wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
Not good enough, apparently.
Super Rugby Rd 3: Brumbies v Waratahs in Canberra
- Thread starter Lindommer
- Start date
Not good enough, apparently.
Pfitzy
George Gregan (70)
Defence and tackling, ball security. To bang the drum again: he's not the biggest kid on the park any more, and needs to re-forge his core skill set.
Silverado
Dick Tooth (41)
Rennie seems pretty keen on Swinton too. There really are some quality players there
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
Yeh don’t know why didn’t mention Swinton. Back row depth across the country indeed looking impressive. I also think gamble has been superb and really great to see he is finally realising his potential. In some ways hoopers absence a blessing to have allowed him the opportunity to show what he can offer. Tizzano would be better going back to the force as going to find it hard to find game time when hooper is back.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
That is why seeming him in sevens seemed a good place for him
Brumby Runner
David Wilson (68)
Gamble looks better with every game. Had some impressive moments in last night's game. Not sure about Tizzano getting more game time in Perth. Kane Koteka is going just fine imo. Rebels could do with some extra fire power I guess. Have to say I haven't really noticed Hooper's absence at the Tahs this year.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
I was thinking as backup for koteka. But maybe yes rebels could also be good destination for Tizzano.
Dctarget
John Eales (66)
Only got to watch the extended highlights but looks like the Wallaby regulars are standing up which is promising. Ikitau's defensive reads were brilliant, snuffed out multiple attacks instantly. Perese looks immense too, good battle of 13s. Valetini still runs like a freight train, good stuff.
Tomikin
Simon Poidevin (60)
He wasn't there last year either
KOB1987
Rod McCall (65)
You'll notice it when he returns to the field. Point taken though, Gamble has filled the gap pretty well.
Brumby Runner
David Wilson (68)
My point exactly, KOB.
propsarespeedy
Ted Thorn (20)
last thing i saw he was playing tahs second team.
propsarespeedy
Ted Thorn (20)
agreed, harris and valentini both have been that good throughout the 3 rounds, valentini is such a strong ball runner especially near the line and I reckon Harris has been a dominant force for the tahs especially with the ball.
What can I say about this match which hasn't already been said. I follow my beloved Tahs to Brisbane, Canberra and Melbourne most years (but not recently due to the bushfires and pandemic) and last night was no exception. A wet drive down and back.
The match
My seat was very high up on the western side, a long way from the field which was slightly obscured by light spray, I may not've seen everything perfectly clearly. GIO's a crap stadium, the sooner the ACT government bites the bullet and builds a decent indoor stadium the better, preferably on the current pool site in Civic.
Losing Williams and Cridge, and then Turner, certainly hurt the Tahs' continuity after last week's close loss. Cridge is one of the Tahs' best forwards this year along with Bell, HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes), Gamble and, surprisingly, Harris. Add Swinton, Hanigan, Hooper, Holloway, Williams and one or two reasonable backups and that's a respectable pack. The Brumbies are a much more settled side and it showed from the kickoff, they knew who was doing what and where.
I though Donaldson tried to be a bit too cute and/or smart last week; those two chip kicks to the outside backs were pointless, and that last wide pass to Turner to, hopefully, win the match was bordering on incompetent. All Ben had to do was put the ball through the hands, draw and pass and go over. Last night, I imagine after the backs coach boxed his ears, Donaldson played a much simpler meat-and-potatoes match on a heavy pitch. He should stick to this style and perfect it before attempting anything fancy.
The Brumbies back-row were magnificent; Valetini is a monster and was, deservedly, man-of-the match. I was talking to a couple of Brumbies supporters next to me and asked them what they reckon were the best positions for Valetini and Samu, there was no agreement among them where they were best suited so they agreed the coach knows best. To my eye they both look like blindside breakaways, but what would I know. We all agreed they both must be in the 15 somewhere.
Bell and HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) are developing nicely, their scrummaging can't be faulted and their overall play is coming along beautifully. They can now run, pass and truck the ball up as good as any other Oz props. And they can both tackle.
Harris has been one of the good news stories for the Tahs this year. I thought we might struggle at 8 after Wells took the sombrero, but Will has shown a mental toughness which is delightful to watch.
The referee
First of all I'd like to declare I've been a fan of Nic Berry for quite some time. To my, former ref's, eyes last night wasn't one of his better games, and that's not just because the Tahs lost.
