Shute Shield 2017

[Dave Beat]

I thought it was a great read and alot of the unknowns / questions answered. Whilst there will know doubt be detracters from the SS haters it is good to see the approach is positive and on the front foot for the good of the game.

 

[the coach]

I thought it was a great read and alot of the unknowns / questions answered. Whilst there will know doubt be detracters from the SS haters it is good to see the approach is positive and on the front foot for the good of the game.

I agree Dave.
It would be nice to hear from the ARU and NRC re the timing of the SS GF. From the Q&A it appears they were involved in the discussion, but I haven't seen any comments from either body as to whether they have a problem with the timing or not.

 

[AussieDominance]

Begg comes from a background as club president at Manly I can definitely see the potential for them to make more money with pushing the season back as indicated by his comments in the article I would find it hard to find a club that wouldn't but generally I would say the basis of Manly's community set up that it would certainly affect them more having an earlier start to the season.

 

[Dave Beat]

AD, yes as said it should allow all clubs to increase their gate, and some by more than others. Gordon is also one of those clubs that has a cricket pitch in the middle and in years past has been a strong club that has pulled gate - remember the days of A Murdock, T Wallace, K Okane, Harthill etc.

It is also great the focus on FTA, and that he's seeing that as a revenue stream that can Investment back into the game. A number of the preceding posts had the SRU as the problem child with the ARU and the SRU ust wanting and complaining. He's wanting Sydney & Brisbane Premier Rugby on FTA right around Australia with the revenue generated being reinvested back into grass roots.

He knows the lay of the clubs, says each, club is different and as he says "the community in rugby is at its core".

 

[Shadow]

I have heard that Pulver has decided to Start the NRC 2 weeks after the Shute Shield grand final.

 

[Dave Beat]

Just picked this extract off http://www.rugbynews.net.au/

I really like the concept but when in the calender could it be done, players, volunteers, etcmay want a break and offseason after the SS & NRC.

The Central Coast 7s is awesome & captures teams globally and clubs can play.
The Kiama 7's captures a large area of players pre season.

Great concept but to apply and make happen would involve considerable planning.


If you can get 40,000 people to watch Papua New Guinea play Kenya, surely you can get almost half of that crowd to watch Manly play Warringah, or Sunnybank face UQ.

Ballymore would be the perfect venue to host the Brisbane event. In Sydney, ground availability over summer would make things tough, but Rat Park and Warringah would put on a fantastic day, or maybe even Allianz if the interest was there.

Teams from Canberra, Melbourne, Perth and country regions could also enter the events, which could be held on a Saturday in November or December.

The top few teams could then play off in a National Club Rugby Sevens tournament as part of the Sydney Sevens weekend, potentially increasing the crowd on Friday.

 

[amirite]

**You're obviously quoting an article Dave, so this isn't about you but just a general sentiment**

It's always a bit amusing to me how Shute Shield and Hospital Cup-centric articles/posts that address national competitions, models, or thinking have Canberra, Melbourne, and Perth as afterthoughts.

These are written by the same people that talk about the ARU big wigs not doing enough for the little guy grass routes (the Shute Shield), meanwhile, there's little care or thought to the next level down who provide the Shute Shield with SO many players and are an essential part of the pathway (the Canberra, Melbourne, and Perth comps). These grass route clubs are the lifeblood of rugby after all.

Does this feeling sound familiar? It should.

Everyone's got beef with the next level up, and nobody gives much thought to the next level down.

 

[John S]

It's always a bit amusing to me how Shute Shield and Hospital Cup-centric articles/posts that address national competitions, models, or thinking have Canberra, Melbourne, and Perth as afterthoughts.

I'm not getting it - I'm sure I read that the article mentioned that teams from Canberra, Melbourne and Perth also run similar competitions, and then the top teams from all comps come together for a club championship?

Maybe I read it wrong. Was there an un/intended slight in the article by not spelling it out?

 

[amirite]

I'm not getting it - I'm sure I read that the article mentioned that teams from Canberra, Melbourne and Perth also run similar competitions, and then the top teams from all comps come together for a club championship?

Maybe I read it wrong. Was there an un/intended slight in the article by not spelling it out?

It mentioned a model to get Shute Shield and Hospital Cup teams playing each other and that oh, other teams could also enter.

