School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[sulidor]

....and from today's piece:

"
The executive director of the Association of Independent Schools of NSW, Geoff Newcombe, said:

‘‘If there is a protocol in place where schools have agreed not to offer scholarships to students talented in a sporting area, then obviously the schools should honour that protocol.’’

Former Riverview principal Shane Hogan said the use of sports inducements could fracture the GPS sports association.

‘‘If it continues like this you are going to have a break-up of schools in Sydney ... Everyone is always concerned if there is not a level playing field ...‘‘The only concern I have is for kids who enter the field at first-grade level without any hope whatsoever of being competitive. It becomes a safety issue.’’

Laugh or cry ? Plenty of stimulus for either reaction.

I suspect Hogan may have been slightly mis-quoted - "break-up of schools associations" seems a more likely outcome, and perhaps already started.

Re the Tim Hawkes quote, human beings generally only engage in behaviour that is rewarded, and no GPS head master is going to engage in behaviour UNLESS it's rewarded, substantially, materially, in some way.

​

 

[Quick Hands]

What happens to the boys who can't afford to come to the schools from Year 7 and choose to do so like many in Year 9 or 10? Are there opportunities to play for the elite teams inhibited?

Still room for them, schools just can't fill their teams with them and as we're always told by Joeys, Riverview etc. that almost all of their teams start in Year 7, it will have no effect on them because we all know that they never bring in rugby talent.

 

[Quick Hands]

Elite school in turmoil: the team no one wants to play

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/educ...nts-to-play-20130923-2uadp.html#ixzz2fkGn6Qad


College accused of 'buying' team with scholarships

http://www.smh.com.au/national/educ...ng-team-with-scholarships-20130923-2uabj.html

I think it's fair to say that the heat is now well and truly on.

 

[Quick Hands]

From the horse's mouth..

"The King's School headmaster Tim Hawkes admits most schools, including his, ''have offered inducements to a few good sportsmen''.
''Schools have long learnt the rhetoric needed to defend the deliberate importation of gifted sportsmen,'' he said. ''The practice can be disguised in so many ways"."

in the 20/09 smh article.

I assume that he's talking about the "boy X was always coming to the school" but came suddenly because:
grandparents won the lottery/drought breaking rain/windfall to family trust from coal seam gas find etc.
Coincidentally these changes in circumstance and sudden arrival usually follow some sort of representative rugby/other sports carnival.

 

[Maccasley]

not surprised

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Funny thing in a relatively broad reaching article is almost no specific mention of rugby.

Are the Journos keeping this for the second wave of articles?

 

[Lindommer]

IS i understand your point, however as HJ has gone on to mention, with any legitimate agreement, there will be creative work, such as the age old one athletes getting a triangle scholarship (it has happened, and also on an academic level). Even to the extent of a legitamate 3rd party paying for a talented athlete to attend the school (happened at kings a few years behind me in the late 90's), where do you draw the line. Wealthy parents paying for another taltend person not so well off to attend and bulk up the schools 1sts? Busary scholarships, set up through benefactor donations specifically to bring less advanataged people to the school. All schoosl have bursary, why cant those kids also be talented athletes? This one is a pandoras box unfortunately, which is why i think the accusations are a load of garbage.

As i mentioned there are 2 realistic pathways, ban all scholarships, or open slather. If any scholarship is legitimate, you will find that the musicians, will all of a sudden (gasp in suspense) be talented athletes.

Schools want to win, it is good for the image/brand/environment of the school. Ask any headmaster if they would like to win, they will all say yes, so while an opportunity is available, creativity will exists.

They can embrace or bomb it, there call!

Buster, it's a shame King's didn't put as much work into your spelling, it's atrocious. Can your parents ask for their fees to be refunded?

 

[Ted S]

People have to face a couple of realities, most issues that arise from scholarships are caused by 2 things.
A schools first XV doing well and parents like me whose kids missed out on scholarships so we have to pay lots of money.

Most of the scholarships people are whinging about, esp at SCots are only 1/2 or less.

Basically they are there everyone is doing it, so suck it up. If your kid is not good enough for a scholarship (as in my case) or your school is rubbish at picking scholarship candidates well thats just bad luck.

 

[Brian Westlake]

Nothing will happen.
Scots will promise to play nicely in the future,but will present their " independent" report that confirms no scholarships.
The other Sçhools will not challenge it,because to do so will open a Pandora's box, that will put pressure on more of these Principals and could threaten some of their careers.
Remember the golden rule,in the horse race of life,always back self interest.

As it said, a 3 day investigation... That'll get a lot out in the open. A couple of sacrificial lambs in basketball and nothing else reviewed. And then, as is always the case, the word " organic " comes out again.

 

[Brian Westlake]

Funny thing in a relatively broad reaching article is almost no specific mention of rugby.

Are the Journos keeping this for the second wave of articles?

HJ,
Is this being served with a nice dose of cynicism? How uncouth...

