Ireland NZ Tour 2022

[Bullrush]

The AB defence isn't very good.

What's the old saying - you need to get to 20 points to beat the ABs.

Since the start of last year the ABs have conceded 20 points in 8 different tests. In the last 4 tests they've conceded 40 points, 29 points, 19 points and 23 points.

The AB defence doesn't pressure the opposition - which is why the opposition can rack up phase after phase. Combine that with the poor kicking quality of the ABs right now it means they lose the territory battle so are stuck in their own half.

The scramble defence and goal line defence is very good. The issue is they are being asked to scramble and goal line D far too much.

So somehow, despite Ireland being the top try scoring team in the 6N with 'great variation or deception' on attack and NZ being so poor at defence, the Irish could only muster 1 try in the 65-odd minutes of rugby after the ABs first yellow card?

If that's what you call 'not very good' defence then I'd hate to see shit defence.

Ireland had 64% territory and 47% possession in the game and were pretty equal in both stats on Saturday in the second half and yet they could only score 1 try while the ABs had a red card against them.

We seem to have this idea that no other international team will ever be able to come close to the ABs and that we can forever be 20 points better than the next team. Not only is that ridiculous, it's boring...

 

[KiwiM]

So somehow, despite Ireland being the top try scoring team in the 6N with 'great variation or deception' on attack and NZ being so poor at defence, the Irish could only muster 1 try in the 65-odd minutes of rugby after the ABs first yellow card?

If that's what you call 'not very good' defence then I'd hate to see shit defence.

Ireland had 64% territory and 47% possession in the game and were pretty equal in both stats on Saturday in the second half and yet they could only score 1 try while the ABs had a red card against them.

We seem to have this idea that no other international team will ever be able to come close to the ABs and that we can forever be 20 points better than the next team. Not only is that ridiculous, it's boring...

As I said the AB defence is very good at scrambling. They did an admirable job when down to 14/13 men.

However, there's a difference between 'very good' and 'shit'. I didn't say they were shit I said they weren't a very good defence.

When you look at the pattern of previous tests there's issues there.

Bear in mind they've had the same defence coach since halfway through 2017 - Scott McLeod - I see the same passive defence that i've seen for a number of years.

It's interesting that Joe Schmidt helped out the defence before test 1 and then in test 1 we saw the ABs use a lot more counter rucking (also like the Blues did this year also with Schmidt) compared to test 2.

The AB defence doesn't employ a rush defence enough and it doesn't attack the breakdown enough. It waits for mistakes but when coming up against well drilled sides that don't make mistakes it gets exposed. In other words it doesn't force errors - it waits for errors.

Here's a couple of videos analysing the ABs defence on the weekend (ABs conceded their tries 15 on 15 and 14 on 14).

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1546593343882334208

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1546240815143460865

 

[Bullrush]

Here's a couple of videos analysing the ABs defence on the weekend (ABs conceded their tries 15 on 15 and 14 on 14).

And how many did they score when they were up a man or 2 two over the ABs?

I didn't say you called the defence shit...I said that if holding the best attacking team in 6N to 2 tries while being short a man for large parts of the game is what you'd define as 'not very good', I'd hate to see what shit defence looks like.

 

[KiwiM]

And how many did they score when they were up a man or 2 two over the ABs?

I didn't say you called the defence shit...I said that if holding the best attacking team in 6N to 2 tries while being short a man for large parts of the game is what you'd define as 'not very good', I'd hate to see what shit defence looks like.

And my point is good scramble defence whilst down a man in one test doesn't mean the AB defence is very good.

The ABs have lost 3 of their last 4 tests, have lost 4 of their last 8 and part of the issue is the defence. It's not the only issue.

In their last 5 big tests* dating back to Springbok game 2 last year (4 of which they have lost), they've conceded 28 points on average.

*I'm not counting USA, Italy, and Wales as a big test as it was a B team Welsh with no access to their English based player (outside international window).

 

[Kevin77]

Decent first half. Ireland much better for the run out two weeks ago.
Look more like a team.
Impressive performances from Prendergast, Coombes, Casey and Larmour.

 

[Bullrush]

As I said the AB defence is very good at scrambling. They did an admirable job when down to 14/13 men.

However, there's a difference between 'very good' and 'shit'. I didn't say they were shit I said they weren't a very good defence.

When you look at the pattern of previous tests there's issues there.

Bear in mind they've had the same defence coach since halfway through 2017 - Scott McLeod - I see the same passive defence that i've seen for a number of years.

It's interesting that Joe Schmidt helped out the defence before test 1 and then in test 1 we saw the ABs use a lot more counter rucking (also like the Blues did this year also with Schmidt) compared to test 2.

The AB defence doesn't employ a rush defence enough and it doesn't attack the breakdown enough. It waits for mistakes but when coming up against well drilled sides that don't make mistakes it gets exposed. In other words it doesn't force errors - it waits for errors.

Here's a couple of videos analysing the ABs defence on the weekend (ABs conceded their tries 15 on 15 and 14 on 14).

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1546593343882334208

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1546240815143460865

These videos show bad reads and poor one-on-one tackles more than anything.

