Reds 2013

[RedsHappy]

I have not yet relinquished all hope that Link and Jim C will mount a counter attack out of this ruck and hold Higgers.

The fact that just yesterday (as LG noted above) the Rebels CEO said no offer had as yet been made to Higgers means that either Harris has jumped the gun (hardly surprising for him - repeating raw gossip and player managers' ploys as stories allows him to go home early), or Bolland was lying or Higgers' management is game playing for more advantage.

Whatever, is it not now 100% clear that this whole player and coaches movement process being permitted to occur mid-season is simply wrong. It's distracting and destabilising for teams, it pulls coaches off their main task each week, and fans gets totally confused as to the truth and where their teams stand. We need a proper, formally enforced Transfer Period say August - October when and only when S15 contracts can be negotiated and signed for both local coaches (those already in Australia coaching S15 teams) and existing S15 players, period. The fact that this may not fit with NH teams' 'windows': tough titty, we need to look after Australia first and foremost.

 

[TheBigDog]

This just posted on couriermail.com

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport...-for-three-years/story-fn8t7efs-1226358725924

Looks like Higgers is gone on a 3 year deal to the Rebels. I'm more annoyed with Reds management than upset about this. He is our best forward in terms of physicality and skill and would have thought he would have been the #1 priority re-signing especially the way he's been playing this year as he was the only shining light in what was a fairly slow start to the season.

 

[AlexH]

I would prefer to pay the extra money to keep Higgers, even if it meant we could not afford Quade.

 

[TheBigDog]

I know people (including myself) have been copping some criticism for saying Higgers is a bigger loss than Genia and QC (Quade Cooper) but look at the reactions that people have had to the news.

When everyone thought Genia was leaving for the Force the first thing Reds fans came out and said was how great our halfback talents are with the likes of Benny Lucas, Nick Frisby and Matt Lucas ready and willing to take Genia's place. Whereas its been on the cards for a while now that Higgers could be on the move but no one has been suggesting who would be a suitable replacement to step up and take his starting job. IMO thats because he's seen as in a league of his own when it comes to what he brings to a team and playing style.

No doubt Quirk is probably the closest player skill wise and playing style to Higgers but he's still a fair way off the mark.

Congrats to the Rebels though for securing the services of a bloke who will most likely be a Wallaby for many years to come.

 

[tigerland12]

Ahhh shit, but you can't really blame him for leaving. We simply do not have enough money to throw at him. Hopefully this will make it easier to retain Quade, Tapuai and Shipperely.

 

[MrTimms]

I'm more annoyed with Reds management than upset about this.

A little bit rough.

Consider the environment, it is pretty common knowledge that the Rebels have made plays at most, if not all, the Reds stars coming off contract. When each one decides to stay with the reds, usually for less $, the Rebels (and other teams) have more to offer the next.

They are only going to be able to hold on so long before their staff change employers.

the biggest thing to be annoyed with is the faux salary cap. How much is it next year? Answer is no-one knows. If they go to 4.8 to keep higgers (or whoever) and it actually comes in at 4.1... Then what?

 

[en_force_er]

Agreed, nobody is an fault here except the people enforcing the contracting rules.

People can't make decisions blind in big business, nor can people blame other businesses competing within the rules that have been agreed upon.

 

[Ignoto]

Then what?

Cook the books?

 

[Scotty]

I would prefer to pay the extra money to keep Higgers, even if it meant we could not afford Quade.

At lot of people are saying this, but I think a lot are forgetting that without Quade we would not have won the title last year. Without Higgers, we still would have had a shot.

 

[wilful]

Cook the books?

AKA the Melbourne Storm approach.

 

[RugbyReg]

I know people (including myself) have been copping some criticism for saying Higgers is a bigger loss than Genia and QC (Quade Cooper) but look at the reactions that people have had to the news.
.

Look at the reaction when it was announced that Quade was playing this weekend.

 

[AlexH]

At lot of people are saying this, but I think a lot are forgetting that without Quade we would not have won the title last year. Without Higgers, we still would have had a shot.

That may be true but the Reds showed last week against the Chiefs that they are capable of producing their 2011 form without Quade Cooper. We have not lost much with Ben Lucas running the show but we will lose a lot of mongrel in our pack if we lose Higgers.

 

[SuperGrover]

The Rebels isn't even the bad part, keep thinking of the other 10 teams in the comp.

It's like the NRL only applying a salary cap to the Broncos, Manly, Penrith and the Sharks. Sound fair?

Then, they faff about so long that no one even knows how much the salary cap is, with the talks stalled and there is no "agreement" on how much the cap actually is. Try recruiting in that environment.

I agree that ambiguity regarding the level of the cap and the Rebels seeming exclusion from it are problems.

However, the fact that the teams in the South African and New Zealand conferences are not bound by the same cap is not really an issue. As long as Australia keeps its policy of only selecting Wallabies from the playing pool of the Australian conference, then the lack of a cap for the other 10 teams is of little importance.

If players elect to give up their wallaby opportunities and go overseas then neither NZ or SA can, or do, compete with the appeal of Europe (financially or otherwise).

If it were a problem we would be seeing NZ and SA teams with Australian players.

 

[tigerland12]

It's like comparing our best back with our best forward. They are both vital to the Reds success. But in terms on impact on the loss Higginbotham will have on the sides performance will be nowhere near the effect losing Quade would have.

