Australia v South Africa - Perth - 6 September 2014

[Quick Hands]

I wouldn't be making judgements based solely, or in large part, on last week's match against the ABs. Collectively, the team had a shocker and that impacts on individuals for a whole lot of reasons.

It seems that TRC is going to have us playing the ABs in the first 2 weeks each year and the Boks and Argies doing likewise. That being the case, the team needs to be selected on current form, with players in the positions they played in super rugby - otherwise we will continue to get results like last week.

There's just no time to get it right, you have to get it right first up because you basically have to go with the same team for the first 2 weeks. If there is any lesson to be learnt from these 2 matches against the ABs it must be to pick players on super form in their super positions.

 

[KOB1987]

did anyone else get the impression from Link's interview on Rugby HQ that KB (Kurtley Beale) might be staying at 10?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Very cagey wasn't he. But then what did you expect him to say to a direct question from GRob - "Yeah Nah, It was a silly decision by me to play him there and it won't happen again".

 

[Lorenzo]

I wouldn't be making judgements based solely, or in large part, on last week's match against the ABs. Collectively, the team had a shocker and that impacts on individuals for a whole lot of reasons.

It seems that TRC is going to have us playing the ABs in the first 2 weeks each year and the Boks and Argies doing likewise. That being the case, the team needs to be selected on current form, with players in the positions they played in super rugby - otherwise we will continue to get results like last week.

There's just no time to get it right, you have to get it right first up because you basically have to go with the same team for the first 2 weeks. If there is any lesson to be learnt from these 2 matches against the ABs it must be to pick players on super form in their super positions.

There are 3 tests in June that offer the opportunity to do a bit of experimenting. I'd say that has the potential to be at least as instructive as Super Rugby form. Pretty strange move to make big unforced changes between June and August, though.

 

[Pfitzy]

I wouldn't be making judgements based solely, or in large part, on last week's match against the ABs. Collectively, the team had a shocker and that impacts on individuals for a whole lot of reasons.

Agreed - hard for anyone to judge when they have to cover everyone else at some point.

But we SHOULD judge ourselves against the best, and look at how individuals are performing under stress

 

[Joe Blow]

Pau has trouble when the pace of the game picks up. Obviously his tackle stats show he was busy last week but he was completely nullified in attack, as he always is against the ABs.
Fardy has been one of our best and should be retained at 6.
You all know what I think(about 8) so I will not write it again.
The selections for this test will be very interesting. I understand that Link is pretty much the sole selector. If thats the case and we go with the same side the ARU might want to take a look at that setup.

 

[I like to watch]

I'm happy for the coach to have all the say.
It's his neck on the chopping block, it's his tactics they will be playing to.
If he cocks it up he will get the sack eventually.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Alberts out of Bokke squad:

"Johannesburg (AFP) - Warren Whiteley replaced fellow loose forward Willem Alberts Thursday in the South Africa squad for Rugby Championship Tests in Australia and New Zealand during September."

https://nz.sports.yahoo.com/rugby/n...ringboks-replace-unfit-alberts-with-whiteley/

Haven't seen much of Whiteley but doubt the Bokke can afford to lose Alberts.

 

[USARugger]

Whiteley was very good for the Lions this year and it's a deserving call-up.

Much closer to a Stephen Hoiles than he is to Alberts in terms of play style, though.

 

[Braveheart81]

Pfitzy raised a good point last night regarding where our 10 stands and the relative passing of White and Phipps.

If you watch the Tahs this season, both Foley and Beale started at a similar depth to where they were both standing for the Wallabies which is quite deep. Phipps then throws the pass a couple of metres in front of them and they run onto it and the backline is instantly moving forward.

For the Wallabies, they've been standing at that depth but the big difference in the first two Bledisloes is that White then threw the ball at whoever the first receiver was and the backline was trapped behind the advantage line.

When Phipps came on it was chalk and cheese. He managed to get his forward runners running onto the ball and getting across the advantage line and then he put the ball out in front of Foley and Beale and our backline suddenly looked more threatening.

