Not another "Four More Years Boys"

[liquor box]

How would these second teir teams compare to a S15 team? If they are equal or better then why not play Australian S15 teams v Georgia, Japan, USA, Canada and Russia as trial games, these countries could have a 4-5 week tour down under and we could host some type of 2nd tier nations cup after the trials in the "gap" week between trials and the S15 proper.

This allows these nations to improve by playing against better competition, and maybe we play one test against the top touring team the following season as a reward. This could be an incentive to them to improve.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I'd imagine they'd be reasonably competitive and it would be a good start. With the month break coming into Super Rugby for the June test window next year. This could be a good means to keep Super Rugby squads playing thoroughout the gap. Win/win in my opinion.

 

[liquor box]

I'd imagine they'd be reasonably competitive and it would be a good start. With the month break coming into Super Rugby for the June test window next year. This could be a good means to keep Super Rugby squads playing thoroughout the gap. Win/win in my opinion.

Maybe a curtain raiser could be a combined S15 team with the left overs from the Wallabies squad. Can you have 2 curtain raisers? P.I v "Australia A" and S15 combined v 2nd tier team

 

[DPK]

How would these second teir teams compare to a S15 team? If they are equal or better then why not play Australian S15 teams v Georgia, Japan, USA, Canada and Russia as trial games, these countries could have a 4-5 week tour down under and we could host some type of 2nd tier nations cup after the trials in the "gap" week between trials and the S15 proper.

This allows these nations to improve by playing against better competition, and maybe we play one test against the top touring team the following season as a reward. This could be an incentive to them to improve.

A few years ago (maybe even last year?), Japan played against North Harbour from the ITM Cup. Their skill levels were pretty comparable, made for a very competitive game.

 

[Ruggo]

When the tier one nation tour the Northern and southern Hemishperes they should either travel through the America's or Eastern Europe/Japan. It would be far more benificial to the game to run the dirt trackers in these games rather than a Europian club side.

I would love for us to host the PN sides more and also visit them. For us these can be the games we spread across more regional areas to expand the footprint of rugby in Australia.

 

[AngrySeahorse]

The problem is - why develop the PI nations? It sounds harsh (and probably bitter as they keep beating my team - Wales), but what advantage is in there for the IRB and really rugby long term - the Samoan captain called it when he was saying they should play Tier A sides, he pointed out that the IRB and co would have to fund them as they are only a small nation.

Now I would love these teams to do well, but when looked at for growth reasons are the PI sides really a worthwhile target? They dont have teh money to back themselves, dont have the support base to grow the game and dont have the industry to provide sponsorship opportunities. Compare that to teams like Georgia, Russia, USA, Canada and Japan who do have all these aspects, and a healthy growing base of fans who have an interest in rugby, and they should probably be the targets as they have people, money and real growth opportunities.

I would love the PIs to do well, so dont think this is me simply saying ignore them, but for the good of the long term growth of the game I am convinced we should be looking elsewhere.

That is a really good point. I'd like to see some kind of compromise where all nations whether they are PI or not could have some kind of support to help develop the game. I'm not just talking about the minnows that are competing in RWC now, I'm talking about tier2 & 3 tier nations that have the money behind them to get up & running sooner but just not the numbers & skill to be competitve yet. There are countries not even involved in the RWC yet that would provide some good clashes if only they could develop further, if I could go into fantasy land for one moment I'd love to see Germany develop into a solid rugby nation just to see the RWC have a Germany v England clash.

The best area for growth for mine is USA. Japan really has to have growth given they'll be hosts of the RWC in the future, they'll need to be even more competitive than what they are now.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Do people read the prior posts before posting: the reason they cant play in the s 15 is that they dont have enough money to keep the players we are all interested in playing for the PIs - the european clubs have them on contract for big dollars.

 

[Antony]

I don't think anyone is suggesting they play in the super 15; rather that they play against franchise sides in the super off-season (like immediately afterwards). Gives them more games, potentially more revenue, and won't result in the kind of towellings that we see when they play Aust/NZ/SA between world cups.

 

[matty_k]

Internet forums have the memory of a gold fish.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Do people read the prior posts before posting: the reason they cant play in the s 15 is that they dont have enough money to keep the players we are all interested in playing for the PIs - the european clubs have them on contract for big dollars.

That's why I have suggested that SANZAR open 5 roster positions in each Super Rugby franchise to accommodate not only Argentine player's but PI players as well.

