ISA Rugby 2013

[Quick Hands]

Oakhill vs Barker at Barker this weekend..any thoughts.

And Augustines play Waverley at Queens Park

Should be 2 competitive rounds of matches.

 

[Runner]

I think Auggies could beat just about anyone, if they are fielding the Best Side. They Smashed Scots College in the Trial last year 45/0. They are not in a hard Comp. and will be just another walk in the park for them again this year, which is sad and its Boring as you like to have close hard fought games.

Remember that Oakhill and St Greg's both beat Auggies in 2012 in ISA.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Oakhill have apparently lost a lot of their team from last year as it was heavy in Year 12 (2012) players. They have plenty of depth in their programme, but may be slow starters to the competition as they rebuild/replace.

How many of the Gregs boys will be trying out for ISA Rep slots?
Are the Loig programme boys interested in trying out (or will they be allowed)?
If they go all the way this year to Aust Schoolboys, there is the prospect of a once in 4 year UK tour.

 

[Rugby Tragic]

Oakhill have apparently lost a lot of their team from last year as it was heavy in Year 12 (2012) players. They have plenty of depth in their programme, but may be slow starters to the competition as they rebuild/replace.

How many of the Gregs boys will be trying out for ISA Rep slots?
Are the Loig programme boys interested in trying out (or will they be allowed)?
If they go all the way this year to Aust Schoolboys, there is the prospect of a once in 4 year UK tour.

Oakhill are rebuilding and only have 5 of last years boys returning however the remainder of the team were last years seconds who were undeated . Looking forward to the tussle of the top four.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Rugby Tragic, In light of the discussion above about the disparity of team numbers in some of the schools, how do the Oakhill 2nds and 3rds etc go for opposition when Oakhill play the likes of Pius or Andrews that do not have similar depth in the various grades? It must be a little disruptive.

Could a Basketball type grading division arrangement work for rugby where for example where ISA Level 2 competition may include (example only):
Oakhill 2nd XV, Oakhill 3rd XV, Auggies 2nd XV, Pats 2nd XV, Andrews 1st XV, Redlands 1st XV, Stannies 2nd XV, Chev 1st XV; and
ISA Level 3 competition being (examples only):
Auggies 3rd XV, Pats 3rd XV, Pats 4th XV, Oxley 1st XV, BMGS 1st XV, All Saints 1st XV, Pittwater House 1st XV, Kinross 2nd XV.

And so on down through the grades to fill 8 or 10 team competitions of, where possible, similar skill levels.

Logistics may be tricky for the teams drawing against the more distant schools. At the moment there are economies of scale to bus all teams from school A to Orange and back. Multiple destinations would be challenging to coordinate, but not insurmountable.

 

[Rugby Tragic]

Rugby Tragic, In light of the discussion above about the disparity of team numbers in some of the schools, how do the Oakhill 2nds and 3rds etc go for opposition when Oakhill play the likes of Pius or Andrews that do not have similar depth in the various grades? It must be a little disruptive.

Could a Basketball type grading division arrangement work for rugby where for example where ISA Level 2 competition may include (example only):
Oakhill 2nd XV, Oakhill 3rd XV, Auggies 2nd XV, Pats 2nd XV, Andrews 1st XV, Redlands 1st XV, Stannies 2nd XV, Chev 1st XV; and
ISA Level 3 competition being (examples only):
Auggies 3rd XV, Pats 3rd XV, Pats 4th XV, Oxley 1st XV, BMGS 1st XV, All Saints 1st XV, Pittwater House 1st XV, Kinross 2nd XV.

And so on down through the grades to fill 8 or 10 team competitions of, where possible, similar skill levels.

Logistics may be tricky for the teams drawing against the more distant schools. At the moment there are economies of scale to bus all teams from school A to Orange and back. Multiple destinations would be challenging to coordinate, but not insurmountable.

