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Sydney Colts - 2014

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Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
Round 4 Results

Colts 1
Warringah 13 Eastern Suburbs22
Northern Suburbs 38 Parramatta 17
Penrith 17 v Randwick 48
Gordon 30 v Southern Districts 48
West Harbour 25 Eastwood 19
Manly 26 Sydney University 45

Colts 2
Warringah 34 Eastern Suburbs12
Northern Suburbs 27 Parramatta 17
Penrith 7 v Randwick 53
Gordon 29 v Southern Districts 49
West Harbour 10 Eastwood 19
Manly 24 Sydney University 43

Colts 3
Warringah 12 Eastern Suburbs8
Northern Suburbs 39 Parramatta 24
The Bye v Randwick
The Bye v Southern Districts
West Harbour 0 Eastwood 26
Manly 12 Sydney University 33

Edit: Updated. Thanks @T&F, @Gavin, & @Cattledog.

Edit: Souths beat Randwick in Colts 3 "friendly". Good initiative to have kids playing footy instead of having a 30 man bench for Colts 2.
 

Tah and feathered

Watty Friend (18)
Souths results v Gordon and randwick 3rd colts
3rd colts
Souths 42 ( i think)
Randwick 10

2nd colts
Souths 41
Gordon 29

1st colts
Souths 48
Gordon 30
 

Cattledog

Sydney Middleton (9)
Week 4 - Penrith Colts vs Randwick

Colts 2 - Randwick 58 def Penrith 5 (I think). Randwick too slick and rugby smart for the Penrith lads. However, a full squad of 23 players took the field for Penrith and played some good passages.

Colts 1 - Randwick 48 def Penrith 17. The Penrith boys encountered a very good Randwick team whose individual speed & ability to spread the ball created great challenges. The Randwick No. 3 (who actually played loose head) is one of the best scrummaging props I've seen for a long time and caused massive headaches for the big Penrith scrum. Although he smashed us it did an old props heart good to see some good old fashioned scrum technique.

Penrith got stuck in during the second half but once again faded in the last 10 mins to let Randwick run in a couple of soft tries. Possibly 34 - 17 would be a truer reflection of the contest (but then again I'm biased). Best for Penrith halfback Isopo, centres Moata'ane & Peau, & No. 8 Kaihu.

Next week....Bus trip to Souths!
 

Gavin

Frank Row (1)
After all the nonsense written about Penrith, in the last week in particular, I must say that our experience yesterday was a positive one.

With the main ground closed, the matches were played on the top field. Penrith set up a tent and benches for Randwick, provided barrels of water and were regularly checking that we were comfortable with the arrangements. Their hospitality hasn't been matched by any other cub to this degree in my 20 years experience with colts. I experienced the same hospitality in all my years with Sydney Uni. so it isn't something out of the ordinary.

They have always struggled on the field, however having 6 of their potential colts for this season poached by other clubs doesn't help them create a nucleus around which they can build a stronger colts group. And, it's not Uni. doing the poaching but clubs that have bitched and complained about Uni. for years.
 

I like to watch

David Codey (61)
Nonsense?
You are a fool if you judge what has happened in past years,by how you were treated yesterday.
But let's focus on the here and now,so good on Penrith for putting on a good day.
You are now bagging a collection of clubs that might have poached up to 6 kids,and you are aligned with Randwick who poached 5 or 6 Oz Schoolboys in one season! 3 of them came from ONE battling club.
 

Cattledog

Sydney Middleton (9)
After all the nonsense written about Penrith, in the last week in particular, I must say that our experience yesterday was a positive one.

With the main ground closed, the matches were played on the top field. Penrith set up a tent and benches for Randwick, provided barrels of water and were regularly checking that we were comfortable with the arrangements. Their hospitality hasn't been matched by any other cub to this degree in my 20 years experience with colts. I experienced the same hospitality in all my years with Sydney Uni. so it isn't something out of the ordinary.

They have always struggled on the field, however having 6 of their potential colts for this season poached by other clubs doesn't help them create a nucleus around which they can build a stronger colts group. And, it's not Uni. doing the poaching but clubs that have bitched and complained about Uni. for years.


