Rugby expansion

[p.Tah]

Nigel Melville has indicated that it is likely USA and Canada will be joining the Pacific Nations Cup in 2013.

http://nigelmelville.com/2012/05/05/pacific-nations-cup-place-for-the-eagles/

 

[TOCC]

I cant remember the technical jargon, but the USA and Canada were promoted in IRB development rankings(or something like that) and added to the IRB global test calendar.
Effectively it means they will receive inbound test matches against Tier 1 countries each year, the Churchill Cup was canned as part of that.

 

[Antony]

I find it hard to see professional rugby occupying more than a niche market in either country as both markets are already quite saturated with pro sports. But I'd love to be proven wrong.

Firstly, great perspective, thank you.

Secondly, I don't think anyone really thinks it will ever be more than a niche sport - but a niche sport in North America would pull the same kind of numbers and interest as rugby union in Australia today. And more money probably, just by force of habit. I'm happy with niche, anything more would mean the US would win every world cup from now to the end of time.

 

[kronic]

Also, that Moore Sports interview on the Rugby Club, suggested that Rugby would be played during summer in the USA. That way they can tap into the American Football market seeking a full contact sport in the off-season. It would compete only with baseball.

Stadiums are already established, thanks to the MLS club owners.

 

[wamberal]

Who is financing the professionalism initiative in the US? And why will it take until 2015 to get a league up and running?

I am a bit suspicious, frankly.

 

[kronic]

Who is financing the professionalism initiative in the US? And why will it take until 2015 to get a league up and running?

I am a bit suspicious, frankly.

Private ownership model. Here is the segment: http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/r...o-e6frf4pu-1226494185510?subcat=1225864525308

 

[wamberal]

Private ownership model. Here is the segment: http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/r...o-e6frf4pu-1226494185510?subcat=1225864525308

I really meant, who is financing the work that is currently being done? And why will it take so long?

Who are the people behind this? Are they reputable? I would be more sanguine if their spokesperson was a Yank, frankly.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

No, the Pacific Nations Cup is just the pacific islands. The US plays in the Super Cup(Russia/Canada/Japan/Russia) and also the Churchill Cup(USA/Canada/England Saxons)

The Super Cup folded years ago and the Churchill Cup ended two years ago. he IRB is currently working to include both in the PNC (Pacific Nations Cup).

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I really meant, who is financing the work that is currently being done? And why will it take so long?

Who are the people behind this? Are they reputable? I would be more sanguine if their spokesperson was a Yank, frankly.

I'm in contact with several people in the know in the US reasonably regularly and while no one is willing to divulge who exactly they are the common theme in relation to describing them is "of significant means" financially.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Who is financing the professionalism initiative in the US? And why will it take until 2015 to get a league up and running?

I am a bit suspicious, frankly.

The fact there taking about further into the future as opposed to tomorrow provides me with more confidence that it could possibly happen.

 

[TOCC]

The Super Cup folded years ago and the Churchill Cup ended two years ago. he IRB is currently working to include both in the PNC (Pacific Nations Cup).

The Churchill Cup was played in 2011, this is the first year it hasn't been played and this was due to the IRB mandating inbound test matches against Tier 1 countries

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The Churchill Cup was played in 2011, this is the first year it hasn't been played and this was due to the IRB mandating inbound test matches against Tier 1 countries

That's part of it. The main reason was that the RFU had enough of funding and organizing the event as a development tournament. While it did have the IRB banner, it was primarily the RFU backing it with the support of the North American Unions. So it's been gone for a year, I usually tried to watch as much of it as possible but for some reason thought it finished in 2010 and didn't bother last year.

 

[TOCC]

Today's finals at Sixways - which will see England Saxons and Canada take to the field for the title - will be the last Churchill Cup as Canada and USA become integrated into the global rugby calendar.

The Churchill Cup has provided regular Test competition for the North American unions and opportunities for 11 other nations since 2003 to develop their players in an elite environment – a model which has now been adopted by the International Rugby Board for the Nations Cup and the Pacific Nations Cup.

Now Canada and USA have been included in the new IRB strategic investment tournaments and tours schedule and have confirmed June inbound home tests against Tier 1 opposition in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016 and 2018.

http://www.churchillcuprugby.net/leagues/newsletter.cfm?clientid=3731&leagueid=0&page=53572

..