As a so-so back I know bugger all about the dark arts of the front row, so I bow to those who know better. One is my brother from Wagga, an astute judge of forward play, and last night he was surprised Slipper wasn't pulled up for slipping his bind and turning in. He reckoned the Tahs' were scrummaging straight and should have been awarded most, if not all, of those early scrum penalties. He also reckoned White was standing on the Tahs side and feeding at a very acute angle (don't all scrummies cheat like that?). The other is Pfitzy here on G&GR. Nick was mainly in agreement with my brother on the Brumbies' pigs shenanigans. So, the Brumbies props WERE infringing.
Years ago when I reffed I used to hand some old lag standing around a piece of cardboard and a pen and ask him to note penalties, scrums and free kicks awarded to both sides set out in a column. At half time and full-time I checked how I was going to ensure I wasn't watching one side to the detriment of the other. It's a very human fault to take exception to one side/player or other and watch them/him closely all match. A lop-sided penalty count is always a point of concern, especially if it's in favour of the home side. Last night's count was 14-9 the Brumbies' way, although their backrow were hard on the ball most of the match. Many of those penalties just didn't look even-handed to me, particularly those five in a row late in the match on my side. It'd be interesting to know what Berry's referee assessor made of his performance.
One thing I will chip Berry about was his time-keeping: his signalling of time off for stoppages was appalling. Twice in the first half the clock ran off 40 seconds because he hadn't put his arm up when players were being attended to. I reckon the match lost about five minutes overall because of Nic's sloppiness on this point, not good enough.
The future
So far this year the Tahs' forwards have held their own with the Reds and Brumbies; the backs haven't. There's still no ensemble play and support between the inner and outer backs and I'm not convinced the best players have been selected. Foketi never fails to disappoint and the wingers don't know how to finish. One gem in the Tahs' backline is Perese, dunno whom I'd select for the gold 13 jumper out of Izaia and Len Ikitau.
Running the Brumbies to a seven point loss in Canberra was, on one level, disappointing. Considering we were utter shite last year and had some injuries all week to overcome it was an encouraging performance. If/when we have a reasonably fit list and a few more games under our belt we'll be competitive with anyone.
The match
My seat was very high up on the western side, a long way from the field which was slightly obscured by light spray, I may not've seen everything perfectly clearly. GIO's a crap stadium, the sooner the ACT government bites the bullet and builds a decent indoor stadium the better, preferably on the current pool site in Civic.
Losing Williams and Cridge, and then Turner, certainly hurt the Tahs' continuity after last week's close loss. Cridge is one of the Tahs' best forwards this year along with Bell, HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes), Gamble and, surprisingly, Harris. Add Swinton, Hanigan, Hooper, Holloway, Williams and one or two reasonable backups and that's a respectable pack. The Brumbies are a much more settled side and it showed from the kickoff, they knew who was doing what and where.
I though Donaldson tried to be a bit too cute and/or smart last week; those two chip kicks to the outside backs were pointless, and that last wide pass to Turner to, hopefully, win the match was bordering on incompetent. All Ben had to do was put the ball through the hands, draw and pass and go over. Last night, I imagine after the backs coach boxed his ears, Donaldson played a much simpler meat-and-potatoes match on a heavy pitch. He should stick to this style and perfect it before attempting anything fancy.
The Brumbies back-row were magnificent; Valetini is a monster and was, deservedly, man-of-the match. I was talking to a couple of Brumbies supporters next to me and asked them what they reckon were the best positions for Valetini and Samu, there was no agreement among them where they were best suited so they agreed the coach knows best. To my eye they both look like blindside breakaways, but what would I know. We all agreed they both must be in the 15 somewhere.
Bell and HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) are developing nicely, their scrummaging can't be faulted and their overall play is coming along beautifully. They can now run, pass and truck the ball up as good as any other Oz props. And they can both tackle.
Harris has been one of the good news stories for the Tahs this year. I thought we might struggle at 8 after Wells took the sombrero, but Will has shown a mental toughness which is delightful to watch.
The referee
First of all I'd like to declare I've been a fan of Nic Berry for quite some time. To my, former ref's, eyes last night wasn't one of his better games, and that's not just because the Tahs lost.
