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Australian Rugby / RA

dru

Tim Horan (67)
You literally cannot remove politics from this discussion, it’s a political issue at its core.

Most supporters are emotive about the Wallabies results, naturally they want him gone for that reason. Emotive decisions aren’t necessarily good business though.

My biggest concern is the structure of Australian rugby and the outdated and antiquated federated model that gives states too much power and prevents effective alignment of rugby nationally. This entire issue is political. State unions and individuals at the state unions trying to protect their own (declining) sphere of influence and reach of power.

Clearly rugby is broken, and this parochial shit is only going to further perpetuate the issues of misalignment and structural inefficiencies.

It isn't simply where the power lies, it is also who holds the power - their competence, character and intentions. The last thing we need is another Shrink to greatness 2.0 or any other crack-pot direction. There must be checks and balances. Pulling through a federated structure it always involved convincing the state and voting members to get on board. The politics started with that major failure.

There is a basic incompetence in proceeding bombastically with a poorly supported (I'm being somewhat gracious), inchoate plan.

Granted (completely), the onus now swings to the voting members on how the matter is resolved. The direction SHOULD be pulled together by the Chair but it would be strange for that to be from an interim/acting. And that direction will necessarily be to the satisfaction of the voting members. Those voters ALWAYS held sway. It was ignorant (at best) for RA to ignore it.
 

stillmissit

Chilla Wilson (44)
You literally cannot remove politics from this discussion, it’s a political issue at its core.

Most supporters are emotive about the Wallabies results, naturally they want him gone for that reason which is understandable. Emotive decisions aren’t necessarily good business though.

My biggest concern is the structure of Australian rugby and the outdated and antiquated federated model that gives states too much power and prevents effective alignment of rugby nationally. This entire issue is political. State unions and individuals at the state unions trying to protect their own (declining) sphere of influence and reach of power.

Clearly rugby is broken, and this parochial shit is only going to further perpetuate the issues of misalignment and structural inefficiencies.
Let's give it some time as this has been one of the really big fat bottoms in our code. I am assuming that a few of the guys in the states and Super Rugby have some brains and see the current model must change or the whole thing goes amateur within the next 10 years.
 

Pfitzy

George Gregan (70)
Let's give it some time as this has been one of the really big fat bottoms in our code. I am assuming that a few of the guys in the states and Super Rugby have some brains and see the current model must change or the whole thing goes amateur within the next 10 years.

Bingo.

Continuing to think along the lines of "power" and "politics" just muddies the water. It boils down to one question:

Are the Wallabies performing well?

If the answer is "no" then the continuation of what we have is not fit for purpose. And it isn't just this year as we all know - the last couple of decades of slow decline have brought us to this flashpoint.

The code isn't big enough for this shit. Work together or die alone.
 

stillmissit

Chilla Wilson (44)
He's only interim at the end of the day. Ideally I think we need a completely fresh set of eyes, somebody from outside the state-based system & outside the old boys network. I personally wouldn't mind a female voice either, far too many dumb fragile male egos involved in the game.
Let's try again... I personally would prefer that we leave the 70's behind and focus on getting the best person for the job regardless of sex or virtue signalling.
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
So this is now Phil Waugh's opportunity to step out of McLennan's shadow and step up as CEO. I've been pretty unimpressed by him so far but there have been recent green shoots to lend some modicum hope. He more than anyone can benefit from the clear air and use it to drive the game forward, though he'll have to take a markedly different approach to McLennan.
 

Wallaby Man

Trevor Allan (34)
It isn't simply where the power lies, it is also who holds the power - their competence, character and intentions. The last thing we need is another Shrink to greatness 2.0 or any other crack-pot direction. There must be checks and balances. Pulling through a federated structure it always involved convincing the state and voting members to get on board. The politics started with that major failure.

There is a basic incompetence in proceeding bombastically with a poorly supported (I'm being somewhat gracious), inchoate plan.

Granted (completely), the onus now swings to the voting members on how the matter is resolved. The direction SHOULD be pulled together by the Chair but it would be strange for that to be from an interim/acting. And that direction will necessarily be to the satisfaction of the voting members. Those voters ALWAYS held sway. It was ignorant (at best) for Rugby Australia to ignore it.
I think the catch is that for this to be fixed ‘power’ must be ceded. The true power falls with the states and we have just clearly seen this on display, but unfortunately many don’t understand this and believe it sits elsewhere. I’m glad Hamish is gone as he was untenable, but it doesn’t change that for the game to go forward ACT and QLD need to trust whoever is in charge of RA and hand the keys over, otherwise this is just going to be half baked and become extremely territorial again and again and again.
 

