NSW Schools Debating 2023

[The Bait]

CAS results are up and it’s Barker best placed with a 3-0 start beating Knox last Friday . Aloysius in yet another surprise loss, this time to Cranbrook leaving the table at Barker 3, Knox 2 and everyone else on 1.

I would say Barker to win CAS and really I have no idea what could happen with the rest of the table. That being said, I agree the Barker / Aloysius match up is the match of the tournament and I would expect it to be strongly contested.

 

[Romanforum]

In looking at GPS this week, all the favourites are on side Neg. Could be some interesting results should be the motion weight to aff.

 

[GPSspectator]

In looking at GPS this week, all the favourites are on side Neg. Could be some interesting results should be the motion weight to aff.

I believe that those aren't actually their sides, it's just representative of home and away. GPS has gone back to a coin toss system from what I've seen.

 

[GAS]

Any insights or predictions as to who will be on the Rep teams for GPS, CHS and CAS?

 

[GPSspectator]

Thanks. Here are my predictions in speaker order for the firsts rep teams. Welcome any feedback.

CHS:
1st Speaker: Anhaar Kareem (SGHS)
2nd: Alexia Rigoni (Cammeraygal)
3rd: Darshanik Aryal (Ruse)

GPS:
1st: Michael Kwak (Shore)
2nd: Daniel Lloyd-Hurwitz (Grammar)
3rd: Jehiel Pather (Scots)
So an all year 11 team.

CAS:
1st: Eammon O’Loughlin (Aloysius)
2nd: Iris Lee (Barker)
3rd: Christian Mossati (Aloysius)

IGSA:
1st; Helena Piazza (SCEGGS)
2nd: Charlotte Allan (Abbotsleigh)
3rd: Nikki Han ( Queenwood)

Anyone game to predict the winner ? It’s bursting with talent this year.

And IMO, these kids represent the top debating talent in NSW.

I think these are pretty good predictions for the reps teams. From CHS, I wouldn't be too surprised to see Abrar Chowdhury (SBHS) on the team (I would expect him at 4th speaker). From GPS, I think Remy Sloan could also fight for a place in the starting 3 and I would also expect him at 4th speaker at a minimum. CAS and IGSA look pretty good although maybe there's an opportunity from some speakers from Knox or Barker to take the place of at least one of the Aloy's speakers?

 

[ggregan_89]

Any insights or predictions as to who will be on the Rep teams for GPS, CHS and CAS?

And Archdale!

 

[GPSspectator]

Some interesting topics to come out of the 'Science and Society' round (seems to have been interpreted as 'Science and/or Society'). From 1st grade, reportedly High beat Scots in a very close debate and Shore beat Grammar in a close debate.

Senior​

This house regrets the decline in multigenerational households.​

Year 10​

Motion: That hospitals should have the power to remove children from the care of their parents in suspected medical negligence cases. Info Slide: Medical negligence refers to the failure of a carer to provide a standard level of care, resulting in harm or injury to a patient. This could include forgetting to administer medication, choosing a different treatment plan than what was prescribed, or breaching duty of care.​

Year 8/9​

This house prefers a world where everyone was religious.​

Year 7​

That Australia should have a ‘meat tax’.​

 

[Asdyjftj]

Some interesting topics to come out of the 'Science and Society' round (seems to have been interpreted as 'Science and/or Society'). From 1st grade, reportedly High beat Scots in a very close debate and Shore beat Grammar in a close debate.

Senior​

This house regrets the decline in multigenerational households.​

Year 10​

Motion: That hospitals should have the power to remove children from the care of their parents in suspected medical negligence cases. Info Slide: Medical negligence refers to the failure of a carer to provide a standard level of care, resulting in harm or injury to a patient. This could include forgetting to administer medication, choosing a different treatment plan than what was prescribed, or breaching duty of care.​

Year 8/9​

This house prefers a world where everyone was religious.​

Year 7​

That Australia should have a ‘meat tax’.​

With View reportedly beating King's in a close one, standings are as follows:

Shore	3
SBHS	3
TSC	2
SJC	2
SGS	1
SIC	1
Newington	0
TKS	0

Needless to say, I don't think anyone would have predicted (or has) predicted standings like these. Grammar 1 for 3 is a shock. My bet is firm on High now, though I think a tie of some sort is more likely than not. Having seen half of these teams debate this season and almost all the rest this year, I really don't think any team is in a position to dominate. I think the gulf between the state speakers and the others is far narrower than some are suggesting - I've seen some truly middling speeches from them (although I have seen a great speech from one). Who knows what will happen at this point - if Grammar beat Scots and Joeys beat High next week, both results which are definitely realistic, we could end up with a very tight leaderboard more than halfway through the season. Only King's and Newington are out of contention at this point. Glad to see things are so lively.

 

[fact checker]

With View reportedly beating King's in a close one, standings are as follows (unsure about Joeys and Newington result):

Shore	3
SBHS	3
TSC	2
SGS	1
SJC	1 or 2
SIC	1
Newington	0 or 1
TKS	0

Needless to say, I don't think anyone would have predicted (or has) predicted standings like these. Grammar 1 for 3 is a shock. My bet is firm on High now, though I think a tie of some sort is more likely than not. Having seen half of these teams debate this season and almost all the rest this year, I really don't think any team is in a position to dominate. I think the gulf between the state speakers and the others is far narrower than some are suggesting - I've seen some truly middling speeches from them (although I have seen a great speech from one). Who knows what will happen at this point - if Grammar beat Scots and Joeys beat High next week, both results which are definitely realistic, we could end up with a very tight leaderboard more than halfway through the season. Only King's are out of contention at this point (though Newington may well be when the result comes through). Glad to see things are so lively.