I'm not saying that the AB defence is working at its best but to say the ABs defended poorly is just rubbish. The very fact that Ireland has struggled to score tries against it is proof of that.

A good scramble defence is still defence and implying that the ABs have spent 80mins simply playing scramble defence is silly.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

That opening Maori try scoring move was faptastic

LOL@Party Boy Josh. So much talent but what a shambles of a player. Those penalty shots just about fucked off out of the Caketin at 45 degrees. And with Flapanara and his loopy slo-mo pass inside him the whole venture was doomed from the get go.

Still wish AB's would give IWL a look. Too short for lock? I dunno, he's mean with good hands and most importantly instinctive and decisive.

 

[KiwiM]

Still wish AB's would give IWL a look. Too short for lock? I dunno, he's mean with good hands and most importantly instinctive and decisive.

I thought the same thing. He'd be a much better option than Tuipulotu.

 

[Dan54]

Well was a good game from Irish midweeker, a good step up from last one. They would be pleased having deepened the pool of players just below test team. For Maori, thought Josh Ioane was pretty average, and Nankivell and especially Sullivan would of been pretty disappointed in their games. As McMillan said perhap MABs could of done better by staying together over last few weeks, but perhaps the idea of giving all of squad a run doesn't always help, though I rather they stick with that as it what Maori team is about I think.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Ta'avao got three weeks.

All Blacks star suspended for three weeks

Angus Ta'avao's red card has been upheld by World Rugby.

www.nzherald.co.nz

Also some chat wrt Ireland not getting the PT on Saturday but MAB getting one in similar circumstances last night. It's almost like some people expect consistency from one game to another, FFS.

Māori All Blacks awarded penalty try against Ireland in similar incident to All Blacks test

Watch: It wasn't a penalty try on Saturday but three nights later an incredibly similar incident has resulted in an automatic seven points.

i.stuff.co.nz

 

[Dan54]

I hope everyone noticed we had a Southern Rugby club (Hawera) on field last night!! Playing for the Irish, Micheal Bent has returned hom here a year or so ago, plays down here at Southern, and as he a former Irish test player, got called into squad and got on field last night!

 

[Marce]

 

[Bullrush]

This is a great episode. For those of us - including myself - who have questioned the wisdom of S Barret at 6, Sam Cane at 7 etc...it's good to hear voices of guys who have far better knowledge...

 

[Kevin77]

Another cracking outing last night.
The mood in Ireland has changed significantly in only 4-5 days.

Two wins in four day have now brought the tour to life.

When Ireland got hammered by the Maori in the first match (along with the injury toll) some were questioning the widsom of committing to five matches in three weeks, only bringing 40 players and thinking this was going to be a long tour.

That sentiment only heightened after the first test defeat.

Many fans were suggesting that Farrell was being conservative selecting effectively the same XV for the second test, that the second XV were not really good enough and that the tour was possibly a wasted opportunity to look at alternatives to the big names (Sexton in particular).

However the test win backed up by another win last night and the promising performances of some of the young guns have really made this tour a relative success so far for Ireland.

The first XV have shown they can come to one of the toughest places in the world and win, they've finally got the NZ away hoodoo off their back and the coach has been vindicated.

Equally as important and possibly even more exciting is that the following questions have been answered (to varying degrees);

1. What happens if Sexton gets injured - after test one/game one it didn't look good but Frawley has now seriously entered the conversation alongside Carbery.
2. Where are the back up props? Tom O'Toole has been extremely solid in both Maori games. Loughman was excellent last night. Both look at home at this level and may be ready to make the step up when required.
3. Which young players can push on up to the World Cup? Gavin Coombes - fantastic. If Doris or Conan weren't available he's a brilliant alternative. Tom O'Toole - as mentioned. Cian Prendergast - still rough but has everything needed. Ditto Joe McCarthy. Craig Casey was superb at 9 and Ciaran Frawley looked a genuine option at 10. Mike Lowry was a touch shaky at full back but definitely has the ability.

Ireland have now had a pass mark.

Can they turn a good tour into a great tour? I can't wait to find out.

 

[Kevin77]

I hope everyone noticed we had a Southern Rugby club (Hawera) on field last night!! Playing for the Irish, Micheal Bent has returned hom here a year or so ago, plays down here at Southern, and as he a former Irish test player, got called into squad and got on field last night!

The Taranaki farmer who answered Ireland's SOS call
https://the42.ie/5816565

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

 

[Bullrush]

It seems like Scott Barrett is now our best 6.

 

[Dctarget]

Damn they watched last week’s loss and thought Samisoni was the problem? Rough.

also crazy Rieko has 50 caps, swear he just debuted the other day.

 

[Dan54]

It seems like Scott Barrett is now our best 6.

or perhaps our best FIT 6? Would I guess be a little wary of starting Akira after so long off anyway?
Boy RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) is one out of box and genuinely wonder is Goodhue still not quite right?

 

[KiwiM]

Damn they watched last week’s loss and thought Samisoni was the problem? Rough.

Exactly why there's so much frustration.