Sydney Subbies 2024

[BRUMBIEJACK]

Another chart, potential games over the last 23 season for Div 1-4. Added total and a telling trend line. This does not account for games that were forfeited or cancelled, nor does it account for clubs that could not accommodate the full compliment of teams.
I will look at adding Div 5 & 6.
It is interesting seeing the clubs in the above matrix across the years. Team moving up through the divisions only to disappear altogether (Kings, CBOB, etc..) also the 3 clubs that had a single season in Div 4 the first year it dropped the Walker Cup in 2020 (Dukes, Maccabi, Colleagues).
View attachment 18112

Ahem, CBOBS haven't disappeared - have been Brothers for quite some time.

 

[BRUMBIEJACK]

Divs 5 & 6 will be interesting. You'll see a fair bit of attrition I'd say.

Here are the clubs I have down as finished up since 2007:
Oakhill Old Boys
Norwest
Killara West Pymble
Bankstown
Notre Dame Uni
St George
Liverpool
The Vales (Fairvale/Lansvale)
Roseville
Sydney Grammar Old Boys
Collaroy
Clovelly
Seaforth
ICMS
Dee Why
Engadine
Sydney Combined Forces
Hawkesbury Ag College
Menai - came back in a couple of times, won trophies, shut down.

Rockdale came back in 2023 and status for 2024 TBC.

The "maybes" who were still about in 2023 via merger or Halligan Cup:
Lane Cove
Brothers
Terrey Hills

For Brothers scratch maybe, insert alive.

 

[Ref_Ted]

Ahem, CBOBS haven't disappeared - have been Brothers for quite some time.

Granted only Divs 1-4

 

[Pfitzy]

For Brothers scratch maybe, insert alive.

Absolutely alive, as a club. Helluva lot of work going on with partnerships and I see via social media that Colts is back.

However, they didn't field a senior team in 2023. Once that is rectified, they come off the "maybes" list.

 

[Ref_Ted]

Added Div 5&6. Any thoughts on what happened in 2016?

 

[Ref_Ted]

The numbers

 

[Ref_Ted]

And here is the full set showing all the clubs and which divisions they were in since 2001. Subbies only.

 

[TheBigArvo]

What would be interesting is to understand if they're going to another sport or just quitting.

I was looking at some lower grade Premier Rugby sheets from 2023, and saw a fair few names that came up on Subbies sheets from 2022. So they're at least staying in the code.

I think we are seeing guys dropping out as they don’t want to commit the time required. We are seeing clubs start pre season in Dec/Jan and then two nights a week training plus a Saturday where you play your game/back up for the next and help out round the club is a huge amount of time.

I think we will see the rise in smaller comps where guys can turn up and play or more 1 team clubs when a group of guys want to play together.

There’s definite exceptions to this and some clubs are booming, but I think We will see the gap between Div 1 and the rest continue to grow.

 

[Pfitzy]

Saturday where you play your game/back up for the next and help out round the club

Jeez I wish! also worth noting I've talked to Div 1 clubs who struggle to get help across the board.

 

[Pfitzy]

Your point about time commitment is valid tho, in all seriousness. Most of the players who come through our doors are there to play, not take a turn on the BBQ or pack up the ground.

Also seeing clubs move to one night a week training. Two nights for amateurs rugby is becoming a bit much for coaches and support staff as well.

 

[Prodigy]

Your point about time commitment is valid tho, in all seriousness. Most of the players who come through our doors are there to play, not take a turn on the BBQ or pack up the ground.

Also seeing clubs move to one night a week training. Two nights for amateurs rugby is becoming a bit much for coaches and support staff as well.

We’ve been at one night for a long long time. During Covid and the ensuing years, our culture shifted and we struggle to get full teams at training.
Now we are looking at our coaching staff and thinking about how we can make sure that we have quality in our sessions, but how we make sure the time is used productively and efficiently.

 

[TheBigArvo]

Jeez I wish! also worth noting I've talked to Div 1 clubs who struggle to get help across the board.

More than anything I think getting people to help out and run clubs is what’s going to kill it. Same as playing the time commitment is huge and the effort it takes to run a club is massive.
Without a big old boys group it’s almost impossible to get people to volunteer.

 

[Pfitzy]

Without a big old boys group it’s almost impossible to get people to volunteer

And for newer clubs this is nearly nonexistent. As time goes on, even older clubs will likely suffer a diminishing base because the lack of volunteers in the current player base translates into no old boys hanging around.

Over our short history, we've had a few guys who were family members of players help out. Mostly, they've retired and moved out of Sydney. Why wouldn't you? Cheaper almost everywhere else.

A lot of volunteers out there are working their arses off to keep clubs afloat, and begging for help, but not getting it. I managed to score a guy last year who is really enthusiastic. He asked a few friends if they'd like to help out, and they all asked what it pays!