I mean Higgers is my favourite player, and I'm devastated to see him go. But I have the confidence that Shatz and Quirk will continue to develop and be mainstays in our pack. We have to look at signing another 6/8 now to replace him, as I don't see Samo offering anything to the side more then holding the ackle bags at training now (I called that at the start of the season, so nyah nyah told ya's so ). I believe developing Dave McDuling (remember this guy?) as a 6 is a better solution, and bringing a Jarrad Butler, Curtis Browning or Tim Buchanan into the squad aswell (seeing this is Van's last season).

As good as Curtis Browning is, I would love to see Jarrad Buttler given a contract (no Easts bias here), he has been tearing the house down so far this season. Devastating ball runner, good in defence, handy at the line out, high work rate for a big bloke, and more experience then Browning. Buchanan is also an option as a Lock/8 but I think he is behind the other two I've mentioned.

 

[Lee Grant]

Wow - so the rumours were true. I feel sad for the Reds but glad for the Rebels.

One has to congratulate them and for their success in recruiting Wallabies to replace foreigners and this is in stark contrast with the Force recently. I think the tyranny of distance is having an effect on them as is the reversing of rats leaving the sinking ship syndrome.

When they started up many players left the Reds for the Force because they had experienced hard times. Now the Force will have trouble attracting players to them because they are having hard times. The presence of the 5th team as a recruiting rival, especially one closer to the general pool of rugby players available, is doing them no favours either.

People can write that we don't have the pool of players to populate 5 professional rugby teams and stay competitive with NZ and the RSA. But we already knew that when the 5th team was first mentioned a few years ago, but didn't mind because we were increasing the pool of Oz professional players.

Because of their location, not too far from home, and the size of their city, which will hold players, especially those with partners, Melbourne will do better than Perth in getting players to move there.

Something has to be done for the western team and it can't be something like increasing their salary cap because that has the seeds of financial madness in it.

I would change the foreigner entitlements and not allow any for the Reds, Brumbies or Tahs - ever. Let the Rebels settle down to their one marquee and one developing foreigner when their dispensation runs out, and let the Force have three and three for a few years and see how it works out. ARU approval would still be needed so that the Rebels and Force didn't have two foreign hookers and two scrum halves in total, and yarda yarda.

Or something like that; maybe the other teams could all have one developing foreign player but not a marquee player.

But this is the Reds 2013 thread? I have digressed.
.

 

[p.Tah]

So are we certain Higgers has gone to Melbourne? After the Genia fiasco I'm not buying into it until he runs out in their colours next season.

 

[What2040]

It's like comparing our best back with our best forward. They are both vital to the Reds success. But in terms on impact on the loss Higginbotham will have on the sides performance will be nowhere near the effect losing Quade would have.

I mean Higgers is my favourite player, and I'm devastated to see him go. But I have the confidence that Shatz and Quirk will continue to develop and be mainstays in our pack. We have to look at signing another 6/8 now to replace him, as I don't see Samo offering anything to the side more then holding the ackle bags at training now (I called that at the start of the season, so nyah nyah told ya's so ). I believe developing Dave McDuling (remember this guy?) as a 6 is a better solution, and bringing a Jarrad Butler, Curtis Browning or Tim Buchanan into the squad aswell (seeing this is Van's last season).

As good as Curtis Browning is, I would love to see Jarrad Buttler given a contract (no Easts bias here), he has been tearing the house down so far this season. Devastating ball runner, good in defence, handy at the line out, high work rate for a big bloke, and more experience then Browning. Buchanan is also an option as a Lock/8 but I think he is behind the other two I've mentioned.

Tiger,
Jarrod is good, weighs enough but cannot jump for shit because he is just not tall enough - against the Gold Coast he was only average when he should be smokin' them. Needs to shift into hooker for long term success. He is one of those blokes caught - that is he is not fast enough or a fetcher to be a 7, too short to be a S15 number 6 and probably as 8, too small to be a prop (and probably too smart haha). Guy could hit the gym and easily increase body mass to 112-115 kg (he has that body that can easily accept weight). With all his skills IMO he would be an excellant 2. I honestly don't believe he will ever make a S15 side as a loosie, on a regular basis simply because of body shape not because of anything else.

The lad was an awesome schoolboy but the transition to the Super level is difficult particularly when there are so many lads to choose from.

don't agree with signing another 6/8 - -we have Shatz and Quirk, both signed (i think) - lets develop them further

 

[tigerland12]

I agree that Shatz and Quirk should be left to develop, but we do need to sign a back up 6/8 so we have depth in those positions. Also I do sense that Jarrads body height and build will also hinder his chances of playing Super Rugby, but far out he is killing it right now.

But from watching a fair bit of him last year, I really think McDuling would make a great 6, very unfourtunate he is gone for the season

 

[thierry dusautoir]

I would rather beauchamp over butler, who i think is actually quite overated.

 

[Bowside]

Shatz and Quirk will suffice but both of them play their best rugby at 6. The other options McDulling and AWH could both only play 6 as well - as both are pretty much locks. The younger options Browning and McMahon are not yet ready for super rugby.

So we really need a top class 8 with nice hands and good running game, preferably someone who is a bit older but doesn't get injured often. Pretty much a radike samo mk2.

Suggestions welcome!