Thanks Gavin some of your members may like the colts photos on the Penrith DJRU Facebook site of yesterdays games.

https://www.facebook.com/PenrithDistrictJuniorRugbyUnion

Hopefully if we keep improving our culture & performance then the players who have looked for greeener pastures will someday return home or most importantly (going forward) ... not be tempted in the first place.
 

Cattledog

Sydney Middleton (9)
Nonsense?
You are a fool if you judge what has happened in past years,by how you were treated yesterday.
But let's focus on the here and now,so good on Penrith for putting on a good day.
You are now bagging a collection of clubs that might have poached up to 6 kids,and you are aligned with Randwick who poached 5 or 6 Oz Schoolboys in one season! 3 of them came from ONE battling club.

I've always believed that "he who controls the document controls the argument" and feel that the area of compensation for junior development when players change unions & the protection of clubs who invest in junior development is sadly neglected in the SRU Competition guidelines & documentation.

Section 4 of the IRB regulations sets out the general principle that unions have a right to compensation if players they have developed & invested (time & money) move to another union. However, this common sense principle seems to appear nowhere in any SRU or ARU documentation guiding registration, player movement, & club behaviour.

The general principles in the IRB regulations act to encourage clubs to take ownership of junior development within their union, regulate the behaviour of unions (which would unjustly profit from the investment of others) and set out a system for the just compensation of the developing union in the event a player wanted to switch unions.

However, For some reason a local interpretation of the IRB regulations which would act to regulate the predatory behaviour of some clubs & the unjust treatment of developing clubs is neglected in the SRU.

IMHO Arguments about player poaching just simply shouldn't be happening in this day and age. Clearly with a bit of leadership the SRU could address the issue of regulation & compensation to the satisfaction of all parties.

To have an unregulated system where clubs are not rewarded & protected for their investment in development and where clubs can profit from the development activities of others without any system of meaningful compensation (for the 1000's of hours of training & the $1000's of dollars spent on player development) is quite unjust.

Gob forbid it might even create a better competition too!
 

The Butts

Herbert Moran (7)
Really good day coming up on Anzac Day for the Gordon vs Parramatta clashes in 1st and 2nd Colts, as well as 1st and 2nd Grades.

This is a really good initiative from the Highlanders, and shows how much they put into supporting their players and the surrounding community.
 

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Learned One

Allen Oxlade (6)
After 4 rounds there have been plenty of tries and penalties.

Have we found any goal kicking standouts?

I'll start it off by nominating Josh Friend - currently playing fullback for Uni Colts 3.
 

wreckless

Bob Loudon (25)
After 4 rounds there have been plenty of tries and penalties.

Have we found any goal kicking standouts?

I'll start it off by nominating Josh Friend - currently playing fullback for Uni Colts 3.

Former Newington player Ellis Abrahams kicked some good ones on Saturday - including a spectacular roost to raise the flags which went out of the ground at the northern end and completely shattered a second floor window at the Fisho's! :D Wreckless.
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
After 4 rounds there have been plenty of tries and penalties.

Have we found any goal kicking standouts?

I'll start it off by nominating Josh Friend - currently playing fullback for Uni Colts 3.

Very early days, and some teams have had some blow out scores.

The top point scorers after round 3 were:
TEKI, Matthew, Souths Colts 1 - 3T, 15C, 3PG - 54 points
YASSMIN, Christian, University Colts 1 - 9T - 45 points
KAGIASSIS, Christian, University Colts 1 - 1T, 14C - 33 points
MCMILLAN, Chad, Manly Colts 3 and 2 bench - 3T, 6C, 1 PG - 30 points
O'DONNELL, Chris, Univesity Colts 1 and 2,1T, 8C, 2 PG - Points
TAMOUA, Maake, Wests Colts 2, 5T, 1C - 27 points
FOURIE, Justin, University Colts 2 and 1 bench, 3T, 5C - 25 points

FRIEND was in 21st place on 16 points.

Deadeye with the boot:
TEKI, Souths, 15C, 3 PG
KAGIASSIS, University, 14C
MANASSA, Eastwood, 10C
TREGONNING, Eastwood, 9C
O'DONNELL, University 9C, 2PG
BENTON, Parramatta, 8C, 1PG
FRIEND University, 8C
NEWSOME, Easts, 6C, 3PG
 

Tah and feathered

Watty Friend (18)
Very early days, and some teams have had some blow out scores.

