Wallabies - a changing of the guard

[Braveheart81]

I'll say it first, McKenzie to keep the status quo of not choosing QC (Quade Cooper) as his premier 10. Maybe To'omua, Lilo or even KB (Kurtley Beale), with QC (Quade Cooper) may be a tad too spicy for the test arena. and inconsistent.

I doubt it. I think McKenzie has well and truly played his cards in the lead up to being announced as coach and that is that he would select Cooper as his 10.

He really has no other option. Unless Cooper got injured in the next couple of weeks I don't see how he could pick a debutant 10 ahead of Cooper.

Beale is probably the only other player that he could potentially go with but I doubt he will.

 

[Pfitzy]

Halfback - Genia
Backup - White
Easy picks there. No discussion required

Flyhalf - Cooper
Backup - To'omua
Now, as a Tahs fan, I typed Foley before To'omua, but then I realised you need two types of flyhalf depending on the opponent, and Foley is too close to Cooper in terms of attacking skill, even though he's a better defender and runner of the ball. Cooper's wide passing is critical to opening up gaps, but whoever his new coach is needs to get him past this issue of being able to tackle low and hard. He can't do it, whether its a mental block or something bad happened as a kid, its not like he's protecting his good looks.

Inside Centre - Lealiifano
Backup - Horne
Again, we have two different types of player for two different types of approach. Lilo I think works well as the straight man to Cooper's class clown, taking the pressure kicks or delivering the ball from pressure. Horne has been sublime for the Tahs this year, running off the same type of flyhalf as Cooper. Variety is the spice of life. Note that for the EOYT I'd be taking Godwin as 10/12 cover as well.

Outside Centre - AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
Backup - Inman
The first bloke picks himself. The second guy has really impressed me this year. Big, aggressive, and running some nice lines - particularly when the two amigos aren't calling the shots in the Rebels. Krudrani is there or thereabouts but IMHO he suffers from the Brumbies' limited attack in the second half of the S15. Good player though and great defensive read.

Left Wing - Cummins
Backup - Dom Shipperley
The Honey Badger deserved more of a shot based on what he produced on EOYT and how positive his impact is for the Force. Shipperley is also a great player and needs time with the squad to add the role of Test winger to his Reds style of play.

Right Wing - Folau
Backup - Crawford.
Yes, two Waratahs in these positions. But they have both had good years. is Speight unlucky to miss out? At this point in time, yes, but he has residency issues to clear up.

Fullback - Mogg
Backup - Morahan
Surprised? Yes I was a little when I came to this conclusion, but I considered the other options and went for boots capable of clearing the line, and safety under the high ball as priorities. Its a total bonus that both players are also good on the counter attack.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Pfitzy Don't think Inman is test match standard and haven't seen enough of Crawford in S15 to be convinced - mind you in his case he does seem to lift to the level required when he's brought up from the level below. Didnt really look like a s15 player in club last year.
Tapuai needs another chance at this level before being discarded.
I thiknk your Cooper To'omua point is a very good one and To'omua's defence means he can readily play 12.

 

[Pfitzy]

Don't think Inman is test match standard and haven't seen enough of Crawford in S15 to be convinced - mind you in his case he does seem to lift to the level required when he's brought up from the level below. Didnt really look like a s15 player in club last year.[/quote]


I understand your points on both of them, but you never know until you know, right?

This is the "right now" form squad. For EOYT development options need to be looked at e.g. Godwin.

 

[Tomikin]

Now it's said that history doesn't repeat but it often rhymes and we may be looking at a similar situation to that which followed the loss to the Lions in 1989. I recall listening to an interview with Nick Farr-Jones, who indicated that our G&GR favourite son Bob Dwyer initiated a clean out in Wallaby ranks that set us on the path to winning the RWC, Bleddie and all manner of other silverware over the next 3-4 years. So Braveheart, I agree with the premise of your original post and expand on it below.

There are some blokes whose role in the Wallaby set up will change, some who will miss out altogether and others who will step up and become significant players. In terms of the incumbents whose days might be numbered:

Ben Alexander -- as a prop your primary role in the team is to scrummage and he got shown up badly on the weekend. I think he's done his reputation some pretty serious harm and it would be a long road back now.

