Honest Assessment of Richard Graham's Coaching Ability

[Ash]

What's more, I thought that the Force made the most inroads on the Brumbies when they attacked close to the ruck - short pop passes to a forward in close channels. They made most of their ground in the first half doing this, then backed off in the second. Why?

 

[mudskipper]

What's more, I thought that the Force made the most inroads on the Brumbies when they attacked close to the ruck - short pop passes to a forward in close channels. They made most of their ground in the first half doing this, then backed off in the second. Why?

I don't know but the Force were in their own half most of the time as the Brumbies had a better tactical kicking game, with 3 solid kickers White, To'omua and Coleman.

 

[Slim 293]

finally a brumbies fan who speaks the truth with out all the chest beating and verbal diarrhea.


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Pot... Kettle...

 

[RedsHappy]

IMO, the real 'tell tale' signpost to RG's actual coaching capability level came when Deans was more than willing to zap him off the Force just pre a RWC year. Would Henry ever have done this with one of his core group at such a crucial juncture, assuming his core group were all making major contributions to the ABs' development, of course he wouldn't.

I stand by my assessment back then: WA Rugby made a serious blunder in not spending the extra $s to recruit a seasoned head coach experienced in gaining proven success at least in a noted provincial, if not Test, team. There were simply too many frailties in the Force's team and team depth not to make such a strategic investment in the right leadership resources for the future of WA Rugby.

To add an unproven quickly-handed-over 'skills' support coach (that had never successfully head coached at senior level) to a fragile team base of players (that in 5 or so years had not gotten close to a Super Final) was a likely exercise in high-risk, and expensive, futility.

We will know more by 2012 S15 R6+ or so; I hope I'm wrong, for the good of Aus rugby as a whole.

 

[Forcefield]

Came despairingly close in 2009.

Pot... Kettle...

Come on now Slim, play fair. None of us are as bad as Mudskipper. It's a bit more like a fine china pot and a kettle that aspires to look like Wesley Snipes.

 

[Newter]

IMO, the real 'tell tale' signpost to RG's actual coaching capability level came when Deans was more than willing to zap him off the Force just pre a RWC year. Would Henry ever have done this with one of his core group at such a crucial juncture, assuming his core group were all making major contributions to the ABs' development, of course he wouldn't.

What is this. Richard Graham made the decision himself.

 

[Gagger]

IMO, the real 'tell tale' signpost to RG's actual coaching capability level came when Deans was more than willing to zap him off the Force just pre a RWC year. Would Henry ever have done this with one of his core group at such a crucial juncture, assuming his core group were all making major contributions to the ABs' development, of course he wouldn't.

I think you might be having it a bit both ways there RH - in our assessment of Deans, wouldn't we say RG was savvy to get out asap? I don't see how Deans would have been able to hold him back. My sense from hearing RG talk about his Wallaby time (never glowing) would be this was the case.

The consensus is that you give a coach 2 years before judging what they've achieved - you inherit the first year and put your stamp on the second. The Force were in a pile of mess when he arrived, and don't seem able to buy their way out. I'd say he'll need at least this.

 

[Ash]

He should be recruiting for next season already, though. He hasn't covered himself in glory in that regard yet.

The recruitment from 2011 to 2012 for the Force was pretty damn woeful, especially in the backs, and in the end they were damn lucky they got Nalaga. Prior to Nalaga, their best recruitment was probably Ma'Food and Toby Lynn - and this for a side whose weakness is the backs and they lost arguably their two best backs from last season (J'OC and Smith).

The other thing is Graham was supposedly the Wallaby skills coach. So far he hasn't seem to have improved the basic skills of the Force backs - their execution has been pretty average a lot of the time, and last year they really struggled to score a try - and without J'OC and Smith it doesn't get easier.

 

[RedsHappy]

Gagger, what you say is perfectly logical and fair, and I have no inside data on this matter. RG might have wanted out, perhaps as one strongly suspects - and as has been leaked - Foley did from 2009 after his 'disagreements' with Deans.

The countervailing point though is this: if Deans had argued strongly via the ARU that he absolutely needed to keep his powerfully talented core team together for delivering the ARU's cherished goal of winning the 2011 RWC, and most coaches would quite rationally think this way for continuity's sake, then I would believe the ARU would have instructed the State RUs of this and insisted upon no internal coaching transfers until post-RWC. The alternative of a coach poaching free for all in such a crucial time period seems unlikely to have been approved of by JO'N. (And just btw, Blake has managed to be both a Wallabies and Force support coach.)

So, I accept the potential validity of your assessment, but I think mine has merit as well. Perhaps the truth is a bit of both, quite possibly.

I hope you're right re the 2 year window of proof. I'm not entirely sure I agree with this allowance though in that many of the best coaches seem to validate their talent and value quite fast, and it's the also rans that run the 'but give me the time' line again and again. For example: it's indisputable that Craig McDermott has rapidly improved and with demonstrable results Australia's fast bowlers in less than 1 year, and Link made vast improvements to the Reds within 6-8 months of starting, etc.

As I noted, I'd sincerely like to be proven wrong re RG, but I see no repeating signs yet via recruitments or performance, that I am.


