Australian Schoolboys & National Championships 2013

[Hugh Jarse]

Well said HJ. The thing about selection is that as boys go higher there are more quality players vying for possibly the one spot, and depending on what the selectors or coaches are specifically looking for in a player will see many excellent rugby players miss out in that instance, and to be fair that is absolutely ok.

If a coach wants a certain type of player then he should have him. In terms of oz schools payers not going all the way, doesn't mean the selectors are wrong or biased, it just means that at that point in time, they were the best available to them.

Good players stop playing after school, weaker payers grow and develop and keep playing, it doesn't mean selection is wrong.


If you have heard Eric Rush the former all black speak he tells a great story about when he was growing up he always trialled but never got picked. His father would always say " don't worry because its just one blokes opinion, maybe the next guy will think differently".

When he excitedly phoned his father to tell him he had been selected for the all blacks, his father congratulated him, but reminded him its just one blokes opinion, don't get a big head, because the next bloke may not like you. That's my spin on selection, if you play well, sooner or later some one is going to see your skills suiting his game plan and you're in, doesn't mean everyone else was wrong.

Probably worthy to post this contribution here.

 

[angrydog]

I am sure all the boys selected will acquit themselves admirably and represent their countries the way they should. However, I have to say that this tournament and some of the questionable selections (small numbers, but still questionable all the same) are becoming rather frustrating year after year. Certain schools and persons associated with them seem to have far too much influence on selection of the Aussie sides every year. Personally, I think these sides should be selected by selectors NOT currently directly associated with any school, i.e persons involved in the game and with a proven knowledge of the game who may be coaches etc and whom are currently involved in a higher level then schools level. They should be independent if possible. I know some will say this is a negative comment but I am sorry this level of rugby is beginning to really turn people off the game through political selections, favouritism, 'scholarships' and all the other BS that is going on in schools rugby.

 

[Ted S]

The only political thing I saw in this was the number of QLD kids selected, but even though they only played for 3rd and 4th some of the games were pretty close, esp the NSW Is and QLD IIs so maybe there really is not a problem here.

Seems to me people are upset because their little Johnny or someone from their school of choice missed out.
Me, I personally know (but not related to) boys that were selected and boys that were not selected.I saw boys I thought were unlucky to be selected and boys that I consider very lucky to be picked.


The selection processes up to these championships prevent someone from having a say about a player from their school. This may continue to the selection of the Australian sides, I do not know.

But people seem to cry "political" and unfair just because their "favourite" was not selected. Well maybe they were not better than those selected.

 

[Roar]

I am sure all the boys selected will acquit themselves admirably and represent their countries the way they should. However, I have to say that this tournament and some of the questionable selections (small numbers, but still questionable all the same) are becoming rather frustrating year after year. Certain schools and persons associated with them seem to have far too much influence on selection of the Aussie sides every year. Personally, I think these sides should be selected by selectors NOT currently directly associated with any school, i.e persons involved in the game and with a proven knowledge of the game who may be coaches etc and whom are currently involved in a higher level then schools level. They should be independent if possible. I know some will say this is a negative comment but I am sorry this level of rugby is beginning to really turn people off the game through political selections, favouritism, 'scholarships' and all the other BS that is going on in schools rugby.

100% Agree with you Angrydog ! A lot of people were not happy today. Its not a case of Sour Grapes, but honestly there were some Lads very lucky to have been picked for either side today, who should not have been selected as they were not up to this level but got there by Favouritism and Political Selections. The Selectors have to live with their decisions now but with some of the comments I heard, lads who should have been picked but didn't won't be Crawling back either if suddenly wanted. Its the same Political Crap, year after year. Soon as League Trials commence in September, that's where these boys will be going. They want a future. Just ask Harry Rourke who played for NSW and Australia Schoolboys last year, he has gone to the Dark Side and what I hear, is happy and earning a good wage there. No wonder Rugby is falling apart and it Disgraced itself today. You will also get fewer lads travelling and competing from different states from now on unless something is done to correct this.