As a so-so back I know bugger all about the dark arts of the front row, so I bow to those who know better. One is my brother from Wagga, an astute judge of forward play, and last night he was surprised Slipper wasn't pulled up for slipping his bind and turning in. He reckoned the Tahs' were scrummaging straight and should have been awarded most, if not all, of those early scrum penalties. He also reckoned White was standing on the Tahs side and feeding at a very acute angle (don't all scrummies cheat like that?). The other is Pfitzy here on G&GR. Nick was mainly in agreement with my brother on the Brumbies' pigs shenanigans. So, the Brumbies props WERE infringing.
Years ago when I reffed I used to hand some old lag standing around a piece of cardboard and a pen and ask him to note penalties, scrums and free kicks awarded to both sides set out in a column. At half time and full-time I checked how I was going to ensure I wasn't watching one side to the detriment of the other. It's a very human fault to take exception to one side/player or other and watch them/him closely all match. A lop-sided penalty count is always a point of concern, especially if it's in favour of the home side. Last night's count was 14-9 the Brumbies' way, although their backrow were hard on the ball most of the match. Many of those penalties just didn't look even-handed to me, particularly those five in a row late in the match on my side. It'd be interesting to know what Berry's referee assessor made of his performance.
One thing I will chip Berry about was his time-keeping: his signalling of time off for stoppages was appalling. Twice in the first half the clock ran off 40 seconds because he hadn't put his arm up when players were being attended to. I reckon the match lost about five minutes overall because of Nic's sloppiness on this point, not good enough.
The future
So far this year the Tahs' forwards have held their own with the Reds and Brumbies; the backs haven't. There's still no ensemble play and support between the inner and outer backs and I'm not convinced the best players have been selected. Foketi never fails to disappoint and the wingers don't know how to finish. One gem in the Tahs' backline is Perese, dunno whom I'd select for the gold 13 jumper out of Izaia and Len Ikitau.
Running the Brumbies to a seven point loss in Canberra was, on one level, disappointing. Considering we were utter shite last year and had some injuries all week to overcome it was an encouraging performance. If/when we have a reasonably fit list and a few more games under our belt we'll be competitive with anyone.
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KOB1987
Rod McCall (65)
Welcome TT
Lightblue
Arch Winning (36)
What’s everyone’s’ thoughts on most players throwing the ball away or holding onto it walking back after being awarded a penalty against them?
The touchies should be letting the ref know this and get them marched 10m for not allowing the team that gets awarded the penalty the option of a quick tap.
It is quite obvious and blatant.
If the refs start enforcing this, teams won’t do it for long.
So easy to stop.
The touchies should be letting the ref know this and get them marched 10m for not allowing the team that gets awarded the penalty the option of a quick tap.
It is quite obvious and blatant.
If the refs start enforcing this, teams won’t do it for long.
So easy to stop.
Sheepie
Sydney Middleton (9)
It's not visible much on TV because the camera usually comes in quite tight so the person with the ball ends up off-screen, but it's pretty blatant in person. It's rampant. Easy to enforce as you say. One of the things the Drua coach was complaining about after their first match (saying it happened both in that match and in trials).
On the other hand the 9 and other players from the team that won the penalty need to be all over it to go get the ball before it gets walked off or thrown/kicked away.
On the other hand the 9 and other players from the team that won the penalty need to be all over it to go get the ball before it gets walked off or thrown/kicked away.
Lightblue
Arch Winning (36)
Again, the touchies should see it ... usually it’s right in front of them... just let the ref know.
As you say, the Fijians are often devastating from a quick tap.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
It's just another delaying tactic so beloved of tired forwards and analytical coaches.
It gives a moments respite for them to rest and set up the kick receipt pattern.
I can see how the Drua would be irritated as their ability for a quick tap and go is compromised. Similarly, there are many quick off the mark 9s in the game who could ignite their team with swift reactions to a penalty or short arm. Let alone big boppers who could charge over the paint from short distance.
Brings excitement to the spectators too.
Yep, tell the refs to march the offending team 10m with a full arm penalty.
Continued infringements bring a yellow card.
(I'd add in the scuffle/ball withholding after it goes into touch too. That stops a quick line out.)
Within reason, I'm fine with it. It's gamesmanship.
If you have the ball when the penalty is awarded against you I don't think you need to do everything in your power to try and facilitate a quick tap opportunity for the opposition. The fact that they don't have the ball already is probably reason enough that a quick tap isn't going to happen.
It's certainly not something I want referees to focus on heavily.