 

[TOCC]

Today's finals at Sixways - which will see England Saxons and Canada take to the field for the title - will be the last Churchill Cup as Canada and USA become integrated into the global rugby calendar.

The Churchill Cup has provided regular Test competition for the North American unions and opportunities for 11 other nations since 2003 to develop their players in an elite environment – a model which has now been adopted by the International Rugby Board for the Nations Cup and the Pacific Nations Cup.

Now Canada and USA have been included in the new IRB strategic investment tournaments and tours schedule and have confirmed June inbound home tests against Tier 1 opposition in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016 and 2018.

http://www.churchillcuprugby.net/leagues/newsletter.cfm?clientid=3731&leagueid=0&page=53572

Good to see

 

[wamberal]

The fact there taking about further into the future as opposed to tomorrow provides me with more confidence that it could possibly happen.

If the backers are genuine, and have the financial backing that would be needed, then that is right.

However, I am always a bit suspicious of grand new schemes that will take a couple of year to be promulated. Lots of time to find some willing errrrr investors.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

If the backers are genuine, and have the financial backing that would be needed, then that is right.

However, I am always a bit suspicious of grand new schemes that will take a couple of year to be promulated. Lots of time to find some willing errrrr investors.

I approach it with cautious optimism while not getting too excited as it could very well end up as nothing of worth. We'll see.

 

[Bardon]

I think taking the time to set something up in the US over a few years is a good idea. It gives time to get everything in place to give it a better chance of success and to get early traction to build a fan base.

For whatever reason the US doesn't like the start at a manageable level then grow it slowly approach that most other countries go for. For any new sport initiative at a national level it's go big or go home. It's important that Rugby make a big impact right from the start as if the initiative launches are is deemed a failure after a year or two many of the franchise holders wont be long in pulling their money out.

Would be great if Rugby could build up from grassroots in the US so that some history was retained but it sounds like those involved know their market and other sports have shown that what works in all over the world won't necessarily work in the US. However it's achieve it would be great to see the game grow over there. One thing is for sure they won't find it hard to attract players as the US would quickly become the No. 1 destination for players looking to finish their careers abroad.

 

[en_force_er]

My personal opinion is USA doesn't have the density to have good professional rugby system. It has the fans and players but not the density.

I mean, I could see them having a system like Italy's in time. Having a national league of 10 or so 'professional' clubs that survive off an oily rag and a couple of franchises that play in a higher league (like Super rugby) but don't really draw high crowd numbers. Italy's system in an unideal one but it's probably the most realistic model.

Another option to consider is bartering with Japan to get them to create concessions for their clubs to select Americans (specially if they are playing in the same tournament every year). I'd be good if the US could get 10-15 players playing in Japan, 20-30 playing in Europe (they probably already have these numbers playing Championship in England and D2 in France), a few up and comers playing locally (maybe the Saffas would let the US do the same as the Argies in Currie Cup Div 2), plus a few 7s players.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I think taking the time to set something up in the US over a few years is a good idea. It gives time to get everything in place to give it a better chance of success and to get early traction to build a fan base.

For whatever reason the US doesn't like the start at a manageable level then grow it slowly approach that most other countries go for. For any new sport initiative at a national level it's go big or go home. It's important that Rugby make a big impact right from the start as if the initiative launches are is deemed a failure after a year or two many of the franchise holders wont be long in pulling their money out.

Would be great if Rugby could build up from grassroots in the US so that some history was retained but it sounds like those involved know their market and other sports have shown that what works in all over the world won't necessarily work in the US. However it's achieve it would be great to see the game grow over there. One thing is for sure they won't find it hard to attract players as the US would quickly become the No. 1 destination for players looking to finish their careers abroad.

Or young player's looking for something different. Rugby has been growing steadily at the grassroots level for a decade now. There has been a great deal of effort particularly at the junior levels to grow the game and it's set to expand with AIG signing on not only to financially support their High School and College All-American structure but to greatly expand their junior development programs.

It would certainly be interesting if this proposal did in fact draw in some NFL franchise owner's as it could assist with providing an audience rather quickly because as stated in the clip, they are supposedly interested in a Summer contact sport to compliment Am Football and maintain their branding. Certainly interesting.

 

[p.Tah]

I'm in contact with several people in the know in the US reasonably regularly and while no one is willing to divulge who exactly they are the common theme in relation to describing them is "of significant means" financially.

Probably because if they do, David Nui will in there trying to ride the coat tails like he did with Grand Prix.