 

[lily]

Didn't see 1 minute of these trials. That said how does a winger who is 17 and playing NRL 20's not get picked in either of these teams. It's amazing how many of these players make a name for themselves outside of school considering the lack of faith shown by the selection panel. It's no wonder that league is the stronger code.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

100% Agree with you Angrydog ! A lot of people were not happy today. Its not a case of Sour Grapes, but honestly there were some Lads very lucky to have been picked for either side today, who should not have been selected as they were not up to this level but got there by Favouritism and Political Selections. The Selectors have to live with their decisions now but with some of the comments I heard, lads who should have been picked but didn't won't be Crawling back either if suddenly wanted. Its the same Political Crap, year after year. Soon as League Trials commence in September, that's where these boys will be going. They want a future. Just ask Harry Rourke who played for NSW and Australia Schoolboys last year, he has gone to the Dark Side and what I hear, is happy and earning a good wage there. No wonder Rugby is falling apart and it Disgraced itself today. You will also get fewer lads travelling and competing from different states from now on unless something is done to correct this.

Please post up your Politics Free Aust Schoolboys 23 player Squad.

 

[Roar]

Didn't see 1 minute of these trials. That said how does a winger who is 17 and playing NRL 20's not get picked in either of these teams. It's amazing how many of these players make a name for themselves outside of school considering the lack of faith shown by the selection panel. It's no wonder that league is the stronger code.

Agree with you as well Lily, that player has now raced to catch a plane to Cairns tonight for 8 days to compete in the Australian Schoolboys in Rugby League and from what I hear, has a strong chance to be picked and earn some $$$ for his efforts and was told is training with 1st grade next year for his NRL Club. A lot of Lads missed out as well and they should have been somewhere there in the Mix. Good luck to Teams.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Not sure I should be encouraging this but people have to start putting up or shutting up.
Its impossible to discriminate between those of you who are complaining who have objective impressions of a week of rugby and those with family connections or impressions formed over months (or more) of rugby.
League and union are vastly different games as was revealed in spades in the NSW Is v IIs game today: its not about trying to beat your opponent 1 on 1 in union.
Also, despite the fact that I am sure that there are many who read this thread who have watched a truckload of rugby over the years, there is a massive difference between picking a 23 man team, largely from scratch, and watching (even intently) a game when you do not have to do that at the end.
Think about the fact that you, no doubt, watched these games with names you'd seen on here or good or bad reviews you'd heard from others in mind.
And while you were watching the names you'd heard or the kid who had the ball the selectors were watching the players that had been assigned to them for that match and checking their checklists.
You were enjoying a game waiting to be excited or to have your mates assessment vindicated or a posters views shot dow and the selectors were watching a finite number of specific players to see what they did to make things happen - things you may or may not have seen.
Chalk and cheese I would have thought.
Did any of you criticising the selections watch every game?
Did you watch games in which the positions you are now complaining about were one of only 3 positions you watched for the whole game? Did you watch those positions in every other game?

 

[angrydog]

P.S my last post is not meant to lend support to any particular school not having a boy selected, it is solely directed at schools who seem to have boys selected year in, year out regardless, and coincidentally those schools have people somewhere connected with the selection/coaching aspect of the Aussie schools sides.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Agree with you as well Lily, that player has now raced to catch a plane to Cairns tonight for 8 days to compete in the Australian Schoolboys in Rugby League and from what I hear, has a strong chance to be picked and earn some $$$ for his efforts and was told is training with 1st grade next year for his NRL Club. A lot of Lads missed out as well and they should have been somewhere there in the Mix. Good luck to Teams.

and, if picked, what would he have been doing?
"his NRL club" sounds like he's signed already.
NRL signed kids were picked in the sides so that cannot explain his non-selection.
What the political theory explaining his non-selection?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

P.S my last post is not meant to lend support to any particular school not having a boy selected, it is solely directed at schools who seem to have boys selected year in, year out regardless, and coincidentally those schools have people somewhere connected with the selection/coaching aspect of the Aussie schools sides.

which school?

 

[bsparx]

Where do you find the selected team??

 

[angrydog]

which school?

