Sydney Colts - 2014

[trevor cork]

First cut was advised this morning. Any names?

My info was that only a small number were cut (5or6) so you would assume they were minor names, also, they are trialing again this Sat. in the same teams as last Sat. ie NSW Blue and White, I think that this weeks 3rd team is a Randwick grade team who I believe is playing the extended Waratah players where some of the u20's may get a further trial.
Shouldn't there be a seperate thread for this U20 talk,?? as it has a fair time to run upto the world cup in June.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

My info was that only a small number were cut (5or6) so you would assume they were minor names, also, they are trialing again this Sat. in the same teams as last Sat. ie NSW Blue and White, I think that this weeks 3rd team is a Randwick grade team who I believe is playing the extended Waratah players where some of the u20's may get a further trial.
Shouldn't there be a seperate thread for this U20 talk,?? as it has a fair time to run upto the world cup in June.

Try this thread to discuss U20's and the preparation for the Jnr RWC.

http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/co...world-championship-–-new-zealand.13567/page-2

 

[Tah and feathered]

Good performance by Souths colts winning the Plate final at the 7s on Saturday with good win over Easts, Penrith and Gordon grade sides
Only losing to Parramatta who they had to play after a 20 minute break.

 

[Wazza2013]

Good performance by Souths colts winning the Plate final at the 7s on Saturday with good win over Easts, Penrith and Gordon grade sides
Only losing to Parramatta who they had to play after a 20 minute break.

Well done Souths colts , very Impressive result.

 

[the baz]

Bit of info if anyone knows - do all sydney clubs field 3 colts teams? If not, are there generally any that dont?

 

[Done that]

For a few years Parramatta fielded 2 teams but last year did field 3 teams.
Penrith usually start the season with 2 teams,but end with 1 .
Warringah on occasions have forfeited 3rd grade colts in the recent past.
Last year Gordon fielded only one team.
All clubs are supposed to field 3 colts teams & 4 grade teams, as a requirement to participate in the
Sydey competition.
Clearly this is honored more in the breach than in the observance.

 

[pine cone 3]

Can anyone shed any light on Sydney Rugby's apparent cock up of the Colts points system. In someone's haste to sting University it would appear they have stuffed up the other 11 clubs even more. As It has been explained to me, many colts who have played juniors for their district for years are now going to have their points rating doubled while the team points is lowered. How does this help Gordon, Penrith or other clubs if players who have played a number of 1st grade games in their first year are penalised when they back up the next year or year after again?

If they want to spread the talent then tell clubs they are only able to register a set number of players of national or state schoolboy achievement with no exceptions or discounts.

As a starting point you could start with no more than 3 players from the previous years schools "A" teams. Allow another couple of state reps and then also apply a points rating to Colts teams.

As an example, each year there are 46 players chosen for NSW Schools. If each club were allowed 4 players each that would distribute fairly evenly. But also take into account that some go on to National selection which thins the pool a little more. Outside of this pool is open to any club. Interstate players would be considered the same as NSW reps.

Is it too much to ask that the dopes at the SRU won't blow the games legs off as they continue to shoot themselves in the foot?

 

[Dave Beat]

Can anyone shed any light on Sydney Rugby's apparent cock up of the Colts points system. In someone's haste to sting University it would appear they have stuffed up the other 11 clubs even more. As It has been explained to me, many colts who have played juniors for their district for years are now going to have their points rating doubled while the team points is lowered. How does this help Gordon, Penrith or other clubs if players who have played a number of 1st grade games in their first year are penalised when they back up the next year or year after again?

If they want to spread the talent then tell clubs they are only able to register a set number of players of national or state schoolboy achievement with no exceptions or discounts.

As a starting point you could start with no more than 3 players from the previous years schools "A" teams. Allow another couple of state reps and then also apply a points rating to Colts teams.

As an example, each year there are 46 players chosen for NSW Schools. If each club were allowed 4 players each that would distribute fairly evenly. But also take into account that some go on to National selection which thins the pool a little more. Outside of this pool is open to any club. Interstate players would be considered the same as NSW reps.

Is it too much to ask that the dopes at the SRU won't blow the games legs off as they continue to shoot themselves in the foot?

I don't have a solution, and can also understand your frustration.
I don't like your idea - reason - let's say your boy played all his junior rugby at a district club and they had a really strong team, and they were all good mates.
This could actually happen on the North Shore quite easily and has over the years. Come colts your boy is told - sorry you cant play for Gordon or with your mates. It results in him getting pissed off and going to league.

Uni can offer what other clubs have difficulty in offering. Don't have s solution though.

But for clubs who look after and work with their village clubs - good luck to them, they keep their players!!

 

[Crashy]

cant see a player going to Loig on the north shore! Most likely head to subbies where there are 8 clubs with a colts team.

