Japanese Rugby, the real elephant in the room?

[en_force_er]

That's right! The Japanese thread symbol has finally been used again! But onto what I wanted to discuss.

Japanese RFU is a union that has money and is showing improved performances on the field (through IRB Pacific Nations Cup).

Other notable things about Japanese Rugby:

• They, unlike the Pacific Islands, develop the majority of their national talent locally.
• They already have a professional set-up that could be built on (this is more then USA, Canada, Russia and even Argetina).
• They have a league that consists mostly of local players and that is extremely well funded and have some seriously good coaches.
• They are a first world nation with a huge population and rugby is growing in popularity their.

One get's the feeling that the only reason some of the bigger, better funded Japanese clubs can't field Super Rugby levels sides is because of their foreigner limit and the fact that the Japanese talent is spread so thinly over 14 sides.

A plan for Japanese Rugby:

Perhaps, just perhaps, we could take a leaf out of the NH's book and view what they are doing for Italy. We could create two Japanese Super Rugby "provinces" (read: franchises), based out of the Kanto region (Tokyo) and the Kyushu region (Fukuoka). These could be sold/given to the bigger companies that already own clubs (for example Ricoh or Suntory)

We could make a rule that 60% or more of their 30-35 man squad MUST be Japanese eligible or have played for Japan. 20% or more of their squad MUST be eligible for either Fiji, Samoa or Tonga and the rest can be from wherever. Of course 3N players could play there and still be eligible for all their nations tests as they'd be running to a Super rugby schedule.

Also, Japan should get at least two matches against any of the 3N (soon to be 4N) countries every year.

If we do this I think we could easily see Japan evolve into a top 8 rugby nation, we could certainly see them grow to be competitive with the likes of Italy and Scotland.

The wonder with all this is, the money and infrastructure is already there. It just needs to be built on!

In the mean time check out this recent and reasonably high quality test between Japan and Samoa. Enjoy.

[video=youtube;yWaEZJ3Gyso]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWaEZJ3Gyso[/video]

This pie in the sky stuff, it really could happen in the next 5 years. If 2 Jap provinces were made and one joined each the NZ and Aussie Super conferences perhaps even the Saffas could get their Southern Kings.

It could happen and realistically too.

Rant over.

 

[en_force_er]

Related to the video, is Josh Tatupu with the Force next year?

Now that he is capped for Samoa and the Force have Smith/Ripia wouldn't that cause an issue?

 

[tranquility]

I thought that they had let him go? he never did much to impress me in the limited super rugby i saw of him..

Japanese rugby is very well coached right through to grass roots. I was speaking with Tom Barker, who has done alot of coaching over there and he said the academy setups are fantastic over there and they train harder than anyone. He did say however that due to their natural physiques they struggle with tackling bigger players front on, and look to tackle side on. He also said they are very aware of making rugby look 'attractive' and when they are coaching many of the buzz words are 'symmetrical' 'balanced' etc. Definite potential.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I'm not too sure about the game in Japan at the moment. While Top League crowds are slightly up (around 5%) many people I have come across who have some experience with the game in Japan have been pointing to a steep decline in player numbers in the High School ranks. If ture then before Japan can really flourish on the international stage they must address development and retention issues.

Don't get me wrong. I would like to see the SANZAR nations in particular begin to take a far more proactive role in bringing Japan into Tier One status and if you could somehow convince the JRFU and more importantly the companies that control the Top League that running 2 Japanese franchises would be beneficial developmentally and financially then you could have a couple of real powerhouse's on your hands. You could split the two adding one eash into the Aus and NZ conference's without too many issues for broadcasters as Japan is actually in a pretty viewer friendly timezone.

