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Reds 2023

rodha

Dave Cowper (27)
I'm fine if "Thorn will be gone" EXCEPT if that was because of rumour.
Article was a while ago, basically he's gone if Thorn stays on, and he's certainly not the only one that wants to leave.

I expect a significant exodus of talent in 2024 if Thorn is reappointed. What unfolds is gonna be spicy. Brad will probably attempt to paint himself as a martyr in the media and he will probably have to be dragged kicking and screaming out of Red's headquarters. He won't go down without a fight that's for sure!
 
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Derpus

George Gregan (70)
When Thorn started out it was clear his strategy would take 3-4 yrs to really yield results. Half way through last year the Reds were near the top of the table having lost one game to the Brumbies. Yes - they then had a poor run home and it wasn’t just about the injuries - but they were significant.

If the Reds end up mid table or worse then I expect Thorn’s contract won’t be renewed, but if we end near the top I would think the Reds would be keen to resign him.
Strong record against Aussie sides - puss against the Kiwis.
 

TSR

Mark Ella (57)
And if that happens - I will duly accredit the improvement to Mick Heenan and Phil Blake.
Meh - if you are suggesting that you have already predetermined that any failure you will blame on Thorn and any success you will attribute to Heenan & Blake than it says far more about you then it does Thorn.

As for your claims about Thorn’s standing with the group - I’ve learnt long ago to take with a grain of salt posters on here professing to have the inside goss. You may well be 100% right but I would have to say I find your post often appear to sit firmly on one side and you don’t appear to make any effort to be objective. Forgive me if I let the season play out before I jump to judgement.
 

gel

Ken Catchpole (46)
As for your claims about Thorn’s standing with the group - I’ve learnt long ago to take with a grain of salt posters on here professing to have the inside goss.
Pfft.

You mean you *don't* trust anonymous random people on the internet?

I_Find_Your_Lack_of_Faith_Disturbing_banner.jpg
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
Unsubstantiated rumours make great clickbait

Reds trial match this weekend, any rumours on the lineup or wildcards?
I'm expecting wallaby tourists to be rested - so no Paisami, Petaia, McReight or McDermott. Beyond that I'm not too sure, but we should see Lynagh get some time at 10 and hopefully Luke Jones has a run. Would be great if we saw Peni Ravai, but who knows where that's at or whether he's ready to go. I'd expect some of the club guys who've been with the squad will get a run too - Navosalagi, Werchon, maybe Dobbins if he's fit

Anyone know the state of the guys who finished the year injured? I'm hoping Nasser, Wright and O'Connor are all ready in time for the start of the season, hopefully with a bit of game time under their belts.
 

Derpus

George Gregan (70)
Like every other current Australian coach.

But yes, he does need to rectify this or I think it likely that the Reds will decide it is time to move on.
No - hes currently got the worst NZ record. Even worse than Rebels bloke im pretty sure?
 

TSR

Mark Ella (57)
No - hes currently got the worst NZ record. Even worse than Rebels bloke im pretty sure?
Yeah - but my point is that they are all shit. If your point is that he is most shit, okay. In the last 2 yrs Brumbies have the best record of 3 from 11 don’t they? Maybe 4 from 11. We’re splitting hairs.
 

TSR

Mark Ella (57)
I'm expecting wallaby tourists to be rested - so no Paisami, Petaia, McReight or McDermott. Beyond that I'm not too sure, but we should see Lynagh get some time at 10 and hopefully Luke Jones has a run. Would be great if we saw Peni Ravai, but who knows where that's at or whether he's ready to go. I'd expect some of the club guys who've been with the squad will get a run too - Navosalagi, Werchon, maybe Dobbins if he's fit

Anyone know the state of the guys who finished the year injured? I'm hoping Nasser, Wright and O'Connor are all ready in time for the start of the season, hopefully with a bit of game time under their belts.
As far as I can tell from various stories Wright & O’Connor good to go.

Nasser still in recovery I believe.
 

liquor box

Greg Davis (50)
Article was a while ago, basically he's gone if Thorn stays on, and he's certainly not the only one that wants to leave.

I expect a significant exodus of talent in 2024 if Thorn is reappointed. What unfolds is gonna be spicy. Brad will probably attempt to paint himself as a martyr in the media and he will probably have to be dragged kicking and screaming out of Red's headquarters. He won't go down without a fight that's for sure!
I am torn on this one, Thor is my favourite player and I think he is awesome, but I often think he has plenty of improvement left in him. I feel he has peaked at the Reds (I think other Reds have also peaked but have improvement left) and as a Wallabies fan I wonder if he should go somewhere else to get a new perspective and get better or do the Reds keep him and bring in new coaching to get the same result.

I think new coaching is my best answer as I think it could improve many players in the team.
 

rodha

Dave Cowper (27)
Like every other current Australian coach.

But yes, he does need to rectify this or I think it likely that the Reds will decide it is time to move on.

Yeah, but Thorn is the currently the only Kiwi who's coaching an Aussie Super team. That obviously brings with it a different territory no doubt..

Speaking of which, there are some intriguing similarities between Brad and his coaching mentor Robbie, unrelated to Wild Knights partnership.

First of all, they both dropped Quade Cooper from their squads & subsequently made their favoured golden boy O'Connor the first-choice 10.

Secondly, they both started as coach in year 2--8, they both won a truncated shortened competition (which remained their only notable achievement) in year 2--1, which both happened in their 4th season.

And thirdly, they both opted for lightweight playmaking midfielders (Giteau, Barnes, Stewart, Flook) who were below 90kg & all wore head gear... instead of selecting bigger more physical ball-carrying midfielders and in both instances this proved to be disadvantageous when playing the NZ side/s.
 
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TSR

Mark Ella (57)
Thorn played for the All Blacks but he also played for Qld State of Origin and the Kangaroos. I don’t know how many see him as a Kiwi and, in any case, I don’t think Qlders really care. Border, Chappel, Inglis, Lam, Latham, Graham Lowe. All born elsewhere. All ironed on Qlders in the eyes of many.

We like winners though.

The critical point here, which I assume we all agree on, is that Thorn has had his grace period. He got given free licence to tip the place on its head (something which many have said was required) and build from the base up. There was no way to do that without a fair bit of pain. He’s been given latitude on the basis that he was implementing significant reform with long term pay off. And, regardless of the outcome of this year, it appears to me he has driven some very worthwhile change.

But many, including me, want to see us back at the top of the standings. I can accept not being the very top as Canterbury & Auckland are standard setters. The Brumbies are pretty damn good too - but we showed last year we are capable of beating them. But a mid field finish is below par now.

We’ll enter the season without Tupou and he is irreplaceable but we don’t need our props to be rock stars. We do need them to be productive though and we need our tight 5 to raise a level.

Everywhere else we have plenty of talent and we now also have the senior rugby experience to expect more. Our team remains young, but they aren’t babies.

I don’t think Thorn’s NZ links really have any relevance here. His coaching mentor is Bennett, not Deans. I don’t think a group of random similarities are really talking points - although fair play to your research skills to identify them.
 
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