys will be thinking much about playing league until after they finish their rugby season - same as with the Confraternity stuff now. The boys seem to love having a go at both codes, and I certainly haven't noticed any dilution of effort or intensity with the Open rugby boys since the Confraternity option was introduced a couple of years ago.

 

[RugbyReg]

I couldn't say definitively Reg, but yes I think they do. That's why schools invest in their programmes because they know they are going to attract good athletes into those respective sports.

If Brisbane Grammar played League instead of Union and there was no rowing, I know plenty of dads who wouldn't be sending Billy there.

well those dads are idiots

 

[RugbyReg]

Well I am interested Reg ...on what basis do you consider schooling ?

Honest question

the ability to prepare my children for life after school. A school that matches my own values and will help produce aware, grounded, resilient children.

But this is all off topic now.

 

[I play wing]

Could somebody copy and paste the Courier-Mail article into this feed. It seems it cant be read without a subscription to Rupert & sons

 

[Torpedo Punt]

Its in print in todays hardcopy, dont think its legit to cut and paste from a paid service?
AIC Soccer has huge numbers ( bigger than rugby ) but hasnt displaced rugby as the "marquis" game on a Saturday.
This move will flow into GPS for certain at some stage so why put it off. Rugby seems to have a special place in these schools that wont be gazumped by other codes no matter how much money is attached ( if any, Ive not a clue ).

 

[Garry Owens]

the ability to prepare my children for life after school. A school that matches my own values and will help produce aware, grounded, resilient children.

But this is all off topic now.

But doesn’t Sport play a significant part in achieving these core aims for a large percentage of kids ?

 

[RugbyReg]

But doesn’t Sport play a significant part in achieving these core aims for a large percentage of kids ?

yep. But to not go to a school because of a sport they play seems remarkable.

As is choosing a school because of the quality of their rugby team.

 

[Prince Henry]

Galloper,
I just see this as possibly the beginning of the end. Maybe I am jumping at shadows but there is a good rationale to enhance the rugby season not complement it with RL!

I do see your point on Confraternity but that is one week in the holidays, not 7 weeks in the term. Why trial for 2 years if there aren't bigger visions for RL in place?

Perhaps this move does not necessarily negatively impact the current AIC rugby programme (which is limited by time particularly at levels below First and Second XV) but I think it is a missed opportunity to extend the rugby into a unique home & away school competition across Term 2 and 3. A chance at redemption in term 3 for teams who lost in term 2 and a chance for boys who were injured in term 2 to represent in term 3 (many boys in this bucket in MCA in the last few years). I don't think the fields are used for anything else and what's the alternative in Term 3? Going and playing club against teams that from age 14/15 don't have their GPS boys because they are focused on their own school comp.

A longer season is better for skill development and the quality of rugby (which starts to peak in week 6 and 7) is given a chance to mature across a longer timeframe.

And yes, perhaps there won't be a spike in numbers to or from AIC schools. Not in this initial trial period but longer term...?

Just think if we are to be slightly competitive with NZ rugby, we need longer seasons than 7 weeks plus the odd trial match.

 

[Torpedo Punt]

yep. But to not go to a school because of a sport they play seems remarkable.

As is choosing a school because of the quality of their rugby team.

Agreed RR I like rugby but most of all I like the schools culture and of that I like the "broad church" philosophy of the school.

 

[Garry Owens]

I think where the AIC have screwed the pooch is in the order of their offering

Would have been much better to position Rugby last in Term 3 ( out of the Football Codes ) and leave Track and Field in Term 4

Not having a Sport in Term 4 is pretty lame

AFL in Term 1 to develop skill , spatial awareness and cardio fitness is perfect

League in Term 2 with Strength /Power/Speed work in the Gym and then contact in games is perfect

Then 4 x trials toward the end of Term 2 and over June / July School Holidays and first week of Term 3 before your 7 x Round Competition in Term 3

Aligns Schools Rugby in QLD - but from an AIC perspective AFL and League are used not only as sporting opportunities in their own right but complementary to Rugby Prep

If Rugby was in Term 3 you really wouldn't need to worry so much about conditioning etc leading into season as this already would have been done in an integrated sense with AFL and League - the trialling season for Rugby and say Camp over June/July holidays would pretty much be Rugby specific skill based work

 

[Garry Owens]

I don't necessarily agree that "more" is the answer

When you take into account a preseason / trial season , on average , of 3 games and then School based competition of 8 games then a range of 10 to 12 games is , in my view , sufficient to develop in games

Behind all of this there is a shit ton of work that is done behind the scenes from ( say ) U14/15 upwards when additional Club games drop off for many , and , they are age appropriate to properly commence strength training , and later , a lot more skill development work that the best and more complete Coaching offering at the top end of School programs affords.