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[Waylon]

You might not have noticed, but his strategy against the Brumbies was working beautifully. This comes down to a question of what we hold Graham responsible for. The plan to go through the Brumbies forward pack with short passing from the ruck and bodies in motion was producing dozens of half-breaks and forward momentum. The reason it didn't come to points more frequently was because rusty Wallabies like Pocock and Sharpe were dropping ball in contact. That will subside with match practice.

As for the wallaby backs when he was skills coach: we scored about four tries a game in 2010. You work it out.

I did notice they rarely troubled the scorer

I did notice that the massive Fijian was standing on the wing holding his todger. He was used to scoring more tries than anybody else in the competition in France.

I did notice the Force pack standing flat footed behind the rucks and flopping behind the advantage line in possession. The "dozens of half breaks"...........dozens?

I noticed a very static pack, a very flat backline and a backline that had no idea what was on.

2010........we were beaten by England on home soil. No 4 tries that night. The tri nations we won only 2 games. Not a lot of tries in that tournament. Belted on the Spring tour by England at Twickenham. Lost to a club team (Munster)

We beat Fiji 49-3. maybe that was where the tries came? You work it out

 

[Waylon]

The Force's best games were also when Willie Ripia was playing #12. I don't think we should hold it against Graham that he's been reduced to one playmaker again, through no fault of his own. Rory Sidey is not a second five-eighth. Hopefully we see Ben Seymour develop, or a better candidate drafted in within the next month.

The Force's best games were when Ripia was injured. He was fat and in the way.

 

[Newter]

I did notice they rarely troubled the scorer

I did notice that the massive Fijian was standing on the wing holding his todger. He was used to scoring more tries than anybody else in the competition in France.

I did notice the Force pack standing flat footed behind the rucks and flopping behind the advantage line in possession. The "dozens of half breaks"...........dozens?

I noticed a very static pack, a very flat backline and a backline that had no idea what was on.

2010........we were beaten by England on home soil. No 4 tries that night. The tri nations we won only 2 games. Not a lot of tries in that tournament. Belted on the Spring tour by England at Twickenham. Lost to a club team (Munster)

We beat Fiji 49-3. maybe that was where the tries came? You work it out

Look at the play from 13:50, and from around 20:00 onward. These are examples of the breaks the Force were getting around the ruck. I'm sure further viewing will show you more.

As for 2010, we scored an average of 2.8 tries per game in the Trinations. In the Republic we scored a total of nine tries in two Test matches. Two tries against England at Twickenham. Thrashed France with five tries.

Let's give credit where it's due. Graham's record speaks for itself.

 

[Gagger]

The recruitment from 2011 to 2012 for the Force was pretty damn woeful, especially in the backs, and in the end they were damn lucky they got Nalaga. Prior to Nalaga, their best recruitment was probably Ma'Food and Toby Lynn - and this for a side whose weakness is the backs and they lost arguably their two best backs from last season (J'OC and Smith).

This is my key question. Major backline recruitment hasn't been happening (partly due to some bad luck as well).

Why? Is it

1. Woody's choice,
2. A fuckup (timing or ignorance)
3. A lack of money or cooperation from the business, or some other business reason

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

There have been some pretty ordinary recruiting decisions, there can be no doubt about that. Ripia is obviously the worst, but who was to know that he was a thief as well as being a fairly average footballer?

EDIT: Thinking about it further, the recruiting problem has been mainly in the backs. The forwards who have been brought in or developed through the playing list have almost all stepped up. I feel happier with our pack than I have a long time.

 

[Gagger]

What's pretty obvious about the Force pack is the number of Wallabies in it, especially the back row with 4 of them.

It makes me wonder if these guys are soaking up the funds and causing a bit of the deadlock??

 

[Newter]

There have been some pretty ordinary recruiting decisions, there can be no doubt about that. Ripia is obviously the worst, but who was to know that he was a thief as well as being a fairly average footballer?

EDIT: Thinking about it further, the recruiting problem has been mainly in the backs. The forwards who have been brought in or developed through the playing list have almost all stepped up. I feel happier with our pack than I have a long time.

Not sure I agree with this about recruitment. They've developed a half dozen good young backs in the last twelve months. Dellitt, Mafi, Stannard.

It would be better if they were producing a James O'Connor every two or three years, but then it's only Graham's second season.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Gags, maybe, but most of the pigs were brought up through the ranks and developed by the Force, making them cheaper as a general rule. The big bucks have often been spent on the ivory tinklers out in the backline. Probably no different from other teams in that regard though.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Not sure I agree with this about recruitment. They've developed a half dozen good young backs in the last twelve months. Dellitt, Mafi, Stannard.

It would be better if they were producing a James O'Connor every two or three years, but then it's only Graham's second season.

They are a pretty serviceable group, but in comparison to the development of the pack, I'd say we've lagged a bit on that front. Dellit and Stannard are a bit more "mature aged" recruits too. They both had decent amounts of footy under their belts before coming over.

 

[Gagger]

Gags, maybe, but most of the pigs were brought up through the ranks and developed by the Force, making them cheaper as a general rule. The big bucks have often been spent on the ivory tinklers out in the backline. Probably no different from other teams in that regard though.

But who are they spending on out back this year? Surely only really Napolioni?

The back row are all Wallabies and the Rebels would kill for any of them I'd wager

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Honestly don't know the answer to that one. The big Fijian is the only one I can think of.