I'm not going to name schools or kids or anything like that, it's not worth the slanging match that will follow. Anyone who has been involved in schools rugby over the past 20 years, and specifically the past 10 will no doubt no which schools I am referring to without any assistance from me. I will say this, most of the NSW selections generally are pretty spot on and this year is no exception. Often though, a small number of the QLD and ACT selections raise eye brows....

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Where do you find the selected team??

http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/co...ional-championships.12279/page-16#post-509528

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I'm not going to name schools or kids or anything like that, it's not worth the slanging match that will follow. Anyone who has been involved in schools rugby over the past 20 years, and specifically the past 10 will no doubt no which schools I am referring to without any assistance from me. I will say this, most of the NSW selections generally are pretty spot on and this year is no exception. Often though, a small number of the QLD and ACT selections raise eye brows..

Well in that case there's nothing that can be rationally discussed.
Try 40 years, by the way.

 

[Roar]

and, if picked, what would he have been doing?
"his NRL club" sounds like he's signed already.
NRL signed kids were picked in the sides so that cannot explain his non-selection.
What the political theory explaining his non-selection?

Who knows Inside Shoulder, maybe they didn't like his mouthguard ! I witnessed today some parents in long discussions with a particular selector, its not right, Its a shame but Union have lost this lad and by the sounds of it others as well.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Who knows Inside Shoulder, maybe they didn't like his mouthguard ! I witnessed today some parents in long discussions with a particular selector, its not right, Its a shame but Union have lost this lad and by the sounds of it others as well.

Thats my point: if he already has an NRL club and he had a ticket to Cairns he'd already gone.
Maybe he'll be the one who makes it in league and would have made it union. The fact that he's so highly regarded in the other code is of little or no persuasive value because of the massive differences in the way the games are played.
Do not like the sound of parents talking to selectors AT ALL!!!!!

 

[angrydog]

Well in that case there's nothing that can be rationally discussed.
Try 40 years, by the way.

Your memory is longer than mine IS. The fact you liked my initial post is enough acknowledgement for me that a problem exists and had done for some time. The ARU and ASRU needs to be very careful that it does not drive supporters of the game (players and parents) away with the politics and other BS that currently exists. Those who are most disenchanted seem to me to be those from the second tier of schools just outside the top 'rugby schools'. Realistically, the mungo despite it's flaws does hold some appeal and in some of these schools which are largely day schools many of the boys play league as well as union and if they believe they are being better looked after in league, or at least treated more fairly it is likely that this is where they will gravitate towards. Even worse AFL could become more attractive, that would be a disaster for all of us.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Your memory is longer than mine IS. The fact you liked my initial post is enough acknowledgement for me that a problem exists and had done for some time. The ARU and ASRU needs to be very careful that it does not drive supporters of the game (players and parents) away with the politics and other BS that currently exists. Those who are most disenchanted seem to me to be those from the second tier of schools just outside the top 'rugby schools'. Realistically, the mungo despite it's flaws does hold some appeal and in some of these schools which are largely day schools many of the boys play league as well as union and if they believe they are being better looked after in league, or at least treated more fairly it is likely that this is where they will gravitate towards. Even worse AFL could become more attractive, that would be a disaster for all of us.

I'm torn between knowing in my bones that some kids have an easier path and recognising that selecting on a tournament for a once in a lifetime thing is a bloody hard thing to do.
But i am also hamstrung by the fact that I can see absolutely no attraction in playing league: frankly, if a 17 year old is looking to play either code for money then he's going to be disappointed and, more importantly, not getting picked in one of these teams statistically improves his chances of playing s15 and test rugby.
Thats the message I'm hammering at this time of year.

 

[sootyanddave]

Agree with you as well Lily, that player has now raced to catch a plane to Cairns tonight for 8 days to compete in the Australian Schoolboys in Rugby League and from what I hear, has a strong chance to be picked and earn some $$$ for his efforts and was told is training with 1st grade next year for his NRL Club. A lot of Lads missed out as well and they should have been somewhere there in the Mix. Good luck to Teams.

If he has a contract to play Rugby League for this year and has a bonus written in his contract,if he makes Mungo Schoolboys,and he has a contract for next year,WTF is he doing at a Rugby selection trial this year?