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RWC 2011 - Quarter final 3 : Springbokke v. Wallabies CLOSED

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potjiekos

Guest
Brisbok said:
Potjiekos - don't fall into the (Australian?) trap of blaming the referee for a loss. We didn't lose because of the ref's decisions. We lost because despite dominating territory and possession for pretty much the whole game, we weren't able to score enough points! With that kind of dominance we should not have allowed refereeing decisions to influence the game. We should have been too far in front on the scoreboard for it to matter.

Smit's decision in the first half to kick for touch rather than take the points when we were attacking in the Wallabies 22? PdV's decision to only give the form hooker in the world (IMO) 30 mins of game time in a RWC QF? Do you think Bismarck would have let James Horwill drive straight through him to score from around 10m out?

Yes, it's a very hard pill to swallow, but I think our boys (incl. management) only have themselves to blame.
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At no stage was I blaming the ref bris. He has his own conscoence to live with. I was merely responding to a previous post that seemed to advocate playing outside of the rules in order to gain an advantage over opponents. (ie 'playing the ref ).
 
Scotty

Scotty

David Codey (61)
cyclopath said:
Forgive me if I find your last sentence somewhat fanciful. None of us have that objective an eye.
This is the nub of the whole "labelling as cheats" issue that goes on. I have not been a fan of the whole McCaw is a cheat routine that is championed by quite a few here, and this is just why. Great players play at the margins - the nature of Rugby and its laws, which by their complexity, are subject to interpretations all the time ensures this.
Pocock, McCaw, Brussow et al are that much better than others because they do this.
The Sprinboks were offside quite a bit yesterday and not pinged for it, as I'm sure were the Wallabies at times. Does that systematic cheating bother you, I mean they know they're offside? Does Burger trying to remove Pocock from a ruck by his head and neck pass muster?
You are understandably pissed off that the Bokke lost - fair enough, I would be too - but pushing this line as you have in multiple posts now will just end up starting a shitfight, which is unnecessary.
I'm not having a go at you specifically, but you've made the point, move on now.
As should everyone.
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There are two sorts of cleanouts that aren't be policed at all, but any referee, and it is starting to really annoy me:

1. Cleanout from in front of the ruck (ie you are past the ruck, but reach back to clean out a defender)
2. Cleaning out by a grapple of the head or neck (which Pocock also did at least once)

Burger's cleanout that I think you are referring to broke both of the above.
 
waratahjesus

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
Scotty said:
There are two sorts of cleanouts that aren't be policed at all, but any referee, and it is starting to really annoy me:

1. Cleanout from in front of the ruck (ie you are past the ruck, but reach back to clean out a defender)
2. Cleaning out by a grapple of the head or neck (which Pocock also did at least once)

Burger's cleanout that I think you are referring to broke both of the above.
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im with you 100% on that scotty, the neck grapple seems to have become completely acceptable.
not just at the breakdown but in the holding up of opposition as well. it needs to be ended soon.
 
Scotty

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Richo said:
McCabe had a cracker. As someone who was sceptical about playing him, I'm happy to see him do so well. Great work to set-up the Horwill try. His tackles were fantastic. However, our defense did not decline at all when Barnes came on -- what we lost in physicality we made up for with organisation. Since Cooper won't be dropped, I'm hoping that McCabe's shoulder gets better. It's almost silly to have a player of Barnes calibre on the bench, but this "soften them up then outsmart them" strategy at 12 worked.
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If we really wanted a soften them up then outsmart them strategy then we should be starting with 10 Barnes, 12 McCabe and then bring Cooper on to replace McCabe.
 
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StonerJack

Guest
Why did I have to plan a holiday to South Africa less than a week after a controversial victory in a world cup quarter final? I fear for my safety and my Wallabies jersey will not be making the trip with me. I've also been practicing my SA accent just in case haha.

The match itself was a farce, we all know that. It's definitely taken some of the excitement out of the cup for me personally but hey we're still in it so hopefully I'll be able to watch Aus defeat NZ in a pub somewhere near Hoedspruit!
 
Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
Awesome thread.
Started on 30/9 and already 1160 posts and >29000 views. (not including the Live Call contributions either).
Meanwhile the usually controversal School Boys thread which has been running from March 14 has amassed 53000 views and only 498 posts.

This debrief after the game has probably got legs enough to keep this thread going until about Team announcement time for the SF.

Wang on Gaggerlanders. This game will be talked about for a long long long time. Even a couple of hostages behind enemy lines in the Land of The Darkness have reported that the locals are wanging on about this game (methinks with a degree of some nervous malevolence). How good is this World Cup?