Which state speakers have u seen out of curiosity. Surprised to see Shore undefeated having beat out some of the toughest opponents. Any chance Shore take it out this year?

 

[Asdyjftj]

Which state speakers have u seen out of curiosity. Surprised to see Shore undefeated having beat out some of the toughest opponents. Any chance Shore take it out this year?

Both of them (I won't name-check students). Shore may well - though I think either Scots or High will get the better of them in the coming weeks. Their remaining draw looks far easier than High's though - certainly possible.

 

[fact checker]

Both of them (I won't name-check students). Shore may well - though I think either Scots or High will get the better of them in the coming weeks. Their remaining draw looks far easier than High's though - certainly possible.

Curious to hear which speech you thought was particularly good.

Agreed - but at this point it's so competitive it's still quite open for contesting.

 

[GAS]

Both of them (I won't name-check students). Shore may well - though I think either Scots or High will get the better of them in the coming weeks. Their remaining draw looks far easier than High's though - certainly possible.

Was the great speech your refer to from Shore or Scots’ state speaker? And in the same vein the middling speeches you have witnessed from both of them?

Joeys beat Newington as expected.

 

[Debater]

Shore	3
SBHS	3
TSC	2
SJC	2
SGS	1
SIC	1
Newington	0
TKS	0

Thanks for keeping us updated on the standings. Will be interested to see how younger years went with different types of motions. A prefers motion in years 8 and 9 should get some interesting results. Nice to have some new motions, not the same couple that gets cycled through every five years

 

[Romanforum]

On the balance of probability, shore has the easiest draw remaining with Kings and Newington to go and has already debated the powerhouse schools except High. They need to win these 2 then split 1 out of High and Scots for a 6-1 record.

High has the hardest draw remaining inc Grammar in the final round.

I think Grammar will win the next 4 for a 5-2 record and will have to rely on other results for a shared premiership.

IMO I’d have to favour Shore to at least split the premiership at this stage.

 

[canelo]

I think some of the people you mentioned for IGSA are no longer debating. Some IGSA schools have two different teams for ISDA and Archdale firsts, usually where the year 12s finish their high school debating careers at the end of ISDA.

Can confirm that Nikki Han did not trial for IGSA reps, although Helena Piazza and Charlotte Allan did.

 

[Asdyjftj]

Curious to hear which speech you thought was particularly good.

Agreed - but at this point it's so competitive it's still quite open for contesting.

Wasn't this season.

Thanks for keeping us updated on the standings. Will be interested to see how younger years went with different types of motions. A prefers motion in years 8 and 9 should get some interesting results. Nice to have some new motions, not the same couple that gets cycled through every five years

Anecdotally the 8/9 motion was very unbalanced - but the tab doesn’t reflect accurate sides (not blaming the CA/tab team for this - tabby is not great for hs comps) so it’s hard to get properly asses motion balance. Although it creates a bit of difficulty, I wonder if it be worth switching to alternating sides (e.g. 8A/9A/10A aff, 8B/9B/10B neg). If a move like that were made I’d still prefer a coin toss to determine which schools A team is on aff/neg as opposed to just fixing it.

 

[fact checker]

Wasn't this season.


Anecdotally the 8/9 motion was very unbalanced - but the tab doesn’t reflect accurate sides (not blaming the CA/tab team for this - tabby is not great for hs comps) so it’s hard to get properly asses motion balance. Although it creates a bit of difficulty, I wonder if it be worth switching to alternating sides (e.g. 8A/9A/10A aff, 8B/9B/10B neg). If a move like that were made I’d still prefer a coin toss to determine which schools A team is on aff/neg as opposed to just fixing it.

Agreed - the motions have been superb lately but it does seem intuitively more difficult to argue the Aff of that Year 8/9 topic.

From memory I think GPS back in the day did do a system of alternating sides - could be worth bringing back...

 

[Romanforum]

CAS Mini Preview:

Aloys vs Barker (Round of the tournament):
With Barker reportedly taking the win against Knox, and Aloys beating out Cranbrook, this will be the round to decide the coveted CAS trophy. With Aloys being an ISDA finalist this year and Barker boasting a State Speaker, this promises to be a very close debate. However, given Barker's better form in being undefeated while Aloys suffered a shock upset to Waverly, one would have to tip Barker to take the cake in a very competitive debate.

60-40 Barker

Additional Note:
CAS will be selecting the Reps team and captain at the end of round 4. I expect 2 Barkers and 2 Aloys to be chosen. This has changed since last year when the Reps team was announced at the end of the season.

GPS coming soon...

Thank you, please share the teams once available if possible.

also, any update on when CHS or IGSA team make up will be announced ?

 

[GAS]

Wasn't this season.

Intriguing, was it Scots or Shore?

Perhaps this highlights a weakness in the NSWDU’s selection process as others on this forum have highlighted…

 

[fact checker]

Intriguing, was it Scots or Shore?

Perhaps this highlights a weakness in the NSWDU’s selection process as others on this forum have highlighted…

I'm quite curious as well...

As far as I see it, the performances of both Scots and Shore teams reflect the strength of their state speakers. Particularly with Shore's victory over Grammar, it's quite telling the Shore side has gotten even deeper and better since their respectable top 8 ISDA performance.

Also it's not too surprising to see some speakers give slightly worse performances that you would expect - good speakers are consistent for sure but that doesn't mean they're perfect all the time.