I think to really accelerate Japan it does need to be approached in a number of ways by a number of different organisations. First the IRB. They really need to push the JRFU to work extensively to sell the game to the Japanese public. Grow the grassroots and Top League. You could argue that one should help the other. With IRB assistance (and funding) the JRFU should be looking if those I have heard from are correct to intially recover the lost territory and then build further on it. Another objective should be to somehow translate the support levels that exist for the game at the University levels to that of the Top League. Traditionally Uni Rugby in Japan enjoys strong support but falls away dramatically after school. If they can somehow harness this then the game will see greater growth through exposure and awareness.

The organisation is SANZAR and read en_force_er's comments on that.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Aren't the Southern Kings joining Super Rugby in 2013?

 

[Crow]

He did say however that due to their natural physiques they struggle with tackling bigger players front on, and look to tackle side on. He also said they are very aware of making rugby look 'attractive' and when they are coaching many of the buzz words are 'symmetrical' 'balanced' etc. Definite potential.

I find it really hard to believe that they don't have anyone capable of bulking up:

Perhaps it's the type of player attracted to rugby in japan.

 

[tranquility]

I think Tom meant especially in the backs. Perhaps the athletes that they are short of are in the 100kg dynamic ball carriers / stirling mortlock types. Although couldn't every nation do with a few more of those all the time.

 

[Red Rooster]

Yawn - if they were going to take on the world they would have done it by now. With the volume of money and facilities they have had over the last 20 years and the assistance of foreign coaches and players their world ranking is quite poor and not really improving

 

[Eyes and Ears]

Related to the video, is Josh Tatupu with the Force next year?

Now that he is capped for Samoa and the Force have Smith/Ripia wouldn't that cause an issue?

Tatupu has left the Force. He had some very poor games defensively this year and was dropped from the 22 early in the season.

 

[SuperGrover]

Other notable things about Japanese Rugby:

* They, unlike the Pacific Islands, develop the majority of their national talent locally.
* They already have a professional set-up that could be built on (this is more then USA, Canada, Russia and even Argentina).
* They have a league that consists mostly of local players and that is extremely well funded and have some seriously good coaches.
* They are a first world nation with a huge population and rugby is growing in popularity their.

I'm pretty sure that Russia has some pretty impressive facilities themselves and at the very least some fully professional teams in their league.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

We'll actually get to see where Russia sits in relation to Japan. They have a scheduled test in a week or so.

 

[SuperGrover]

Tatupu Signed with a french club (can't recall which one) from his stint with Otago in the ITM Cup

 

[SuperGrover]

Kirwan thinks that the Super 15 isn't the way to go either; preferring New Zealand and Australia keep local competitions like the ITM cup and then break into a Heineken Cup style of competition with Japan and the Pacific Islands.

"Everyone talks about a Super 15 franchise [in Japan] but that means we'll piss off 20 of the biggest sponsors in the world and we'd have the focus on just one team."

http://www.heavensgame.com/globetrotter/eddie-jones-john-kirwan-talk-japanese-rugby

Could be a problem getting the vision up and running if the Japanese don't want a bar of it. if a Heineken Cup style comp was instituted it wouldn't solve the perceived problem of having the talent spread too thinly.

have also heard Kirwan talk previously about the need to keep onside the corporate entities that own the pro clubs in Japan. if just two teams were formed ala the Italians in the Magners, then there is the possibility to put offside some very wealthy investors. Toyota alone has a marketing budget of over $1bn.

 

[Crow]

I'd love a Heineken Cup equivalent outside of europe. You could probably drag in Canadian/US/Argy teams as well, but then it just becomes the 'non-euro club comp.' To a certain degree, I think 3N clubs are sick of playing each other, so a Force style mini-tour might be a better solution.