What I'm trying to get at is the feeling of lack of consideration always cuts both ways. This is just one circumstance, but I'm trying to capture a sentiment and create perspective.

 

[Dave Beat]

^^^^ Amirite - yes so so so many layers, yep does sound familiar.

I think the suggested concept sounds great - would like to see a cash flow forecast to see the viability. No doubt the global circuit has $$$ behind it that assists with promotion - it just doesn't happen. Look at the crowds in Wellington - that would be a huge loss and we don't have money to lose.

 

[amirite]

^^^^ Amirite - yes so so so many layers, yep does sound familiar.

I think the suggested concept sounds great - would like to see a cash flow forecast to see the viability. No doubt the global circuit has $$$ behind it that assists with promotion - it just doesn't happen. Look at the crowds in Wellington - that would be a huge loss and we don't have money to lose.

Appreciate that DB.

I think a better Aussie club model for 7s would be great. The beauty is that you can run a whole 7s season in a month, so there is time in the calendar.

I also think we could get a lot out of just getting more attention onto our current national 7s comp. There's a really good set-up, but there's not really many players being picked out of it for Aus 7s or much attention for it.

 

[Dave Beat]

Appreciate that DB.

I think a better Aussie club model for 7s would be great. The beauty is that you can run a whole 7s season in a month, so there is time in the calendar.

I also think we could get a lot out of just getting more attention onto our current national 7s comp. There's a really good set-up, but there's not really many players being picked out of it for Aus 7s or much attention for it.

All good,
There has been a couple picked up
Killingworth.
Wells.
And there would be a couple more as well.
I know of a few more that were asked to train with the squad but opted for 15's so they new they could play rugby rather than just squad.

 

[John S]

It mentioned a model to get Shute Shield and Hospital Cup teams playing each other and that oh, other teams could also enter.

What I'm trying to get at is the feeling of lack of consideration always cuts both ways. This is just one circumstance, but I'm trying to capture a sentiment and create perspective.

Fair enough. I didn't read it that way. But I can understand where you're coming from.

 

[amirite]

All good,
There has been a couple picked up
Killingworth.
Wells.
And there would be a couple more as well.
I know of a few more that were asked to train with the squad but opted for 15's so they new they could play rugby rather than just squad.

Yeah but in a year like this with SO many injuries, the players picked up are coming from the best U18s and Colts on 2016 and not from the National 7s best performers.

I'd love to see the Aussie 7s players play in the National 7s so that:

1. There's more attention placed on the tournament.
2. If a random bloke burns an Aussie 7s rep in space, the Aus 7s set-up can feel more comfortable picking them, rather than now when they're just burning randoms and the Aus 7s guys can rightfully question it.

Fair enough. I didn't read it that way. But I can understand where you're coming from.

Appreciate it. I'm actually not that jaded, I swear.

There is still a little bit of a feeling in 2017 that rugby is seen as a sport for NSW and Qld, and that the minnow states are just along for the ride. It gets better every year though, and sometimes that chip on the shoulder can even be healthy.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yeah but in a year like this with SO many injuries, the players picked up are coming from the best U18s and Colts on 2016 and not from the National 7s best performers.

I'd love to see the Aussie 7s players play in the National 7s so that:

1. There's more attention placed on the tournament.
2. If a random bloke burns an Aussie 7s rep in space, the Aus 7s set-up can feel more comfortable picking them, rather than now when they're just burning randoms and the Aus 7s guys can rightfully question it.

Appreciate it. I'm actually not that jaded, I swear.

There is still a little bit of a feeling in 2017 that rugby is seen as a sport for NSW and Qld, and that the minnow states are just along for the ride. It gets better every year though, and sometimes that chip on the shoulder can even be healthy.

I'd like to see our national 7s comp turned into a proper series. Run over 4 or 5 events. One in Qld either at Ballymore or Bond Uni, one in NSW at say Pittwater or even Nth Sud Oval, one in Canberra and Vikings, One in Melbourne at Quins??, and another in Perth.

Actually put some effort into marketing the damn thing. Makes sure the squads are the strongest they possibly can be with Ntl team members involved.

 

[I like to watch]

Yeah but in a year like this with SO many injuries, the players picked up are coming from the best U18s and Colts on 2016 and not from the National 7s best performers.

