Wallabies vs England, Sydney, 3rd Test, 25 June @ 8:00pm

[teach]

I haven't really got into this debate. But my thoughts.
#2 playing #3. Wallabies playing shite and England playing the best they have for years, still relatively narrow losses.
Lots (and I mean lots) of room for improvement from Aus, little for England.

Congratulations to England for peaking for the 2015 RWC, in the 2016 rebuilding year.

 

[Gillys_ghost]

Dunno that I'd go that far but he looked pretty solid for a debutante.

I didnt mean he is the next eales, or even that he played even close to eales' level. I just meant that the way he does things is like eales. Just the way he runs into contact. His body movements and mannerisms. Hes got a massive way to go to get eales' level when it comes to his game

 

[fatprop]

Well done England, they simply played better rugby then us.

My thoughts? Our errors lost us last nights game, we scored enough points to win most test matches but simply we made too many errors and this English side doesn't play a lot of rugby but they certainly leveraged our errors in the red zone

 

[Strewthcobber]

Who's the defense coach?

We're scoring enough points to win these games but shipping even more.

 

[tragic]

Well done England, they simply played better rugby then us.

My thoughts? Our errors lost us last nights game, we scored enough points to win most test matches but simply we made too many errors and this English side doesn't play a lot of rugby but they certainly leveraged our errors in the red zone

Once again we scored more tries, had more territory, more possession and more line breaks.
I don't agree they played better rugby
They kicked better - for goal and in general play.
And once again that was the major point of difference
Aside from our errors which I agree didn't help.

 

[KOB1987]

I was thinking the same thing Teach but didn't want to say it!

England are a good team, no disputing that. But whether being #2 team in 2016 translates to being#1 or 2 in 2019 is another matter! They were badly coached and made bad selections leading up to RWC 2015, now they have the team they should have had in 2015 whereas many countries including us are reassembling their line ups.

Anyway, I'm certainly not taking anything away from their wins, but on the other hand I'm not panicking about our side either. Yeah we lack depth and/or a quality first choice in a couple of positions, but it is what it is and I'm actually looking forward to seeing some of the emerging talent come through and the improvement in the team. We always sit somewhere between #2 and #5 in the world, in a golden era we can nudge #1. That's not going to be 2016 but who knows what the next few years will bring.

 

[KOB1987]

Who's the defense coach?

We're scoring enough points to win these games but shipping even more.

Nathan Grey. The best defence coach in the world isn't going to train them how to defend a penalty goal. We've out-tried them in 2/3 tests. It's that elusive kicking coach that we need.

 

[Pfitzy]

Nathan Grey. The best defence coach in the world isn't going to train them how to defend a penalty goal. We've out-tried them in 2/3 tests. It's that elusive kicking coach that we need.

To stop the opposition kicking penalties? For that, you'd need a Stop Doing Stupid Shit At Ruck Time Coach.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Nathan Grey. The best defence coach in the world isn't going to train them how to defend a penalty goal. We've out-tried them in 2/3 tests. It's that elusive kicking coach that we need.

Who's coaching defending opposition rucks and mauls?

 

[KOB1987]

Who's coaching defending opposition rucks and mauls?

I would guess that falls into cheika & ledesma's basket. I think our stats in that area have been pretty good haven't they? If not dominant

 

[TSR]

Interesting comment in the press conference by Cheika that the touch judge pushed Moore in the back as he was throwing the lineout on our line where he missed Coleman and England got held up.

The touch judge was apparently trying to move the England lineout out of the gap. By the sound of it, more a piece of unfortunate timing than anything but that whole phase of play was very costly for Australia. (I might have it wrong, but I think that lineout started with the incident where the ball hit the spider cam wire and England scored off the back of the ensuing scrum.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Well that was an entirely winnable series that got away.

The only times that series looked winnable were:

• throughout RWC 15;
• for 2 months before it started
• for 10 minutes in the first game
• for 10 minutes in the second

 

[KOB1987]

Interesting comment in the press conference by Cheika that the touch judge pushed Moore in the back as he was throwing the lineout on our line where he missed Coleman and England got held up.

The touch judge was apparently trying to move the England lineout out of the gap. By the sound of it, more a piece of unfortunate timing than anything but that whole phase of play was very costly for Australia. (I might have it wrong, but I think that lineout started with the incident where the ball hit the spider cam wire and England scored off the back of the ensuing scrum.

Kinda sums up the series..there have been plenty of 'shit happens' moments. Most, if not all, to our detriment..

 

[Strewthcobber]

I would guess that falls into cheika & ledesma's basket. I think our stats in that area have been pretty good haven't they? If not dominant

We have been excellent at getting caught on the wrong side of opposition rucks and collapsing mauls tight in front of the ref, and particularly good at it in goal kicking range.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Tomua made a huge difference and substantially nullified the effect of the rush defence.
I understand his domestic arrangements mean he is not in the frame between now and RWC 2019 - correct?

 

[KOB1987]

We have been excellent at getting caught on the wrong side of opposition rucks and collapsing mauls tight in front of the ref, and particularly good at it in goal kicking range.

Oh ok, fair point. I just meant our ruck and maul stats generally were pretty dominant.

 

[fatprop]

Once again we scored more tries, had more territory, more possession and more line breaks.
I don't agree they played better rugby
They kicked better - for goal and in general play.
And once again that was the major point of difference
Aside from our errors which I agree didn't help.

Levering your opportunities more effectively is the playing "better rugby" to me

The kicking is a funny one, they have a great goal kicker, we don't, anywhere have a guy near as good

The kicking from hand the two game plans were quite different, they were going to touch, trying to play from set piece to set piece

Whilst it appeared at the ground the Wobs kicking game plan was to kick it to the left and not out; keeping the ball in play.

I thought the turning point in the game was Simmons getting injured, straight after our lineout went to shit for a couple and Skelton got to play longer with Fardy playing longer as well; and at lock

 

[fatprop]

Oh ok, fair point. I just meant our ruck and maul stats generally were pretty dominant.

Neither side really went out to jackal ball both sides were fanning out if there wasn't a dominant tackle

 

[TSR]

Kinda sums up the series..there have been plenty of 'shit happens' moments. Most, if not all, to our detriment..

Yeah, agree - but then as Cheika himself has pointed out, that can't be an excuse. Every team has things go against them. You have to make your own luck.

 

[formerflanker]

Everything to be said has been said.

Although I'll also say that McMahon probably played his best game for the Wallabies, at least if we discount the Uruguay game at the World Cup.

I liked the way McMahon and Hooper teamed up so well. One would make the first tackle, the other would swoop in. Then they would swap roles. Each would be there to take a pass if the other was carting the ball up.