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Aussie Player Exodus

Discussion in 'Rugby Discussion' started by swingpass, Apr 2, 2014.

  1. swingpass Peter Fenwicke (45)

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    so with Hugh Pyle decamping before RWC 2015, and the exodus last year of Timani, Ionae, Mitchell and others to Europe; coupled with the parlous state of the ARU's finances and the very health budgets of, in particular French clubs, are we about to see a wholesale exodus of australian talent overseas.

    quite probably both before as well as after the RWC. i say before, because if you a fringe Wallaby, who doesn't look like making the squad, you might as well jump early to get in whilst you can (Pyle's reasoning perhaps) and not miss out in the post 2015 stampede. does anyone have a rough estimate of how many australian super 15 players are off contract at the end of this year ?

    these are professionals who will not unreasonably go where they can get the best deal.

    this makes the NRC more important than ever
  2. Braveheart81 George Smith (75)

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    I think the main change we are seeing is not so much that more players are going overseas, but that players are doing it mid career with the potential to come back rather than at the end of their career.

    This season we've seen Tala Gray, Matt Carraro, Dane Haylett-Petty and Luke Burgess all return from stints overseas to play Super Rugby.

    I think that it isn't just about money. Australians in general love the opportunity to go and spend some time overseas for the life experience it provides, especially in their mid 20s. Many Australians do it with only the opportunity to earn far less than they earn in Australia because they end up working in an unskilled job.

    As a professional rugby player, Hugh Pyle has the opportunity to earn a lucrative salary and go and live in France for a couple of years enjoying everything that Europe has to offer.
  3. swingpass Peter Fenwicke (45)

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    agree, and i am jealous i wasn't good enough to do it.

    i was thinking more about a "perfect storm" brewing, RWC looming, less money in australia, pay cuts for the players here, more expected from them (Sup XV and NRC), lots of players off contract
    suckerforred likes this.
  4. suckerforred Chilla Wilson (44)

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    It will be interesting to see what happens next year when we get better idea of who is in line for the Wallabies squad.

    I hope we are not going to fall into a process of players going for a couple of years between world cups and coming back in enough time to be eligible to to be picked then buggering off again. Going to make the 'off' years hard to take..
  5. Braveheart81 George Smith (75)

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    I really don't see that happening. I think the desire of players to play for the Wallabies is still great regardless of whether it is RWC time or not.

    I just think we're going to see a more fluid market of players coming and going from Europe and Japan.

    I think there is still enough money in Australia to provide enough incentive for players to play here both just as Super Rugby players and with the goal of playing for the Wallabies.
  6. Slim 293 Tim Horan (67)

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    Peter Kimlin is staying put in France....

    MMM is heading back to Japan, but his body is just not cut out for Super Rugby it seems....

    Fortunately we already have plenty of good players that can play 4/6, so as long as we don't start losing tight head locks or tight head props for that matter we should be OK...
  7. The_Brown_Hornet Simon Poidevin (60)

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    As a non-rugby professional I can totally vouch for that. I think it's in us as Antipodean folks to go overseas, do stuff and then come home. When I lived overseas I think there were something like a million other Aussies doing the same. The players will be no different.
  8. The_Brown_Hornet Simon Poidevin (60)

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    Back to the original point, though. Yes it makes the NRC and those pathways very important to nurture and develop.
  9. Braveheart81 George Smith (75)

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    I think the greater availability of overseas professional contracts is improving Australian rugby rather than weakening it.

    Essentially our biggest competitor is the NRL, not Europe and Japan and the more options players have to have rewarding careers in rugby union, the more likely they are to pursue it as a career.
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  10. The_Brown_Hornet Simon Poidevin (60)

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    That's a good point.
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  11. Tip Bob Loudon (25)

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    I didn't realise he took the second year option on his contract. Link?

    It's a shame, I had him pencilled in as a starting Wallaby lock for the World Cup.
  12. Slim 293 Tim Horan (67)

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  13. Ignoto Nev Cottrell (35)

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    On this point then, who's being rewarded for the time and cost into developing these players? If more players are picking up and leaving earlier now say 22-26, which is their prime years of playing, what's the incentive for Australian teams? Shouldn't the clubs, fans and even Australian rugby be rewarded for identifying these talented young men and turning them into good players?
  14. Braveheart81 George Smith (75)

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    It's a catch 22. You either create a situation where players can be bought and sold anywhere on the world based on where they are currently contracted or you leave it in the players' hands as it currently is.

    Teams get a reward for developing players because most of the players will stay and they get the use of the players for as long as they are playing for them.

    Teams also get players who have developed their game elsewhere (possibly including overseas).
  15. Tip Bob Loudon (25)

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    IRB needs to implement a Compulsory International Transfer Fee so that clubs are rewarded for producing, recognising and nurturing talent, much like the system used in Soccer.
  16. Braveheart81 George Smith (75)

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    This would just encourage teams to sell their best players whilst still under contract to foreign clubs.
  17. the coach Alan Cameron (40)

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    I think we've been here before!
    Wasn't the addition of Western Force and then the Rebels to the S15 supposed to discourage players from going overseas and in fact bring back those who left due to lack of opportunities at home?
    I can't see the NRC having any impact on this.
    It only goes for a couple of months and S15 contracted players will apparently not receive any additional payment.
    IMO, players go oversease for the money and the experience and / or because they've run out of options at home eg Giteau , O'Connor.
  18. wamberal Mark Loane (55)

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    I watch the Top 14 highlights every week. (I tried watching the occasional game in full, but it is such dire rugby that I gave up). If you think there are a lot of Australians overseas, have a look at the number of New Zealanders, Seth Efricans, Fijians, Tongans, Samoans, Argentinians, not to mention Brits and Irish, all playing in France.

    The situation will, presumably, get worse, as the new broadcast deal revenue becomes available. Funnily enough, the standard of French rugby at the national level has never been lower. Serves the buggers right.


    Is this good for the international game? It is, provided that every single non-French player is made available to play for his national side, without any impediments at all.


    Not only do we need transfer fees, we also need tough FIFA-style regulations around the question of national team representation.


    We also need to stop players being poached for their national team by the richer countries.
  19. suckerforred Chilla Wilson (44)

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    Yep. Except when you then factor in the ARU restriction on the number of international players a SuperRugby Club can have.

    Not saying either is wrong. Just saying that there are restrictions on how many internationally 'developed' players can play for and Aussie club, but there are few or more relaxed restrictions in other countries.
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  20. Tip Bob Loudon (25)

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    No, the transfer fee is paid to the last club that had said player, regardless if he is off contract. In Pyle's instance, the Rebels would be paid a sum as they have invested well over a hundred thousand dollars developing him.

    Regarding clubs selling players whilst still under contract. If the player wants to stay, then the club can't force him to go. He's signed a contract with them for said period. In the end the same applies, the Player only goes where he wants to go.

    The only change is that clubs get rewarded for producing top flight rugby players instead of the Timani, Pyle: "thanks for the experience, ciao"

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