 

[Nusadan]

That's why I have suggested that SANZAR open 5 roster positions in each Super Rugby franchise to accommodate not only Argentine player's but PI players as well.

They wouldn't cost much more than academy players...

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

They wouldn't cost much more than academy players...

That's how I figure it.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

That's why I have suggested that SANZAR open 5 roster positions in each Super Rugby franchise to accommodate not only Argentine player's but PI players as well.

would be the right thing to do on many levels but would weaken the Wallabies, ABs and Bok by 20 players per annum - thats 80 players in a RWC cycle

 

[Cardiffblue]

Hang on. Why should Samoa have to play your 2nds? Didn't the just beat the firsts, or was I dreaming?

 

[Bullrush]

The problem is - why develop the PI nations? It sounds harsh (and probably bitter as they keep beating my team - Wales), but what advantage is in there for the IRB and really rugby long term - the Samoan captain called it when he was saying they should play Tier A sides, he pointed out that the IRB and co would have to fund them as they are only a small nation.

Now I would love these teams to do well, but when looked at for growth reasons are the PI sides really a worthwhile target? They dont have teh money to back themselves, dont have the support base to grow the game and dont have the industry to provide sponsorship opportunities. Compare that to teams like Georgia, Russia, USA, Canada and Japan who do have all these aspects, and a healthy growing base of fans who have an interest in rugby, and they should probably be the targets as they have people, money and real growth opportunities.

I would love the PIs to do well, so dont think this is me simply saying ignore them, but for the good of the long term growth of the game I am convinced we should be looking elsewhere.

How many PI players are playing around the world in different clubs and competitions? How many are playing for other countries in this world cup? Per capita, the pacific islands are probably the biggest contributor to rugby in terms of players and often, they produce the players that bums in seats around the world. From Jonah Lomu to the Tuilagi brothers to Tana Umaga to Digby Ioane to Jerry Collins to Reupeni Caucaunibuca.....these countries produce natural rugby excitement machines on a consistent basis. There has to be more to rugby than just making a dollar and acknowledging these countries' contribution by financially supporting them, necessary only because they are in essence 3rd world countries, should be a part of that.

Otherwise, you run the risk of losing or ruining something pretty special in the rugby community.

 

[Cardiffblue]

Do people read the prior posts before posting: the reason they cant play in the s 15 is that they dont have enough money to keep the players we are all interested in playing for the PIs - the european clubs have them on contract for big dollars.

An alternative view is that the SANZAR nations are financially strapped and unwilling to share TV $$$s with Islanders. So while lip service is paid every four years at RWC time to advancing rugby outside of the 3N and 6N, it is not interests of 'tier 1 nations' to do anything about it.

Actually would dispute whether results show 'minnow nations' are getting any closer.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

An alternative view is that the SANZAR nations are financially strapped and unwilling to share TV $$$s with Islanders. So while lip service is paid every four years at RWC time to advancing rugby outside of the 3N and 6N, it is not interests of 'tier 1 nations' to do anything about it.

Actually would dispute whether results show 'minnow nations' are getting any closer.

wash your mouth out: to be fair to the ARU they dont even do any development here so why would they take an interest in the PIs?

 

[Cardiffblue]

On one forum thread I saw an idea for a RWC Plate comp for teams exiting before QF. Works well at club level and beats shipping them out the morning after their final group match. Also in period when we lapsed, we might actually have come home with some silverware

 

[Cardiffblue]

Too true. Not sure how club rugby keeps going here. Seems completely disconnected with franchises. Getting four grades out every weekend requires a minor miracle

 

[Hawko]

An alternative view is that the SANZAR nations are financially strapped and unwilling to share TV $$$s with Islanders. So while lip service is paid every four years at RWC time to advancing rugby outside of the 3N and 6N, it is not interests of 'tier 1 nations' to do anything about it.

Actually would dispute whether results show 'minnow nations' are getting any closer.

In 2003 RWC minnows were getting 100+ points put on them. That's when Latho scored five tries in a test (if you could call it that). Eight years later and no team has had 100 points scored against them. Sixty or seventy yes, occasionally eighty. And in the first week, when their physical condition wasn't sullied by fatigue, they really put it to some of the tier one nations. In 2003 we thought Argentina were a minnow team, no longer. There has been massive improvement and long may it continue.