3rd tier is back in 2014 [Discontinued]

[Train Without a Station]

People need to get over the Sydney Uni hate. If they have the facilities and resources to do it, is that not a good outcome?

People talked about survival of the fittest and those that were able to survive bubbling through, yet want to piss and moan about one that possibly can do it without help?

That's the realities of the world, those with the financial resources succeed.

 

[Braveheart81]

to be honest I'm perplexed by people's willing to let USyd join by themselves, I'm thoroughly against it, then again I'm an Eastwood supporter, but still think it will isolate anyone outside of that community.

for your other sydney team tigerland it would be sydney north.

I don't think people are necessarily in favour of it but accept that if Sydney Uni want to push their case on their own, they'll probably get in. They have the money, the facilities and the players.

They can pretty much field a Super Rugby side of non-Wallabies players without needing to grab anyone from other clubs.

 

[A mutterer]

I think given the last 3rd tier shenanigans we can't afford the risk associated with developing new markets in the first year. 3-5 years down the track sure, but the first priority is building the damn thing.

While this is harsh on those further west money needs to come in this fund development and make this viable.

I think geographic splits in Brisbane and Sydney:

BNE North
BNE South
SYD North
SYD South
SYD West

 

[wamberal]

One of the criteria for entry should be the nomination of a home ground that has good spectator facilities, and is good for television. That alone would rule the Camperdown Claque out of contention straight away.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Why could Sydney Uni not find another ground that suits? Perhaps Concord?

Good to see there's plenty of hate going around towards any club that has the ability to create a 3rd Tier team on their own. The hide of them to be successful!

 

[suckerforred]

From the daily news I was thinking - Should GAGR start a thread with a view to collecting some law variations and then making a submission in January? Would be interesting to see what others are thinking & get some tweeking done prior to them being given to the ARU. As Bruce Ross (I think) said we have a very deep pool of game knowledge & passion here. It should be tapped.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/aru-invites-fans-on-social-media-to-suggest-law-changes-for-new-national-rugby-championship/story-e6frf4pu-1226781275458?utm_source=G&GR Daily Rugby News list&utm_campaign=aaa09d7c2d-Wed 9/10/2013&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_53e97ccfb4-aaa09d7c2d-63593105

 

[A mutterer]

Why could Sydney Uni not find another ground that suits? Perhaps Concord?

Good to see there's plenty of hate going around towards any club that has the ability to create a 3rd Tier team on their own. The hide of them to be successful!

I don't think that it's really a hate for the students, more around creating a broader base to develop talent and a better way to attract a viewer market.

merging clubs across a region would allow new teams to potentially attract 3 or 4 more times the crowd.

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

So Syd Uni wants to stand alone in the new comp. This means they need to fund their involvement in SS and then find the $225,000 required to play in the ARC. Where do they get their money from considering their side will be made up of Super 15 players? Do they have sponsors lined up or other sources of income they are targetting?

 

[Snort]

I can quickly name three (and I'm sure there were a whole lot more) players who came to notice in the ARC and who went on to play for the Wallabies - Scott Higginbotham, Ben Alexander and Christian Lealiifano. I fully expect the NRC will similarly bring forward a number of players who will go on to represent at higher levels.

Unfortunately, this just isn't true. Alexander didn't "come to notice" in the ARC. He had already played for Australian Under-21s, for Bedford in England and the Brumby Runners - he was already a contracted Brumby player by the time of the ARC. The ARC had nothing to do with his transition into professional Rugby, although, yes, he played seven games for the Rams.

Same deal with Lealiifano. He was already on contract with the Brumbies when he played for the Vikings - and had played Australian Under 21s the year before. There is no sensible way in whcih he could be said to have emerged through the ARC.


And Higginbotham? I doubt his three games for the Ballymore Tornadoes (don't you miss them?) had as much impact on his career as being named as the Reds Academy player of the year - whcih happened before he played his two and a half hours of ARC Rugby.

All three of these players were already well advanced on their professional careers when they played in the ARC.

 

[Braveheart81]

Let's put it another way. What exactly would another Shute Shield club get out of joining in a bid with Sydney Uni if Uni were providing 90% of the players?

Let's say Uni put in a bid with West Harbour, Parramatta and Penrith and based it at Concord. Those other clubs would be lucky to contribute two players each to a 30 man squad.

 

[Braveheart81]

Unfortunately, this just isn't true. Alexander didn't "come to notice" in the ARC. He had already played for Australian Under-21s, for Bedford in England and the Brumby Runners - he was already a contracted Brumby player by the time of the ARC. The ARC had nothing to do with his transition into professional Rugby, although, yes, he played seven games for the Rams.

Same deal with Lealiifano. He was already on contract with the Brumbies when he played for the Vikings - and had played Australian Under 21s the year before. There is no sensible way in whcih he could be said to have emerged through the ARC.


And Higginbotham? I doubt his three games for the Ballymore Tornadoes (don't you miss them?) had as much impact on his career as being named as the Reds Academy player of the year - whcih happened before he played his two and a half hours of ARC Rugby.

All three of these players were already well advanced on their professional careers when they played in the ARC.

This is just a ridiculous post.