I'd love to see the Aussie 7s players play in the National 7s so that:

1. There's more attention placed on the tournament.
2. If a random bloke burns an Aussie 7s rep in space, the Aus 7s set-up can feel more comfortable picking them, rather than now when they're just burning randoms and the Aus 7s guys can rightfully question it.
   .

1. 
   did you see any of the recent Darwin tournament?
   A whole team of pro f/time players were repeatedly humbled by amateur teams that were thrown together for the weekend.
   Imagine what the amateurs would do to the pros,with the same preparation!
   It's mind boggling how inept the current 'system' is.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

1. 
   did you see any of the recent Darwin tournament?
   A whole team of pro f/time players were repeatedly humbled by amateur teams that were thrown together for the weekend.
   Imagine what the amateurs would do to the pros,with the same preparation!
   It's mind boggling how inept the current 'system' is.

The system needs an overhaul. Personally, I'd like to see state based leagues setup in the post season run during similar windows to that of the NRC. Could tie in with NRC games. Open to all comers. Each region has their leagues and at the end a squad or two are selected for the state titles and from there state teams are picked. Then they play in the national series prior to the World Series. This would give the 7s coaches a really good look at the available talent. I'd reckonva number of the current squad would be very nervous.

 

[Dave Beat]

I really enjoy 7s live with a carnival atmosphere, on the box it doesn't really work so a hard sell for broadcasting and if it doesnt rate it may be a detrament to the 15s broadcasting $.

I'd be mindful of running it during the NRC Window because there are some players who excel at both - The Rays had Foley, Crawford, Wells running around no doubt there could be a few more.

What about Feb so it grows off the Sydney 7's promo. Work on a plan that promotes all the existing tournements (Lake Mac, Cresent, NT Hottest, Hunter, Kiama, etc) so they grow and get greater interest. Doing this we are also fostering areas of growth outside of Sydney.

The other states no doubt have comps as well I just dont know them.

Teams get points based on how they fair, say the top 4 (20 teams) in each state play in a finals weekend. It is only one big weekend of interstate travel, rather than jumping every weekend.

Doing it this way we are supporting / promoting / growing the existing tournaments rather than squashing them.

Doing all this in Feb leaves a month b4 the start of the SS, it has clubs improving skill sets in their preseason and the players having some fun with a few weekend trips as well.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I really enjoy 7s live with a carnival atmosphere, on the box it doesn't really work so a hard sell for broadcasting and if it doesnt rate it may be a detrament to the 15s broadcasting $.

I'd be mindful of running it during the NRC Window because there are some players who excel at both - The Rays had Foley, Crawford, Wells running around no doubt there could be a few more.

What about Feb so it grows off the Sydney 7's promo. Work on a plan that promotes all the existing tournements (Lake Mac, Cresent, NT Hottest, Hunter, Kiama, etc) so they grow and get greater interest. Doing this we are also fostering areas of growth outside of Sydney.

The other states no doubt have comps as well I just dont know them.

Teams get points based on how they fair, say the top 4 (20 teams) in each state play in a finals weekend. It is only one big weekend of interstate travel, rather than jumping every weekend.

Doing it this way we are supporting / promoting / growing the existing tournaments rather than squashing them.

Doing all this in Feb leaves a month b4 the start of the SS, it has clubs improving skill sets in their preseason and the players having some fun with a few weekend trips as well.

Anyone playing in the NRC that selectors want to have a look at after it finishes (I'd have the state finals a week or so after the NRC) could be added or even a whole NRC squad. There would be ways to work around it.

As for the circuit. Ideally you'd have all the legs within a designated time frame but I do like the idea of using established tournaments. So again it could be worked around. A bonus I suppose would be on the money saved on having to actually set up and run new events could instead be used to set up a broadcast option.

 

[Dave Beat]

As for the circuit. Ideally you'd have all the legs within a designated time frame but I do like the idea of using established tournaments. So again it could be worked around. A bonus I suppose would be on the money saved on having to actually set up and run new events could instead be used to set up a broadcast option.

yep savings, and also help promote with premier teams venturing outside of the normal area, in NSW Lake Make, Hunter, Crescent, Mudgee, all make for a good weekend away - these tournaments would get stronger, and you would accrue points for the finals, top 4 teams from each state for a weekend.

Simple with the core of it already established.

PS BarTV already live steam a number of these as well and do a great job.