 

[Quick Hands]

Funny thing in a relatively broad reaching article is almost no specific mention of rugby.

Are the Journos keeping this for the second wave of articles?

I think it's reasonable to assume that there will be more to come. 4 journos involved in the articles, the picture and story led the front page, plus a double spread across pages 4 and 5.

It's certainly upped the ante as they say. Will be more difficult for the gang of 5 to back away now I would have thought.

Interestingly, I noted that Dr Lamberts "independent review" wasn't aimed at finding the truth, but "to ensure that there are no areas of concern".

 

[Buster]

Buster, it's a shame King's didn't put as much work into your spelling, it's atrocious. Can your parents ask for their fees to be refunded?

My apologies Lindommer, My peptide infused rage at watching my old alma mater being dragged through the mud got me a bit hot under the collar.

Dear old Ma and Pa would be most unimpressed with my spelling, however they would be a whole lot more disappointed that they had to pay full fees for my schooling life. Everyone else apparently got their schooling for free!!

Interesting that Dr Hawkes is happy to admit his school has done the same thing in the past, yet now isn't happy about it. I have said it before and will continue to say it, it can get ugly when you throw big stones from a brittle glass house!!!

We live in interesting times!

 

[Hugh Jarse]

People have to face a couple of realities, most issues that arise from scholarships are caused by 2 things.
A schools first XV doing well and parents like me whose kids missed out on scholarships so we have to pay lots of money.

Most of the scholarships people are whinging about, esp at SCots are only 1/2 or less.

Basically they are there everyone is doing it, so suck it up. If your kid is not good enough for a scholarship (as in my case) or your school is rubbish at picking scholarship candidates well thats just bad luck.

There is a lot of common sense in what you report Ted S.

Unfortunately the AAGPS Heads have agreed to abide to a code of conduct that excludes this behaviour. It is fairly common knowledge (and admitted to by one of the "gang of 5" accusing Scots) that the code is observed more in the breach, than compliance.

If the majority of the schools do not comply with the code of conduct, then perhaps it is time to change the code of conduct to something that all the AAGPS schools will comply with.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

I wonder if Scots, Dr Lambert is related to Monty Python's Mr Lambert?

That Mr Lambert had an issue with mathematics.

 

[lincoln]

If Scots' programme is so pure why have they not dominated swimming and rowing, two disciplines perfect for the dark arts of sports science?

 

[lincoln]

Funny thing in a relatively broad reaching article is almost no specific mention of rugby.

Are the Journos keeping this for the second wave of articles?

Agree, there was only one journo on the St John's College story and that played out for a long time.

 

[Quick Hands]

Interesting that Dr Hawkes is happy to admit his school has done the same thing in the past, yet now isn't happy about it. I have said it before and will continue to say it, it can get ugly when you throw big stones from a brittle glass house!!!

We live in interesting times!

Perhaps Dr Hawkes and the others have had a Road to Damascus like conversion. Maybe this has been the result of seeing where this is all heading when taken to the nth degree.

When schools slip a couple of boys in, no-one really notices that much, then the schools getting beaten bring 4 or 5 in, this process keeps escalating until we get to whole teams being brought in, lop-sided scores bordering on humiliation, safetly issues, self-esteem issues etc. (I hope people noted the words of Richard Fletcher on the importance of sport in the whole development of adolescent boys)

Faced with the choice of letting things continue on the present course, or ruling a line under it, admitting past fault and trying to return to some sort of normality. I actually think it's encouraging that Dr Hawkes has admitted past fault instead of pedalling the "it's everyone else but us line" that many schools trot out.
Admitting there is a problem and acknowledging your role in it is a prerequisiste to solving the problem.

Show me a man who can't acknowledge past fault and I'll show you a man who isn't true to himself.

 

[Paddogreen]

Funny thing in a relatively broad reaching article is almost no specific mention of rugby.

Are the Journos keeping this for the second wave of articles?

I have heard that the same 'New Boy' criteria for used for basketball did not put the gang of 5 in a good light wrt Rugby. i.e The number boys in firsts or seconds who joined after year 9 : TSC-7, NC-14, in comparison to SJC-10, TKS-10, SIC-8, Shore-5.
Interesting that Grammar joined the North Shore, bit like Penrith leading the charge against Sydney Uni...

 

[Quick Hands]

I have heard that the same 'New Boy' criteria for used for basketball did not put the gang of 5 in a good light wrt Rugby. i.e The number boys in firsts or seconds who joined after year 9 : TSC-7, NC-14, in comparison to SJC-10, TKS-10, SIC-8, Shore-5.
Interesting that Grammar joined the North Shore, bit like Penrith leading the charge against Sydney Uni.

The most interesting thing for me was that High weren't part of the group, basketball being their most popular and successful sport.

Your stats on rugby 1sts/2nds don't really surprise (unfortunately).

 

[Quick Hands]

Interesting that all mention of sport has been removed from the TSC website.