Of course the ARC didn't identify players out of nothing. They were already on the path to bigger things but the ARC provided an opportunity to get more exposure and play both with and against a higher average standard of players.

Almost by definition, good young adult rugby players will be known to some degree because they have already been playing rugby at a reasoanble level.

In this day and age it's almost impossible for a talented player to be completely under the radar by the time they leave school.

The aim of this competition is to bridge the gap between Super Rugby and club rugby. I'm not sure what else you're expecting or why you have a problem with this.

 

[I like to watch]

That's an interesting question for all clubs in the SS,not just prospective Uni partners.
No matter which clubs combine,there will be dominant partners,in terms of balance sheet and playing strength.
Without quotas or something similar,the junior partners will end up being absorbed by the more dominant clubs.
There are always unintended consequences when things like the T3 are established.

 

[JSRF10]

My issue with Sydney Uni entering the comp is what kind of crowds will they get? If the Sydney teams are Sydney North, Sydney West and Sydney Uni who apart from the current 2k (open to correction on this) or so that attend Sydney Uni SS games will go to their games? As impressive as it is that they could go alone I'm not sure its viable in the long term to grow a crowd from current and past students, the majority of whom I'd assume don't have the slightest interest in rugby.

 

[the coach]

Interesting quotes from Bill this morning:

Mr Pulver said in addition to providing additional broadcast content, the National Rugby Championship will generate extra revenue for Rugby.

Successful teams will be selected based on a number of criteria including: financial performance; professional team staffing structure and environment; commitment to player development; venue facilities; links to Super Rugby clubs; and current or potential fan base.

 

[Dan54]

I really hope we not going to get some stupid game out of this, don't tweak the laws, just play rugby, or if you want some hybrid game, just make it what it is meant to be!!
Tweak the rules to suit a few, you will end up with a game that will not develop players to play in international rugby!!!

 

[wamberal]

The rules should not be changed, other than maybe playing shorter halves, but taking time off for all stoppages.

However, the match officials should be given some riding instructions on the interpretation of the laws.


Nothing should be done to remove the core areas of competence that the players need to be successful at a higher level. Speed things up, by all means, cut out some of the wasted time - for sure. But do not change the essence of the game just for this competition.

(Disclaimer: there are several rule changes that I would like to see, but I strongly believe that the whole game would have to adopt new rules, not just one competition in Oz).

 

[Tigers Tale]

Bruce - just as a matter of curiosity if the Australian Club Championship playoff between your Sydney Uni and my Easts Tigers (Bne) scheduled for March 2014 goes ahead who will Sydney Uni be able to run out given that most of your mob will be tied up with S15 at the time.

How many of your Grand Final 15 are affiliated with S15 sides?

FYI - Easts only had one S15 player in their 2013 GF side in Jarrad Butler who will join the Brumbies in 2014. It's other two S15 players in Ed Quirk and Aidan Toua were injured and missed the GF.

As a matter of interest I know there is a strong Sydney Uni representation at the Rebels but did you know that the Rebels coach - Tony McGahan - is a former Easts player and coach. Dumper (McGahan) was a member of the Easts 1999 premiership side which was captained by Richard Graham(Reds Coach). That 1999 side was coached by Adrian Thompson who was the Aust U20 coach this year.

 

[Train Without a Station]

The rules should be the same as test rugby. Super Rugby would already be a step up in quality and speed. We don't want players having to adjust to longer halves or anything else as well.

 

[MACCA]

The rules should be the same as test rugby. Super Rugby would already be a step up in quality and speed. We don't want players having to adjust to longer halves or anything else as well.

The make up of the participants and basis of support for the ARC will be tricky.
It would seem that the Brumbies, Rebels & the Force will have a natural relationship (or ownership) of the respective State teams that will play in the ARC.
Existing staff & premises, stable environment - just get out and play, not much else to organise.
In NSW ( & probably Qld) what involvement will the Tahs (or Reds) have?
Sydney Uni seems OK on its own - well done to them.
Are the other possible Sydney ARC clubs going to get the same support that the respective ACT, Victorian & WA ARC clubs will get from their Super 15 franchises? How could the Waratahs assist 3 separate ARC Clubs in NSW (or a similar situation in Qld). The proposed Sydney ARC Clubs (other then Sydney Uni) would be at a big disadvantage. Maybe there has to be some benevolent dictatorship at NSWRU, ARU & QRU to support or assist to organise, the establishment of the Sydney & Brisbane ARC teams (other than Sydney Uni).
That may well be the result of the current EOI process.

 

[Bruce Ross]

Bruce - just as a matter of curiosity if the Australian Club Championship playoff between your Sydney Uni and my Easts Tigers (Bne) scheduled for March 2014 goes ahead who will Sydney Uni be able to run out given that most of your mob will be tied up with S15 at the time.

How many of your Grand Final 15 are affiliated with S15 sides?

I expect that Sydney Uni will field a competitive side composed of players who took just a few weeks off after the Grand Final and will have been in serious training ever since, TT. As has happened previously, if they are beaten there will be no excuses, nor should there be.

There are 9 of the "Grand Final 15 ... affiliated with S15 sides". The non-affiliated are Tom Boidin, Liam Winton, David Hickey, Tim Davidson, Greg Jeloudev and Tom Carter. They are all useful footballers.
.