PRICELESS:
Salary for working in a Multi National Companies office with too many Soap Dodgers, and Saffas and the odd Paddy $120000
Upgraded Foxtel IQ subscription for RWC $ 100 per month
Embarrased Silence at Water cooler at work this morning from previously arrogant Rugby know-it-all Soap Dodgers, Saffas, and Paddys. PRICELESS
 
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Patto.

Allen Oxlade (6)
Hugh Jarse said:
Awesome thread.
PRICELESS:
Salary for working in a Multi National Companies office with too many Soap Dodgers, and Saffas and the odd Paddy $120000
Upgraded Foxtel IQ subscription for RWC $ 100 per month
Embarrased Silence at Water cooler at work this morning from previously arrogant Rugby know-it-all Soap Dodgers, Saffas, and Paddys. PRICELESS
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Makes you think there is a God and thankfully he is not a Pom.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Farcical? I'm not sure that word means what you think it means.

I don't think I've ever seen a better defensive effort in a test match ever.

With no ball we resisted everything the Springboks threw at us. We had very little ball which we didn't use well, but we did score off the one opportunity we had.
 
Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
To be fair to the Saffas and Spud Bashers at work, they weren't too bad in the build up to this weekend, and were congratulatory if somewhat disappointed today.
 
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StonerJack

Guest
waratahjesus said:
really? do you not understand pressure? there was amazing play in that game (and moments of terrible play) but it was a gripping contest.
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A gripping contest marred by blatant and consistent infringing at the breakdown which was ignored by the referee. We obviously have wildly differing views here.

The only thing amazing in that game was the sheer determination and strength of will shown by Pat McCabe.
 
Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
waratahjesus said:
really? do you not understand pressure? there was amazing play in that game (and moments of terrible play) but it was a gripping contest.
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Braveheart81 said:
Farcical? I'm not sure that word means what you think it means.

I don't think I've ever seen a better defensive effort in a test match ever.

With no ball we resisted everything the Springboks threw at us. We had very little ball which we didn't use well, but we did score off the one opportunity we had.
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You blokes have better NEVER whinge about a 0-0 draw in diveball as being uninteresting. You are now on the record. :)
 
M

Mica

Guest
Scotty said:
There are two sorts of cleanouts that aren't be policed at all, but any referee, and it is starting to really annoy me:

1. Cleanout from in front of the ruck (ie you are past the ruck, but reach back to clean out a defender)
2. Cleaning out by a grapple of the head or neck (which Pocock also did at least once)

Burger's cleanout that I think you are referring to broke both of the above.
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Add to that (not in specific relation to Burger's game) the clean out of players not involved in the ruck (i.e. in the defensive line behind the ruck) or prior to getting to the ruck (preventing their involvement).

This happens a lot and is actually called obstruction (note to refs).
 
Mr Doug

Mr Doug

Dick Tooth (41)
Braveheart81 said:
I would be highly surprised if it isn't two out of Barnes, Kaplan, Rolland and Poite.

My likely scenario is Barnes and Rolland. I think Kaplan is a good chance at being given the final after not getting a quarter final and reffing a semi last RWC.
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With four matches to go they might all get a run!
 
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StonerJack

Guest
Braveheart81 said:
Farcical? I'm not sure that word means what you think it means.

I don't think I've ever seen a better defensive effort in a test match ever.

With no ball we resisted everything the Springboks threw at us. We had very little ball which we didn't use well, but we did score off the one opportunity we had.
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Going to question my use of the word farcical? Haha fair enough but I know what I mean ;)

It's not hard to defend a weak attacking side. Also the fact that Aus got away with so much at the breakdown takes the shine off the defensive effort for me.
 
waratahjesus

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
StonerJack said:
A gripping contest marred by blatant and consistent infringing at the breakdown which was ignored by the referee. We obviously have wildly differing views here.

The only thing amazing in that game was the sheer determination and strength of will shown by Pat McCabe.
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was it marred, cos while i agree some went unpunished, ive watched it a couple of times and the least you can say about the ref was he was consistant. which is all you can ask really. it went both ways.

so Pat McCabe playing injured was the only thing, so David Pocock playing an absolutely outstanding game means nothing, Vickers and Horwill hitting everything that moved, our scrum standing up against one that would have been confident they could dominate us. JOC (James O'Connor) taking fearless highballs and running through large forwards. Elsom doing a heap of in tight grunt work he will never get recognition for, etc etc etc

there was a heap of people in gold jerseys yesterday that stood as individuals and an even better group that played like a team whos lives depended on it.

south africa had every chance to win that game, there wernt good enough, and a very large part of that was how they were contained by an australian team that deserves credit.

Farce is not what you would call it.
 
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