Hugh, your examples have alot of merit, i think that the 4thXV and 5th XV of schools who could field them would also do well in the second division competition, not saying they would be allstars but could offer competitive games week in week out.

i think ISA need to look at it as the first division as i see it this year is a three horse race and i would love to see ISA 1st Divison playing against CAS and GPS on a regular basis.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

./...snip.../.
i think ISA need to look at it as the first division as i see it this year is a three horse race and i would love to see ISA 1st Divison playing against CAS and GPS on a regular basis.

Many would love to see this happening and your suggestion has so much logic and merit behind it, but sadly outside of trials and the rep team clashes, the sun will rise in the west before we see this happen.

ISA seems to be the only NSW School organisation that doesn't seem to have too much traditional baggage associated with it, and has shown a degree of flexibility and a willingness to change and adopt in the best interests of the charter of the association.

 

[RugbyTears]

Rugby Tragic, In light of the discussion above about the disparity of team numbers in some of the schools, how do the Oakhill 2nds and 3rds etc go for opposition when Oakhill play the likes of Pius or Andrews that do not have similar depth in the various grades? It must be a little disruptive....

Hugh, last year Oakhill played their 3rds vs Pius 2nds and Andrews 2nds. Meanwhile their 2nds were across town against Syd Grammar 1st and Scots 2nds. Their 4ths was probably up at Central Coast Grammar and their 5ths would have played St Pats 5ths. Similar thing would have happened for any of the 'bigger' schools several times a season. Same story with all C & D teams. Thats why I think breaking down the divisions and getting more games among ISA schools is not that crazy an idea. In a de facto way it is already happening. Why not formalise it and make it a meaningful comp ?
But having said all that, it is easy for us sitting on the side line and ask why the association don't do anything about this ? Don't forget the 'association' is not exactly staffed other than sportsmasters who have a day job as a sports master, teaching, coaching rugby, bus stop duties, etc etc etc ... If ISA wants to move forward with this, it needs to be properly staffed first. But the opportunity to move forward is definitely there, whereas merging the bigger schools with CAS or GPS is never ever going to happen. Not even when the sun rise in the west

 

[Quick Hands]

One thing people need to realise is the the GPS, CAS & ISA don't exist to do anything other than to provide sporting activities for students of member schools. Just because something might "make sense" from a rugby perspective doesn't really mean a lot to many others in these associations.

Rugby tears is right, the primary function of the men and women running these competitions is to teach, not to fill the vacuum left by NSWRU/ARU in providing rugby competitions for all.

 

[sarcophilus]

Splitting up works if 1st XV only need 15 players keeping schools in the one place allows a club like participation with lower grade players standing by to assist the higher grades. I would suspect a single team squad would require 20 preferably 22

Participation, I would think is the primary objective of school sports when schools insist that students turn up on a Saturday . Standing by as a reserve only will diminish these opportunities.

Splitting teams between anywhere from Campbeltown, Narrabeen Central coast and Orange would make a across the grades participation awkward

After three years of middle school and then consolidation in a "sub senior" u16 there must be some clues of each of the schools relative strengths across 3 or 4 grades and what might be expected of that age groups "club" championship ranking

Ultimately each age playing group earns the right to their division and keeps a critical mass of players together for maximum participation

Tis may also encourage development of younger players( middle school) as these teams may influence the grading of the senior teams and limit the impact of shopping for developed players for senior comps.

 

[sarcophilus]

ISA does seem to be the open circle of the three main rugby playing school associations. Inter association trials have been interesting yard sticks for some schools progress. I do wonder if the embarrassment metered out to a couple of the "old schools" over the past few years has meant those associations have decided to close ranks and limit the number of external trials by introducing a two round competition.

I do hope the innovation, development and improvement of competition in this association over the past is continued

 

[Quick Hands]

ISA does seem to be the open circle of the three main rugby playing school associations. Inter association trials have been interesting yard sticks for some schools progress. I do wonder if the embarrassment metered out to a couple of the "old schools" over the past few years has meant those associations have decided to close ranks and limit the number of external trials by introducing a two round competition.