Homer

Ted Fahey (11)
What is worrying is that i believe NSW ceded over their voting rights in the centralisation (as of January). Will all states lose voting power and if so how is RA held accountable then? We certainly don't get a voice.
 

stillmissit

Chilla Wilson (44)
Pretty damming and sad reflection of events for Australian Rugby.

To claim this isn’t about the centralisation is a load of crap and discredited the whole process IMO. The self-serving aspect of this is what has me worried, even as a passionate Queenslander and Reds supporter i’m not aligning with the party line on this one, Hamish was a clown but this process wasn’t the solution either.

Australian Rugby had a shot at centralisation reform for the better, that’s gone now.. at best we will get some watered down shit about ‘greater alignment’ and all the unions will continue plodding along like they have been previously in terminal decline.
This article is one of the best I have read on the mess and the lost opportunities due to, as Geoff Parkes says so well "He was the right type of man for the times. It was just that he was the wrong man."
 

The Ghost of Raelene

Andrew Slack (58)
So this is now Phil Waugh's opportunity to step out of McLennan's shadow and step up as CEO. I've been pretty unimpressed by him so far but there have been recent green shoots to lend some modicum hope. He more than anyone can benefit from the clear air and use it to drive the game forward, though he'll have to take a markedly different approach to McLennan.
His last couple of appearances have sounded like someone who turned away from the norm and used clear air or wants it anyway. Whether he knew this was in works so got in front of it I don't know and tbh don't care if he did as he backed the way of change.
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
What is worrying is that i believe NSW ceded over their voting rights in the centralisation (as of January). Will all states lose voting power and if so how is Rugby Australia held accountable then? We certainly don't get a voice.
It's only the vote attached to the super rugby license they lose, they maintain two votes as a state union (1 for being a state or territory union, one for over 50,000 registered participants).
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
His last couple of appearances have sounded like someone who turned away from the norm and used clear air or wants it anyway. Whether he knew this was in works so got in front of it I don't know and tbh don't care if he did as he backed the way of change.
I'm hoping he saw the current approach was not working and realised he needed to reset those relationships and chart his own course. He definitely appears to be finding his voice at the very least, which should help him in actually leading the process, rather than just reacting.
 

Adam84

Nick Farr-Jones (63)
What is worrying is that i believe NSW ceded over their voting rights in the centralisation (as of January). Will all states lose voting power and if so how is Rugby Australia held accountable then? We certainly don't get a voice.
They ceded 1 of 3 votes that they hold. And I don’t consider it worrying, it’s a remarkable display of selflessness and accepting the reality of the situation that QLD and ACT could take note of.

if everyone agrees to the same model, then the comparative balance of power doesn’t really change and RA still answers to the unions. It’s only if some accept the change and others refuse that the balance is thrown and ‘power’ is skewed to some states over others. Maybe ACT are upset they could potentially have the Same voting power as TAS/ACT/NT though. QLD will now hold the most votes nationally which doesn’t sit well with me.
 

Wallaby Man

Trevor Allan (34)
Next moves here is I’d say the Brumbies will try and manufacture someone that will approve a return to full Super Rugby financial grant, because if it doesn’t come they are in serious trouble and would almost certainly have to go hat in hand to RA like NSW have. So basically the next appointment will determine if they fall under the original centralization idea or just whatever they come up with for High Performance alignment. What that would do is potentially leave QLD as the only ones who wouldn’t fall under the RA total centralization model, which would have a detrimental effect on them and pressure to conform.

I believe this is the crux of what has lead to the last 2/3 days.
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
They ceded 1 of 3 votes that they hold. And I don’t consider it worrying, it’s a remarkable display of selflessness and accepting the reality of the situation that QLD and ACT could take note of.

if everyone agrees to the same model, then the comparative balance of power doesn’t really change and Rugby Australia still answers to the unions. It’s only if some accept the change and others refuse that the balance is thrown and ‘power’ is skewed to some states over others. Maybe ACT are upset they could potentially have the Same voting power as TAS/ACT/NT though. QLD will now hold the most votes nationally which doesn’t sit well with me.
I think the only way to effectively move forward with constitutional reform at the moment will be to finish the work of proper management structures for super rugby as a competition, with the 12 teams having a seat at the table and a voice in it's management. That then opens the door for proper constitutional reform, with the super rugby sides no longer needing a vote with RA.

Just folding those teams into the commercial control of RA is an incredibly inefficient way of achieving that.
 

Wilson

David Codey (61)
the way I read it they left because Hamish was getting knifed? Or were they gone because of our results regardless?
eToro I think had already gone, particularly given they signed on as A League sponsors at the start of the month. I believe Cadbury are in extension talks which may or may not have gone well, but do look even less likely to succeed after this. Whether or not they would've extended if McLennan stayed is debatable, but the word at the time was the Italy loss had a few key sponsors reconsidering, if that's the case it's hard to see them wanting to stay after this year, whoever the chairman was.
 
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