 

[RugbyFuture]

Yawn - if they were going to take on the world they would have done it by now. With the volume of money and facilities they have had over the last 20 years and the assistance of foreign coaches and players their world ranking is quite poor and not really improving

double that

though they might get more home attention with the recent IRB developments

 

[stoff]

http://www.heavensgame.com/globetrotter/eddie-jones-john-kirwan-talk-japanese-rugby

Could be a problem getting the vision up and running if the Japanese don't want a bar of it. if a Heineken Cup style comp was instituted it wouldn't solve the perceived problem of having the talent spread too thinly.

have also heard Kirwan talk previously about the need to keep onside the corporate entities that own the pro clubs in Japan. if just two teams were formed ala the Italians in the Magners, then there is the possibility to put offside some very wealthy investors. Toyota alone has a marketing budget of over $1bn.

IMO it would to a degress - ie Munster/Leinster vs Connacht/Ulster. The real problem is Kirwan's suggestion would be a huge problem for Aus Rugby, so wont happen.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

IMO it would to a degress - ie Munster/Leinster vs Connacht/Ulster. The real problem is Kirwan's suggestion would be a huge problem for Aus Rugby, so wont happen.

It's not that unreasonable to believe that one day in the future Super Rugby will take on a HC like format. The introduction of the conference system is a big step in that very direction. Couple of years ago there was an article in the British published RugbyWorld Magazine that mapped out a 'leaked' roadmap of Super Rugby and its future. Basically in consisted of 5 conference's of 8 teams each running the own National titles leading into a finals series of 10/12 teams. Now it appeared to be nothing more than speculation the restructure and re-branding of the competition could prove this article at least somewhat correct. SANZAR sending out letters stating that they were not interested in any EOI's at present but would do in the future seems another significant indication.

 

[JJJ]

I find it really hard to believe that they don't have anyone capable of bulking up:

Perhaps it's the type of player attracted to rugby in japan.

That might be the problem right there. As soon as they're bulked up enough to be decent front-rowers they switch to sumo wrestling for more money/prestige/women.

 

[TOCC]

ladies and gentlemen, there is a whole lot more to rugby union in Japan then what some people on here seem to presume.

Corporate Culture
I believe someone mentioned that Toyota has the largest sponsorship budget in the world? technically yes, however the caveat is that in the 1950's the Japanese Governement introduced a law which stated that Japanese companies had to spend a certain % of there revenue on 'social pride'. What this means overall, is even though there are some massive corporations backing the Top League teams, they arent doing it for brand exposure, they are doing it because its the law, they are forced to spend the money so they channel it into a new 'corporate pride' philosophy.

Professionalism
Its debatable whether the Top League is in fact truly professional, whilst the foreign players(gaijin) are paid contract fees for there time in the country, the local players are still employees of the company and are in fact required to work a certiain amount of hours/week. The reason for playing however is that at the end of his playing career, a japanese player is given shūshin koyō(job for life).

What does this all mean
Ok, so what does this mean in terms of driving forward a new professional structure in Japan, well as indicated already promoting a certain number of clubs runs the risk of alienating the other corporations, this is all about Corporate pride and whilst they are required to spend a certain amount of money they can spend it in any number of ways.

In terms of player contracting, well this would arguably be one of the hardest issues, the players in these japanese clubs arent professional players, they are company employees who represent the company, they play rugby knowing the will have a job for life once they finish there career. Moving onto a professional enviroment where a players only has a contract for the length of his playing career is vastly unfamilar territory, this is a incredibly important part of japanese culture, there is really nothing more honorable then having a job life.

There is however hope, one only needs to look over at the J-League to see this, soccer was in exactly the same position as rugby union is/was, the top-league is a step towards professionalism. However for a full professional culture to be embraced it would require all the companies to come together and concede ownership of there teams and in turn begin a sponroship culture instead. It rook many years for soccer to achieve this, however with the impending RWC in Japan it could provide the necessary trigger.

 

[SuperGrover]

Japan beat Russia 75-3 at the Prince Chichibu stadium on Saturday November 6th.

Japan:
Tries: Kikutani, Leitch, Robins 2, Tupuailai 3, Taira 2, Endo, Imamura
Pens:Tanabe 10

For Russia:
Pens: Yanytushkin