I do hope the innovation, development and improvement of competition in this association over the past is continued

Yes, I recall that Joeys played Augustines for a few years in trial matches, which ended abruptly after Augustines won 2 years in a row.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

While 1st XV is "important", the rugby folk in the AAGPS have to provide a rugby experience for the 7th XV, the 16F's and 13H's as well as the 1st XV on a week to week basis. There are very few schools that can provide that on a regular basis, including some of those within the AAGPS family. This may be a factor in Joeys declining to have trial games against Auggies.

 

[Quick Hands]

While 1st XV is "important", the rugby folk in the AAGPS have to provide a rugby experience for the 7th XV, the 16F's and 13H's as well as the 1st XV on a week to week basis. There are very few schools that can provide that on a regular basis, including some of those within the AAGPS family. This may be a factor in Joeys declining to have trial games against Auggies.

Which is why Joeys and the bigger schools generally played 2 or more schools at the same time in trials and tried to match up teams of equal ability. It worked for years. Augustines were down to play Waverley today (unfortunately only 1st, 2nd & 16A will play apparently) and will play Riverview next term in trials. No doubt Riverview will have more teams than Augustines, but I'm sure there will be at least one other school involved.

By my rough estimation if the "big schools" only played trials against each other, Kings, Joeys, Shore & Riverview would be quite lonely - Knox and possibly Barker would be the only other schools that would get close.

 

[Wood Rat]

Only three matches due to weather

Augustines U16 def Waverley 29-12 5 tries to 2
A trial match that indicated this augustines cohort needs a lot more discipline. That's the only public display of dirty laundry you will get from this monkey


2nd XV
Augustines won convincingly

1st result has been reported elsewhere to augustines 41-26

 

[joesph]

players to watch in oakhill ?

 

[Quick Hands]

I saw that Pius had a couple of close games in their annual fixture against Alos. Trying to get a measure on Pius; a loss to Chev, which apparently was 1sts on 1sts and 18-10 loss to Alos in 1sts and 12 all draw in 2s.

Augustines play Alos in a trial next term, that should give us a guide.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

When are rep trials to select ISA I and II?
When are ISA I and II trial games, and against whom?

When are ISA U16 trials?
When are ISA U16 rep trials, and against whom?

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

If I may I would like to give out the "Most Dumb Award To A Coach".. Without saying his name but the Rugby Union Coach of Auggies Top Side, who Stupidly played His Top NSW Fast Winger and Manly Sea Eagles Holden Cup Winger in a TRIAL against Waverley and has Broken his Jaw ( out for 6 weeks ) by an Opposition Player who looked to have not a lot of Experience under his belt. Which is fine to play All these Boys, that's what trials are about and Accidents do happen ! But WHY would you Risk your Best Back in a Stupid Trial ! A lot of people are asking the same Question, including Manly Sea Eagles who are not happy !

Well when it comes to making dumb decisions your post certainly seems qualified to some sort of award.

There is a purpose to playing trials and all schools play them and include alll their players. Auggies coach has had a fair amount of success and has substantial qualifications to warrent some respect on these forums and can claim to know what he is doing.

Are you suggesting that he should not trial any of his better players and only play them once the comp starts, or, as I suspect, you feel he should run all his team selections through the Manl RL club to gain approval for the participation of all his players.

 

[John Rugby]

players to watch in oakhill ?

Oakhill have two main players to watch out for this year. Ben Cotton, fullback, was awarded best back in Aus at the out of school Australian championships. The other player to watch out for is Joshua Anderson, 2nd row, made the NSW side in 2012. Oakhill may not have as strong of a team this year with only a handfull of players returning from 2012 so we'll have to wait and see. But they do have a few strong year 11 players especially tight head prop James Partridge, and i believe there are two year 10 players currently in the side, Lachlan Anderson and Andrew Graham who seem to play some solid football