Australian Rugby / RA

[wamberal]

I have not watched the Scotland England, but will later on. My neighbour watched it, he said to me that it is dire, "they don't know how to score tries!!!"
The international dimensions of our game are a strength, but also a bloody big handicap. We are stuck with a large number of partners in the governance of the game who quite like that sort of rugby, whereas most Australians would rather eat broken glass than watch stuff like that.
It's okay for somebody like Twiggy to blow blue sky thought bubbles about our code being the leading code in Australia. How? Just by rubbishing the traditional custodians of the game here?
Can some of the Twiggy defenders tell me exactly how the game gets from here, where it is a relatively minor sport, to the future, where it transcends the NRL and the AFL, both locally tailored for local tastes? Oh, and soccer too, presumably.

 

[Adam84]

I have not watched the Scotland England, but will later on. My neighbour watched it, he said to me that it is dire, "they don't know how to score tries!!!"
The international dimensions of our game are a strength, but also a bloody big handicap. We are stuck with a large number of partners in the governance of the game who quite like that sort of rugby, whereas most Australians would rather eat broken glass than watch stuff like that.
It's okay for somebody like Twiggy to blow blue sky thought bubbles about our code being the leading code in Australia. How? Just by rubbishing the traditional custodians of the game here?
Can some of the Twiggy defenders tell me exactly how the game gets from here, where it is a relatively minor sport, to the future, where it transcends the NRL and the AFL, both locally tailored for local tastes? Oh, and soccer too, presumably.

Who are these traditional custodians of the game you speak of?

What part of Twiggys suggestion that the governance should be be reviewed offends you so much?

 

[kiap]

… I don't get why, with his money and supposed desire to see Rugby, and especially WA rugby succeed, that he would have his team(s) only really "filling in" in the RA and Hybrid Super Rugby completions?

The 2021 step up is significant. I don't go along with the premise.

2020 was a last-minute Super Rugby salvage. The WF organisation rowed in well behind a quite one-sided transaction for the season. Quid, not much pro quo.

Going forward, yet more change still has to come. We all know it through the use of terms like "hybrid" and "interim".

Noting the impact of COVID on travel and his GRR comp being O/S centric, he could have funded and rolled out a NRC MkII.

On whose say so? … and what happened last time to cashed-up funds for rolling out RU teams in Aus?

That's right, rugby's administrators vetoed it … So, Western Sydney still has tumbleweeds, the backers headed elsewhere and have taken our coaches and players with them.

Since then, structurally, nothing has changed.

Board changes are welcome and overdue. But, as Adam84 said, it's still only one or two individuals away from turning south again.

 

[kiap]

Disappointingly, all we seem to get is words. If only..

Words used included "building from the grassroots up" instead of taxing them and having "the vision to be patient".

Some things are happening.

RugbyWA have set five major goals to build one of the leading school rugby competitions in the country.

• Establish a graduated and self-sustaining secondary schools competition targeting six to eight schools.
• Form a direct linkage between RugbyWA's Pathway programs, schools and local clubs to support player, coach and referee development.
• Allow more school aged participants to play competitive rugby union in high level competition all year round.
• Be the leading competition in both state and nationally to produce homegrown WA elite athletes.
• Provide support to school management, coaches and players to enable their programs to grow to national and international recognition.

Covid permitting, the schools competition is scheduled to launch in Term 3 2021 with year 7/8 age groups (Male and Female) being RugbyWA's first target group.

These are not the same old private schools (who already have their rugby competitions) but local state schools. Greenfields.

Words are OK but more is needed to make them happen. It takes money, like the Western Force Fortescue Academy does, further up the chain.

 

[kiap]

tell me exactly how the game gets from here, where it is a relatively minor sport, to the future, where it transcends the NRL and the AFL

Rugby already transcends the NRL and the AFL … and soccer too

But if someone told you what the game needed to do … or better yet, you saw it for yourself … would you do it? Of course not, because you don't have agency.

That's as it may be, but one thing the game here should not rush to do IMO is get rid of Super Rugby Au.

Controlling their own comp mitigates at least somewhat against being "stuck with a large number of governance partners".

 

[hoggy]

Rugby already transcends the NRL and the AFL … and soccer too

But if someone told you what the game needed to do … or better yet, you saw it for yourself … would you do it? Of course not, because you don't have agency.

That's as it may be, but one thing the game here should not rush to do IMO is get rid of Super Rugby Au.

Controlling their own comp mitigates at least somewhat against being "stuck with a large number of governance partners".

Maybe rugby will never transcend AFL/NRL, but surely it could be do a lot better, and agreed maintaining a genuine domestic presence will go along way in the future to achieving that.

 

[Pfitzy]

Let me first say that makes perfect sense that Twiggy is involved from a humour angle, because undermining is what rugby does best.

“We started to lose touch with our shareholders, our boys and girls and mums and dads. They‘re the real owners of the game, when we started to lose touch with them and just consider ourselves as the rugby leaders, as the rugby board, the rugby administration,” Forrest said.

BREAKING: Man who ruthlessly attempted to exploit boys and girls and mums and dads to make himself rich, says rugby administrators out of touch with shareholders.

“When you started to do rotten corporate governance like structure things so board appointments could only really be made by the chairman — so at the end of the day it was one person’s rule — that is just shocking governance.”

BREAKING: Man who appoints his own board as dictator CEO outraged that rugby appoints its own board.