Now I think that the combined failure of our halves in the two tests will cost both White and Beale their starting spots but I won't be overly surprised if McKenzie only swaps White out for Phipps and retains Beale for one more crack. Personally, it would be Beale's defence that I'd be dropping him to the bench for rather than anything else.

 

[KOB1987]

I was thinking about yesterday's debate about selecting on Super form, v historical reasons..if we selected on Super form this would be the strongest (assuming only players from the current 30)..

1. Alexander
2. Hansen
3. Slipper
4. Skelton
5. Carter
6. McCalman
7. Hooper
8. Palu
9. White
10. Foley
11. Horne
12. Beale
13. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
14. Betham
15. Folau

So clearly there needs to be a balance..

 

[Train Without a Station]

BH I agree. Beale wasn't great as a 10. But it was his diabolical defense and work in contact that was the issue. If these things were fine the comments would be an indifferent performance at worst.

 

[KOB1987]

BH, Link was very adamant last night in saying that Beale has played at 10 all his life, which was obviously more to counter the argument that he was playing out of position than the one that he hasn't played very well..

I had similar thoughts about Link possibly changing only Phipps..

 

[Train Without a Station]

I would disregard what he said last night from the discussion. Means nothing either way really. He's not going to slate the bloke in a public forum. He says he sees him as a 10. If Foley get's hit by a bus today, Beale's his only 10 so he doesn't want to shatter the bloke's confidence in a public forum.

 

[KOB1987]

I wasn't suggesting otherwise TWAS..I came away with the impression he was going to leave him there though, although I can't put my finger on specifically why I think that!

 

[Viking]

I was thinking about yesterday's debate about selecting on Super form, v historical reasons..if we selected on Super form this would be the strongest (assuming only players from the current 30)..

1. Alexander
2. Hansen
3. Slipper
4. Skelton
5. Carter
6. McCalman
7. Hooper
8. Palu
9. White
10. Foley
11. Horne
12. Beale
13. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
14. Betham
15. Folau

So clearly there needs to be a balance..

Problem is Super Rugby form is only a starting measure. Can't measure their effectiveness in a test where there is a higher pressure, higher intensity, higher tempo environment.

How do you measure players like Alexander, McCalman, Hansen, Palu, Carter from super rugby form?

They have been unable to match intensity and physicality at Test level in the past and its impossible to measure this area unless they have another crack. Problem is more often then not, players fall short eg. Carter, Palu last test.

 

[Brumby Runner]

I for one will be extremely frustrated and disappointed if KB (Kurtley Beale) stays at 10, or even in the starting lineup at all. His defense is nowhere near good enough for test football and consequently impacts on the whole defensive structure of the Wallabies; his form at 10 is not up to scratch; and he is best utilised as a late replacement against tiring teams.

 

[Blake]

Wallabies vs the Saffas in Australia, the only day of the year Robbie deans is missed. Big match, the result will have huge implications on the 'championship'. Saffas seem a bit under done, good chance for the wallabies to get the year back on track.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Our confidence when facing Scotland now helps us recover from our longing for Robbie on this occaision.

 

[KOB1987]

Problem is Super Rugby form is only a starting measure. Can't measure their effectiveness in a test where there is a higher pressure, higher intensity, higher tempo environment.

How do you measure players like Alexander, McCalman, Hansen, Palu, Carter from super rugby form?

They have been unable to match intensity and physicality at Test level in the past and its impossible to measure this area unless they have another crack. Problem is more often then not, players fall short eg. Carter, Palu last test.

I agree, that's kind of what I am getting at..take McCalman as an example from your selections there..he was the most notieceable of the three at Super level because he was more consistent than Higgers and because Fardy played a lot at lock..but it doesn't mean his the best choice for the Wallabies. And Hansen is there because someone has to be!

Carter was selected primarily on super form, he brought it across for his first game v France (which is often the case for debutants), but hasn't really delivered since..

etc, etc..

so it's about being in form but also possessing the right skillset and physical attributes to be able to go up a notch..