If you just got 3 guys for each grade to just give an hour a week, it wouldn't be a burden at all. People don't get that.

 

[Northies]

And for newer clubs this is nearly nonexistent. As time goes on, even older clubs will likely suffer a diminishing base because the lack of volunteers in the current player base translates into no old boys hanging around.

Over our short history, we've had a few guys who were family members of players help out. Mostly, they've retired and moved out of Sydney. Why wouldn't you? Cheaper almost everywhere else.

A lot of volunteers out there are working their arses off to keep clubs afloat, and begging for help, but not getting it. I managed to score a guy last year who is really enthusiastic. He asked a few friends if they'd like to help out, and they all asked what it pays!

If you just got 3 guys for each grade to just give an hour a week, it wouldn't be a burden at all. People don't get that.

A bit generational these days too. Parents dump kids at sport and don't contribute. Those kids become adults who assume it all just happens magically.

 

[Heavyd]

More than anything I think getting people to help out and run clubs is what’s going to kill it. Same as playing the time commitment is huge and the effort it takes to run a club is massive.
Without a big old boys group it’s almost impossible to get people to volunteer.

Newport have being paying bar staff for many a year. With two bars and a busy BBQ it was beyond the scope of players and an over stretched committee to manage. It comes at a cost but it takes a lot of pressure of collecting the beer and restocking fridges.

 

[Pfitzy]

Newport have being paying bar staff for many a year. With two bars and a busy BBQ it was beyond the scope of players and an over stretched committee to manage. It comes at a cost but it takes a lot of pressure of collecting the beer and restocking fridges.

Other clubs do it as well where the size warrants it. I'd like to pay a canteen manager, but then other volunteers start to wonder why their hard work doesn't get rewarded, financially. Balancing act.

 

[Pfitzy]

Rockdale is apparently gone for 24 with the remnant going back to Southern Districts 4th grade apparently.

Rockdale Rugby Club Seniors on Instagram: "Rockdale Rugby is returning to the training paddock for season 2024! We look forward to seeing our returning players and invite all new players interested to join one of our training sessions - 6pm start tim

rockdalerugby.seniors on January 28, 2024: "Rockdale Rugby is returning to the training paddock for season 2024! We look forward to seeing our returning players and invite all new p..."

www.instagram.com

 

[Ref_Ted]

Rockdale Rugby Club Seniors on Instagram: "Rockdale Rugby is returning to the training paddock for season 2024! We look forward to seeing our returning players and invite all new players interested to join one of our training sessions - 6pm start tim

rockdalerugby.seniors on January 28, 2024: "Rockdale Rugby is returning to the training paddock for season 2024! We look forward to seeing our returning players and invite all new p..."

www.instagram.com

Good news. Tough time of year for clubs if you are depending on 'let's see who shows up' though. Rockdale were in Div 4 last year and were well represented.
18 forfeits for 2023 though none by Rockdale. 16 of them in 2nds. Mac Uni (5), Lane Cove (4), Chatswood (4)....
Renegades forfeited 1sts and 2nds on 29th July. That would have been the European rugby tour no doubt.

 

[Pfitzy]

Renegades forfeited 1sts and 2nds on 29th July. That would have been the European rugby tour no doubt.

lol I'm still waiting for the opportunity for a Euro vacation.

Came down to work, injuries, and I suspect a few players reluctant to play on the plastic.

 

[Ref_Ted]

So any cups to be added to the 'not contested' list for 2024?
Sutherland and Richardson all bar gone in 2023, Nicholson used to be Div 3 4ths (I think), now colts, Campbell gone, Radford relegated to Halligan style colts, Walker gone, Noice gone.

Competition	Division	Grade	Prize	Kick-Off
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	1st Grade	Kentwell Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	2nd Grade	Burke Cup	14:00​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	1st Colts	Barbour Cup	12:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	3rd Grade	Whiddon Cup	11:40​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	4th Grade	Judd Cup	10:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 01	5th Grade	Sutherland Cup	09:30​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 02	1st Grade	Barraclough Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 02	2nd Grade	Stockdale Cup	14:00​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 02	1st Colts	Robertson Cup	12:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 02	3rd Grade	Blunt Cup	11:40​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 02	4th Grade	Richardson Cup	10:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 03	1st Grade	Clark Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 03	2nd Grade	Farrant Cup	14:00​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 03	1st Colts	Radford Cup	12:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 03	3rd Grade	Campbell Cup	11:40​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 03	4th Grade	Nicholson Cup	10:45​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 04	1st Grade	McLean Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 04	2nd Grade	Grose Cup	14:00​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 04	3rd Grade	Walker Cup	12:55​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 05	1st Grade	Jeffrey Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 05	2nd Grade	Noice Cup	14:00​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Division 06	1st Grade	Meldrum Cup	15:15​
NSW Suburban Rugby	Other	1st Grade	Halligan Cup	15:15​