“I saw what was happening there and I saw the poor judgment. And you could put it down easily to that they’d lost touch for the shareholders, they’d lost touch with the mums and dads that were no longer there for the good of the game or the more importantly, the good of the players and the good of the supporters, particularly the parents.”

Sure, let's talk about poor judgement: https://www.crikey.com.au/2020/04/30/twiggy-forrest-ambush-greg-hunt/


I'm all for new ideas and people who want to support the game, but FFS can everyone stop kneeling at the Twiggy Totem and saying he'll fix everything? You'll have stretchmarks on your cheeks before you know it.

The man is a perpetual motion engine for self-promotion and the best interests of three things:

1. Twiggy
2. Mining
3. China

And those three things are presently engaged in a circle-jerk that helps each of them benefit as it goes around and around.

Is change required? Absolutely. We were moving in the direction of actual change before Castle was deep-sixed by the powers that be. Hopefully that settles down a bit, now that a middle-aged white guy is back in charge Or, at least, be a new and different kind of shitbirding.

 

[Pfitzy]

On a more serious note: soccer as a sport is a professional failure in Australia if we're talking governance. Like rugby, it only captures part of its crowd at international level. Bad comparison, and a poor one to use when you look at the pyramid of grassroots through to international cohesion in both codes.

"Grassroots" is a term that has variable meanings, depending where you sit. Grassroots rugby in Perth is a significantly different beast to grassroots rugby in Sydney where the extra layers and unions make it complex.

The best approach would be to align all rugby from juniors through to Premier Rugby, but then you're not just talking ONE board or set of governance - in Sydney alone you would need to realign about 6-8 different organisations to get that moving (SRU, SJRU, NSWSRU, SWRU, GPS, IAS, CHS, etc.). That isn't counting the country union and affiliates.

 

[dru]

The best approach would be to align all rugby from juniors through to Premier Rugby, but then you're not just talking ONE board or set of governance - in Sydney alone you would need to realign about 6-8 different organisations to get that moving (SRU, SJRU, NSWSRU, SWRU, GPS, IAS, CHS, etc.). That isn't counting the country union and affiliates.

Isn't that there a fantastic place to start?

 

[wamberal]

Isn't that there a fantastic place to start?

The OED has two main definitions of the word "fantastic":

1. "Extraordinarily good or attractive".

2. "Imaginative or fanciful; removed from reality".

The people who are running those organisations are mostly unpaid, and already giving a lot of their spare time just to keep their administrative heads above water. It would be fantastic to see the whole structure overhauled, but it would take a lot of realistic imagination. And funding.

 

[barbarian]

But why would the schools organisations (GPS, CAS, etc) want to be aligned with anyone other than themselves?

There's nothing in it for them. They don't care about the health of the game as a whole, mainly because they also play soccer, AFL, basketball and a host of other sports at any one time.
.

 

[Pfitzy]

But why would the schools organisations (GPS, CAS, etc) want to be aligned with anyone other than themselves?

There's nothing in it for them. They don't care about the health of the game as a whole, mainly because they also play soccer, AFL, basketball and a host of other sports at any one time.
.

We're repeatedly told that these are *the* rugby nurseries, vital for the ongoing development of professional players, and therefore the Wallabies, and therefore the success of the game.

So why aren't they part of the plan?

 

[Pfitzy]

(The fact that there are four schools associations for rugby in NSW is utterly laughable, I might add).

 

[barbarian]

We're repeatedly told that these are *the* rugby nurseries, vital for the ongoing development of professional players, and therefore the Wallabies, and therefore the success of the game.

So why aren't they part of the plan?

They can be a part of the plan, but any sort of 'unification' doesn't work.

RA can help those schools with coaching resources, talent ID, player visits etc, but that's really about as much as you can do.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

(The fact that there are four schools associations for rugby in NSW is utterly laughable, I might add).

"If tree I mean rugby goalpost fall in NSFW and no
one play rugby then did it really happen?"

 

[dru]

Sure, let's talk about poor judgement: https://www.crikey.com.au/2020/04/30/twiggy-forrest-ambush-greg-hunt/

Lost a lot of respect for the guy there. Otherwise so far his rugby input I consider to be a positive.

 

[sendit]

Do the private schools even need to be part of the "plan". Treat them as private academies and worry about the other stuff

 

[eastman]

Do the private schools even need to be part of the "plan". Treat them as private academies and worry about the other stuff

Spot on - private schools do more than enough for rugby as is and remove a significant funding burden.

Why is it absurd that there are four different associations for rugby? I can assure you they definitely weren't set up with rugby in mind...​

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

They can be a part of the plan, but any sort of 'unification' doesn't work.

RA can help those schools with coaching resources, talent ID, player visits etc, but that's really about as much as you can do.

There could be an argument made for the likes of ISA in particular should be looked at if they were looking to find a structure that's more open to expanding their participation base. Considering they run two divisions involving 16+ schools. It would also probably be the association to benefit the most from the suggested resources and engagement.

Or there could be efforts made to engage with the likes of the Metro Catholic College/Schools sports associations in order to get Rugby up and running in those schools. Schools associations aren't the devil in terms of sports development. League uses the latter two quite extensively.

 

[Dan54]

Spot on - private schools do more than enough for rugby as is and remove a significant funding burden.

Why is it absurd that there are four different associations for rugby? I can assure you they definitely weren't set up with rugby in mind.

No probably set up with expanding on kids learning, which someone once told me their job was.