There does hit a point of redundancy ( in a specific time window ) that no matter how much more than you are playing the rate of your skill development isn't going to keep increasing exponentially

The NZ example is interesting

Over the last 5 years I have seen / observed U14 and under teams from :

• St Kentigens
• Christchruch Boys High
• Manawatu Representative

All get beaten by Australian School or Club Teams

But somewhere between U15 to U18 we assist their development by our inherent intimidation of them - just because they are New Zealanders , and , quite frankly , they are streets ahead of us in their Coaching delivery in this critical arc of 15 to 20 years of age

That's pretty much it - not because they are playing shitloads more than us

In fact , you might argue the reason that they do is because it is worth money . Fun fact ...............there are more viewing numbers in NZ First XV Schoolboy Rugby than there is in the ITM Cup . More content suits the business case.

 

[mbthommo]

I think where the AIC have screwed the pooch is in the order of their offering

Would have been much better to position Rugby last in Term 3 ( out of the Football Codes ) and leave Track and Field in Term 4

Not having a Sport in Term 4 is pretty lame

That is not the AIC's doing. I believe all schools, GPS included, will be in the same boat. With the QLD school system moving away from the OP score to the new system (name escapes me at the moment), there will essentially be no year 12 students at school during term 4 outside of exam blocks. So the entire school/sport calendar needs to be rearranged.

Not sure adding sports to the mix was the best idea but don't expect to see anything in Term 4 in future years.

 

[Garry Owens]

OK good to know . Thanks

It sort of suggest then that maybe too much can be offered which ultimately spreads things too thin

I note GPS Schooling ditched AFL in their curriculums 3 years ago

 

[Torpedo Punt]

OK good to know . Thanks

It sort of suggest then that maybe too much can be offered which ultimately spreads things too thin

I note GPS Schooling ditched AFL in their curriculums 3 years ago

Noting that AFL and RL are on a 2 year trial so..... as is the no term 4 track n field....its not a done deal.
Its called ATAR and it will involve very intense external exams in term 4 counting for at least 50% of your mark for that subject.

 

[Ali Barber]

I think where the AIC have screwed the pooch is in the order of their offering

Would have been much better to position Rugby last in Term 3 ( out of the Football Codes ) and leave Track and Field in Term 4

Not having a Sport in Term 4 is pretty lame

AFL in Term 1 to develop skill , spatial awareness and cardio fitness is perfect

League in Term 2 with Strength /Power/Speed work in the Gym and then contact in games is perfect

Then 4 x trials toward the end of Term 2 and over June / July School Holidays and first week of Term 3 before your 7 x Round Competition in Term 3

Aligns Schools Rugby in QLD - but from an AIC perspective AFL and League are used not only as sporting opportunities in their own right but complementary to Rugby Prep

If Rugby was in Term 3 you really wouldn't need to worry so much about conditioning etc leading into season as this already would have been done in an integrated sense with AFL and League - the trialling season for Rugby and say Camp over June/July holidays would pretty much be Rugby specific skill based work

That's a very good piece there GO. One thing is for sure, when you f... with Tradition, you had better thought it through good and hard, because once it's gone, it's very hard to go back to the way it was. Having RL in term 2 would be better as you suggest and have rugby term 3, all stronger, all match fit and the rugby would be a better quality for sure. As you say it gives better time to view trials and players in positions and codes. Make no mistake, this won't just stop with the AIC schools. Have they thought when the games will be played, mid week for league, that would be a good option. The Qld Schools Comp plays mid week and they go pretty well.

 

[Torpedo Punt]

That's a very good piece there GO. One thing is for sure, when you f. with Tradition, you had better thought it through good and hard, because once it's gone, it's very hard to go back to the way it was. Having RL in term 2 would be better as you suggest and have rugby term 3, all stronger, all match fit and the rugby would be a better quality for sure. As you say it gives better time to view trials and players in positions and codes. Make no mistake, this won't just stop with the AIC schools. Have they thought when the games will be played, mid week for league, that would be a good option. The Qld Schools Comp plays mid week and they go pretty well.

RL will be on sat AFL on Fri nights, It was GPS that F'd with tradition when they moved to term 3 so you could say tradition holding at AIC.

 

[Torpedo Punt]

Also there is more "excitement" around in term 2 as our glorious Reds are inspiring us in Super Rugby at that time of year ! wait...

 

[Garry Owens]

Well Origin is Term 2 as well . Just sayin