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Wallabies v Argentina Sat 2 October CBus Stadium

dru

Nick Farr-Jones (63)
I haven't read 25 pages pointing out we played against a fairly ordinary team with no discipline and the game went to shit after 60 minutes.

BUT...

... are we at the point yet where we need to ask serious questions about Petaia's physical state? Man he's got talent. His decision making last night was good, too. But he seems to get broken an awful lot.

A definite consideration. For a starting role, Petaia needs to offer Rennie the option of being consistently able to play out 80min. In the post game press Rennie said they'd be looking into it. Also said that he is in great shape. Something going on medically you would think. Diet maybe?

If it can't be addressed Petaia isn't going to get the same sort of opportunities he would otherwise.
 

Adam84

Mark Loane (55)
Cramping at 64 minutes isn't great. Any doctors or physios here who can give insight as to why he couldn't run out a full 80?

not a doctor, but cramping can be any number of things; diet, conditioning and environment factor been the key ones.

it could have been his training in the lead up, or a deficiency in his diet in the day prior. Hard to say but it’s not an overly big issue to resolve.
 

Derpus

John Eales (66)
not a doctor, but cramping can be any number of things; diet, conditioning and environment factor been the key ones.

it could have been his training in the lead up, or a deficiency in his diet in the day prior. Hard to say but it’s not an overly big issue to resolve.
Eat more bananas.
 

mst

Ken Catchpole (46)
A definite consideration. For a starting role, Petaia needs to offer Rennie the option of being consistently able to play out 80min. In the post game press Rennie said they'd be looking into it. Also said that he is in great shape. Something going on medically you would think. Diet maybe?

If it can't be addressed Petaia isn't going to get the same sort of opportunities he would otherwise.
My issue with the whole Petaia thing is he has been given more "chances to prove himself" than most other players ever get. It always ends with injury, errors or another fan generated story about what "he could be..." .

The hyperbole and fanboi-ism needs to end. He has never delivered, is fragile and a risk due to his injury / error issues. He had every opportunity last night and again did not deliver and again got injured. I wouldn't mind if it was an injury in contact etc. but most of the time if just his body failing. If it was a medical thing why does it only happen in games, not anytime at training?

He need to do a Kellaway and go prove himself by playing a few consistent seasons away then let see in about 2 years time.

One theory that has been put to me is that there may be more to this as people as suggesting. We have a young player spending most of his time coming back from injuries, then once fit struggling with more soft tissue injuries. It hard to fathom but its very similar to what the Essendon Bombers players went through when the club was experimenting with "things" to improve performance. They had a really high amount of soft tissue injuries that could not be explained. Much of what was allegedly used cannot be detected easily as per the Bombers testing and the Sky cycling team allegations.
 
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Derpus

John Eales (66)
One theory that has been put to me is that there may be more to this as people as suggesting. We have a young player spending most of his time coming back from injuries, then once fit struggling with more soft tissue injuries. It hard to fathom but its very similar to what the Essendon Bombers players went through when the club was experimenting with "things" to improve performance. They had a really high amount of soft tissue injuries that could not be explained. Much of what was allegedly used cannot be detected easily as per the Bombers testing and the Sky cycling team allegations.
Okay - chances are I'm misreading this but ... are you suggesting Petaia is juicing on something that's exacerbating his injuries? Seems pretty wild to say the least.
 
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dru

Nick Farr-Jones (63)
He (ie Petaia) has never delivered,

Oh piffle. Clearly we see different things.

Last night he got an injury early which was a crack to a shin - he worked through it. The cramping is an issue though and if it was systemic he'd have difficulty providing any serious utility to the squad. You would seem not to trust Rennie when he says that Petaia is fit, after returning from injury. I don't have any other info but will run with Rennie unless there is other advice somewhere.

I've shown the stats earlier on this thread (post #467) so they are not hard to find. From last night to suggest that Kellaway is proven and simultaneously Petaia did not deliver - they are simply contradictory statements when you look at the actual performance metrics for both. Either they both performed or neither. And for the record actually, they both performed very well.
 

formerflanker

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Oh piffle. Clearly we see different things.

Last night he got an injury early which was a crack to a shin - he worked through it. The cramping is an issue though and if it was systemic he'd have difficulty providing any serious utility to the squad. You would seem not to trust Rennie when he says that Petaia is fit, after returning from injury. I don't have any other info but will run with Rennie unless there is other advice somewhere.