 

[pine cone 3]

I take your point about the mates thing but the only way to stop a disproportionate number of young elite players all turning up at 1 or 2 clubs is to limit the ability of those clubs to register all of the group.

The previous rules have been too easily avoided with dispensations given to players as local product when they mysteriously moved from village clubs in the North Shore to inner city clubs at age 16 and then signed on for 2 minutes of game time on a Friday night.

Good luck if your administration is smart enough to circumnavigate the poorly policed policy in place. It would be nice however to think that with all the connections that the rugby networks hold that someone could cobble together something that showed an element of common sense in dealing with the imbalance of talent distribution that is current. The SRU don't seem capable of it.

 

[Dave Beat]

I take your point about the mates thing but the only way to stop a disproportionate number of young elite players all turning up at 1 or 2 clubs is to limit the ability of those clubs to register all of the group.

I'm very favorable of the clubs who put in the time, effort and acknowledge the grass roots from within their village area - and it would be wrong if that hard work wasn't rewarded through colts and then grade as the players mature.

In some cases that work and effort may even attract interest from a wider area - I call that return on hard work.

One of the benefits or rewards for developing and working with the juniors is the discounted points that is then applied to juniors who come through the ranks.

Haven't pulled out the calculator, or seen team sheets - but reading this thread could someone assist with points accrued for Randwick colts?

 

[Jaghond]

Dave,

That presumes the (Grade) Club has put in some hard yards along the way with the Village Club (s).....if not, then I don't believe that they should cry "foul" when Village Club Juniors exiting that system vote with their feet...

I am also a strong believer in the "Play wth your mates" syndrome, mentioned somewhere above I think. Goes to show that having a bit of fun with your mates at a Club can be a powerful incentive - regardless of whether they are all playing in the same team or not.

This was certainly one of the attractions at Subbies Clubs in the past.....

 

[Crashy]

Gordon apparently trialling with 3 colts teams against the Rats this weekend.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

<snip>
Haven't pulled out the calculator, or seen team sheets - but reading this thread could someone assist with points accrued for Randwick colts?

2013 Aust Schoolboys are worth 6 points. 2013 NSW Schoolboys are worth 4 points (might be two - going from memory).

Judging by banter on this thread and the Wicks own web page where that boasted of Kellaway, Deegan, Short, and a couple of others who to the best of my knowledge are new to Wicks, they will have to be very careful with their points, or have to play some of them in Grade.

I think there was 5 Aust Schoolboys (Vuni Fifita is still at New this year) as well as Kellaway, N. That makes 5 x 6 (Aust Schoolbooys) + 4 for at least 1 NSW Schoolboy = 34 points. Colts 1 were previously capped at 40 points. Not much space of the other 9 boys in the team. Guess they would have to be very loyal local juniors.

I have heard that the rationale for calculating points has changed/will change this year. Perhaps the Wicks knew changes were in the wind?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Gordon apparently trialling with 3 colts teams against the Rats this weekend.

That is great news and reflects the blood sweat and tears of the Gordon Committee and Volunteers.

We need full playing rosters at all clubs.

Anyone got an update on how the Emu's recruiting is going? IIRC, they were one team short last year, and their Colts 1 team was a little undergunned.

 

[Dave Beat]

I have heard that the rationale for calculating points has changed/will change this year. Perhaps the Wicks knew changes were in the wind?

Well that is interesting, what could / would one think?

 

[Tah and feathered]

My understanding of colts points is NSW schoolboys , Aust A and Aust schoolboys are all 6 points.
1st colts are 35 and 2nd colts 30
I know 1 club were able to keep a local AUST schoolboy from you know who club because they probably couldn't play him in 1 sts

 

[pine cone 3]

My understanding is that a player returning for a second year in colt's who played 50% of his games in first grade is now rated at 4 points, only 2 less than an Australian schools player. Teams trying to build through younger players will be forced to push players up to grade to avoid cap pressure. Where is the duty of care SRU?

It's a great thing when clubs without rep players have the same point levels as a club full of them because they brought them in and develop them through a couple of years in colts.

Teams that had single digit point tallies in 2013 will now be borderline in the high 30's while clubs who were on the limit will still have the same tallies. That works? not.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

So the likes of Penrith who were belted from pillar to post last year will find themselves with a team full of "points cap" rock stars, if last years Colts 1 "rookies" back up this year?

Hmmmm.

 

[Tah and feathered]

So the likes of Penrith who were belted from pillar to post last year will find themselves with a team full of "points cap" rock stars, if last years Colts 1 "rookies" back up this year?

Hmmmm.

It's all about local juniors, if any player at any level is a local he is zero points
Finding the balance between locals and imports is the key
This is why Uni now approach players at the 16s nationals and boarding school players in particular and sign them up to play for Canterbury knowing they will never play a game as there school plays Saturdays and when they go to colts they are locals. In the end all this points crap and the paperwork nightmare is all because on Uni.