Kane Douglas -- I hope not, but his impact on the game in tests 2 and 3 wasn't great enough. We need someone of his kind of make up to partner Horwill and I hope it's him, but he will need to step up again and demand selection.

Wycliff Palu -- I've said before that the concept of Cliffy is often better than the reality and I wonder if he might getting to the end of the road. I think the big fella on his day provides great impact, but he's been broken a lot in the last couple of years and I still feel he goes missing in big games.

James O'Connor -- it's not all his fault. The selection at 10 for this series was almost universally slammed by all and sundry here at G&GR and the three tests showed that it's just not his best position. Much like Horan being shoe horned in at 10 by Greg Smith, it's not worked and harmed the other players in the backline. What he does have to take responsibility for, however, is his perceived attitude and behaviour problems. The fact that the Rebels now don't want him must be a huge concern over his future.

Pat McCabe -- firstly it's his health. He's had a couple of pretty serious neck injuries and I question if he can come back a second time. He's got ticker in spades so you'd never rule it out. The biggest problem McCabe has is that like JOC (James O'Connor), he's been played out of position. He's not a test 12. I think he's got the potential to be a good test 13 or wing.

Berrick Barnes -- see McCabe. I feel for Berrick. He's had so many head knocks now that I think someone needs to tap him on the shoulder and say mate for the sake of your health and your family hang up the boots.

Kurtley Beale -- like JOC (James O'Connor), there are significant questions over KB (Kurtley Beale). His off field struggles are well known and we don't even know where he'll be playing next year. Huge, huge talent but also like JOC (James O'Connor) he has some maturing to do.

In terms of guys who could come into serious contention with a changing of the guard:

Scott Sio
Hugh Pyle
Kyle Godwin
Matt To'omua
Rob Horne reborn as a test 12

Scott Fardy and Sam Carter (Brumbies Hat on).

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I understand your points on both of them, but you never know until you know, right?

This is the "right now" form squad. For EOYT development options need to be looked at e.g. Godwin.

I Like Godwin on the little I've seen of him. What about this fullback at the rebels - he's a kiwi I know but has he got some backdoor eligibility for the wobblies?
And I know what you mean - I was a little dubious about Mogg, particularly as i thought his form had slipped a little with the Brums, but i think he showed that he is a bloke who rises to the occasion.

 

[Beefcake]

I doubt it. I think McKenzie has well and truly played his cards in the lead up to being announced as coach and that is that he would select Cooper as his 10.

He really has no other option. Unless Cooper got injured in the next couple of weeks I don't see how he could pick a debutant 10 ahead of Cooper.

Beale is probably the only other player that he could potentially go with but I doubt he will.

I view it differently, whilst he's been at the forefront of change at the reds in getting the best from the QLD talent pool, I'll suggest from periods where QC (Quade Cooper) has been injured, he has tended to go with an unremarkable yet analytically skilled 10 i.e. Harris and Lucas... Either way happy no backroom deals were done to overlook him...

 

[ACT Crusader]

I Like Godwin on the little I've seen of him. What about this fullback at the rebels - he's a kiwi I know but has he got some backdoor eligibility for the wobblies?
And I know what you mean - I was a little dubious about Mogg, particularly as i thought his form had slipped a little with the Brums, but i think he showed that he is a bloke who rises to the occasion.

Jason Woodward. Played for our juniors. He must be only 22-23. A biggish unit for a fullback. A lot of NZers were very surprised when he left given there was a lot of promise base on ITM form.

 

[No4918]

I view it differently, whilst he's been at the forefront of change at the reds in getting the best from the QLD talent pool, I'll suggest from periods where QC (Quade Cooper) has been injured, he has tended to go with an unremarkable yet analytically skilled 10 i.e. Harris and Lucas. Either way happy no backroom deals were done to overlook him.

What other options did he have at the time?

 

[Sparky]

I would love to see link groom cooper as a 15!

 

[Tomikin]

I would love to see link groom cooper as a 15!

Why we don't need him as a 15, His a 10. We have Mogg, Izzy and Beale as 15. Coopers going to play 10 at the Reds not 15 just leave him be.

Same with Beale if his playing 10 next year let him play 10 and pick someone playing 15 at 15..