I've shown the stats earlier on this thread (post #467) so they are not hard to find. From last night to suggest that Kellaway is proven and simultaneously Petaia did not deliver - they are simply contradictory statements when you look at the actual performance metrics for both. Either they both performed or neither. And for the record actually, they both performed very well.
Petaia gave the ball away on 2 occasions - one kick and one pass - and those errors should be easily coached out of him.
Then his silky skills will be the only aspect of his play we see.
 

Derpus

John Eales (66)
Oh piffle. Clearly we see different things.

Last night he got an injury early which was a crack to a shin - he worked through it. The cramping is an issue though and if it was systemic he'd have difficulty providing any serious utility to the squad. You would seem not to trust Rennie when he says that Petaia is fit, after returning from injury. I don't have any other info but will run with Rennie unless there is other advice somewhere.

I've shown the stats earlier on this thread (post #467) so they are not hard to find. From last night to suggest that Kellaway is proven and simultaneously Petaia did not deliver - they are simply contradictory statements when you look at the actual performance metrics for both. Either they both performed or neither. And for the record actually, they both performed very well.
You did leave out a rather important stat from those metrics being tries scored. The single most important stat for any winger.
 

TSR

Geoff Shaw (53)
My issue with the whole Petaia thing is he has been given more "chances to prove himself" than most other players ever get. It always ends with injury, errors or another fan generated story about what "he could be..." .

The hyperbole and fanboi-ism needs to end. He has never delivered, is fragile and a risk due to his injury / error issues. He had every opportunity last night and again did not deliver and again got injured. I wouldn't mind if it was an injury in contact etc. but most of the time if just his body failing. If it was a medical thing why does it only happen in games, not anytime at training?

He need to do a Kellaway and go prove himself by playing a few consistent seasons away then let see in about 2 years time.

One theory that has been put to me is that there may be more to this as people as suggesting. We have a young player spending most of his time coming back from injuries, then once fit struggling with more soft tissue injuries. It hard to fathom but its very similar to what the Essendon Bombers players went through when the club was experimenting with "things" to improve performance. They had a really high amount of soft tissue injuries that could not be explained. Much of what was allegedly used cannot be detected easily as per the Bombers testing and the Sky cycling team allegations.
My issue with the Petaia thing is the re-writing of history and the confusing his injury issues with his actual playing form

From his start in super rugby he was outstanding and delivered consistently, including in his opportunities at the World Cup - right up until the international series last year which was the first time he underperformed (although was still good in defence). The reason he was parachuted into the WC squad and the reason people still rave about him despite his woes if the last 12 months is that he was outstanding originally and absolutely delivered in the field.

I’m happy to accept this may be a case of red tinted glasses or even ‘fab-boism’ if you like but I’d point out that all of Thorn, Cheika & Rennie have gone on record to say what a fantastic talent this guy is. I accept top level coaches don’t always get it right but three different elite coaches are all saying the same thing so I’m going to go out on a limb and say your view isn’t supported by those who know.

Now if you had limited your post to problems with his injury history and questions around his body being able to handle pro rugby then I I’d agree there is a valid reason to be concerned but suggest that the professional support staff should be in a far better position then us to make those assessments.
 

Pfitzy

David Wilson (68)
I'm not talking about the cramping with Petaia (tho for a young bloke that shows something wrong with his prep) but there might be something in the way his S&C is done that keeps him taking knocks to the lower limbs. Could be genetic as well.

Remember Tahs hooker Damien Fitzpatrick? Always fucking up his ACL and nearly retired young. Was in Lyon when he saw a surgeon who took a wedge out of his tibia to straighten up his leg, and it fixed him right up.

 
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mst

Ken Catchpole (46)
Okay - chances are I'm misreading this but ... are you suggesting Petaia is juicing on something that's exacerbating his injuries? Seems pretty wild to say the least.
Wild yes, but as uncomfortable as it is, when it was put to me by my AFL obsessed brother, its plausible as he is on the injury roundabout but it never seem to happen on training paddock; only in games and the medical staff cant seem to get a handle on it (Reds and Wallabies medico's). I didn't see any another player go down like him with cramp over the two games last night.
 

dru

Nick Farr-Jones (63)
You did leave out a rather important stat from those metrics being tries scored. The single most important stat for any winger.

You've got all the stats I have available - ESPN stat guru. I'd love m after contact but it's not available.

Your talking tries? Or something else?
 

Derpus

John Eales (66)
You've got all the stats I have available - ESPN stat guru. I'd love m after contact but it's not available.

Your talking tries? Or something else?
Yeah tries man.

A winger who finds himself in the right place to finish moves is worth far more than one who doesn't regardless of other metrics.
 
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