 

[Sparky]

Not necessarily straight away, but to add versatility to his game, and groom toomau as a 10.

 

[Tomikin]

Not necessarily straight away, but to add versatility to his game, and groom toomau as a 10.

I would love to see how they go in the Finals before making my selection. Maybe it could help Cooper playing 15 but I really only see him as a 10. I think Mogg should start to be Groomed at 15 off the bench through the the rugby championships. Slowly slowly and then end of season give him some games his boot and pace is exactly what we need at the back.

But if Link decides to pick Cooper will he shuffle him to FB in defence because Mogg probably aint going to be fullback then

 

[ACT Crusader]

Not necessarily straight away, but to add versatility to his game, and groom toomau as a 10.

How would he be "groomed" by Link. He won't have controls at what happens with Quade at super level. So if he plays 10 at Super level, Link would have to select him out of position. Haven't we seen that song sheet before and it would be the cause of vehement outrage.....

 

[Sparky]

It's fair to say quade spends 50% of his game at the reds at fullback, he defends at set pieces and in general play. I think he could easily play 15 to accommodate toomau at 10. If QC (Quade Cooper) does get pick at 10 o'connor or Beale will be the 15, someone who can defend in the line. With mogg, he should get one of the flanks, he's kicking and speed is second to none and I agree, he won't play 15 with quade at 10

 

[Scotty]

I suspect we won't see Beale and JOC (James O'Connor) for a while. I have heard they both went out to late on Saturday and may have been involved in an incident which is being covered up. That is three issues in three weeks. Surely enough is enough?!

 

[Loki74]

Scott Fardy and Sam Carter (Brumbies Hat on).

Speight.

 

[Scotty]

It's fair to say quade spends 50% of his game at the reds at fullback, he defends at set pieces and in general play. I think he could easily play 15 to accommodate toomau at 10. If QC (Quade Cooper) does get pick at 10 o'connor or Beale will be the 15, someone who can defend in the line. With mogg, he should get one of the flanks, he's kicking and speed is second to none and I agree, he won't play 15 with quade at 10

I disagree. I fully expect to see Cooper at 10 and Mogg at 15. Cooper to drop back on occasion to be the fourth man at the back to help launch the counter like Carter does for the ABs.

I could also see Link going for Mowen at 8 and Quirk or MMM at 6 vs the ABs. Palu might come back in against the Boks.

 

[Gnostic]

When considering the new scrum laws coming in I think we can assume that Moore will remain first choice Hooker this year. But looking forward the skill set will change as to what is required and we may well see the old type Hooker make a come back. Somebody able to lift a foot and actually hook the ball. This will require a change in props as well.

When I think about the attributed that these changes might bring I consider that perhaps S. Fainga'a may well come into his own at 2 and that perhaps it is a pity that these changes come a few seasons too late for Adam Frier.

I can see Robinson retaining his spot backed up by Sio, and Slipper and Kepu fighting for the THP spot, with Slipper starting on the back of a better work rate and consistent application. I would also suggest that we may see comebacks from props like Holmes who I think are very under rated. Alexander in my opinion may well have seen his last game at THP and he is a long way down the pecking order at LHP.

 

[Brumbieman]

There's been some comment around about Mogg's cameo and how he should now be the starting full back. It wasn't the break he made that highlighted his potential, it was his kicking game. We struggled to get out of our quarter, particularly from deep kick offs, often resulting in Lions line-out ball 35-40 metres out. It's where a lot of their points resulted, either penalties or when we didn't find touch, the late tries.

Mogg's general play kicks we're the only ones by the Wallabies in the entire series that found deep open space. His first penalty touch finder had 15-20 metres on any of Beale's pathetic efforts, including one on the opposite side of the field minutes later. Sure he failed to find touch towards the desperate end, but FFS who can't see the value of a FB with a big accurate boot (incl. long range penalties), with an electric turn of pace. OK not the finished article in defence and ball retention, but at least worth working with.

I'm fed up with us having the likes of Beale, O'Connor, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) at the back with their limited kicking games. You don't see our main rivals getting themselves in deep shit regularly by having weak kickers at the back.

Careful mate, don't call too loudly for a fullback to have a massive accurate boot, it will cause people to accuse you of bias and man love