The top point scorers after round 3 were:
TEKI, Matthew, Souths Colts 1 - 3T, 15C, 3PG - 54 points
YASSMIN, Christian, University Colts 1 - 9T - 45 points
KAGIASSIS, Christian, University Colts 1 - 1T, 14C - 33 points
MCMILLAN, Chad, Manly Colts 3 and 2 bench - 3T, 6C, 1 PG - 30 points
O'DONNELL, Chris, Univesity Colts 1 and 2,1T, 8C, 2 PG - Points
TAMOUA, Maake, Wests Colts 2, 5T, 1C - 27 points
FOURIE, Justin, University Colts 2 and 1 bench, 3T, 5C - 25 points

FRIEND was in 21st place on 16 points.

Deadeye with the boot:
TEKI, Souths, 15C, 3 PG
KAGIASSIS, University, 14C
MANASSA, Eastwood, 10C
TREGONNING, Eastwood, 9C
O'DONNELL, University 9C, 2PG
BENTON, Parramatta, 8C, 1PG
FRIEND University, 8C
NEWSOME, Easts, 6C, 3PG
Very early days, and some teams have had some blow out scores.

The top point scorers after round 3 were:
TEKI, Matthew, Souths Colts 1 - 3T, 15C, 3PG - 54 points
YASSMIN, Christian, University Colts 1 - 9T - 45 points
KAGIASSIS, Christian, University Colts 1 - 1T, 14C - 33 points
MCMILLAN, Chad, Manly Colts 3 and 2 bench - 3T, 6C, 1 PG - 30 points
O'DONNELL, Chris, Univesity Colts 1 and 2,1T, 8C, 2 PG - Points
TAMOUA, Maake, Wests Colts 2, 5T, 1C - 27 points
FOURIE, Justin, University Colts 2 and 1 bench, 3T, 5C - 25 points

FRIEND was in 21st place on 16 points.

Deadeye with the boot:
TEKI, Souths, 15C, 3 PG
KAGIASSIS, University, 14C
MANASSA, Eastwood, 10C
TREGONNING, Eastwood, 9C
O'DONNELL, University 9C, 2PG
BENTON, Parramatta, 8C, 1PG
FRIEND University, 8C
NEWSOME, Easts, 6C, 3PG
Matt Teki out for 12 weeks with a broken finger
Big lose to Souths who missed 2 kicks from in front against Gordon 1st colts
 

I like to watch

David Codey (61)
Yassmin Uni 1's 9 tries after 4 rounds!
Saw a video of one game,he has jet shoes!
...and they know how to to put him into space.
This is a very talented,very well drilled side.
They had a few rockstars in their side,but the strength of the side is in the structure and the execution.
It's very impressive for this time of the year.
It will take a very good side to beat these guys.
 

Jaghond

Ted Fahey (11)
Further to Cattledog's post at #470, and without wishing to raise the ire of some of the recent contributors to this thread, I would like to explore the concept of Clubs / Districts having some sort of proprietary "ownership" / entitlement to village club juniors.
Having been around the traps for a little while, might I offer the observation that in fact many of the senior clubs with whom the Junior Clubs have an affiliation don’t actually contribute a huge amount to the welfare of the village clubs – whether it be from a financial or feet-on-the-ground perspective.
Not for one moment do I think these Clubs have an obligation to do so, however, experience over the last 15 years or so would seem ( at least anecdotally), that some Clubs don’t offer much support at all, even when asked. Club finances (or lack thereof) may have something to do with this – however, requests for players to turn up at lunch time at primary schools to help spread the word seem often to have fallen in the “too hard” basket. And yes, as a working parent, I know how hard it can be to get the time to dash off to a school thing in the middle of the day !

I am sure that Club support of junior representative rugby will be trotted out – however with a couple of sons who have been fortunate enough to participate over the years, it has been a case of the parents and the junior district organizations who have supported in this regard – and generally it has been a user pays approach – which I am entirely comfortable with. IMHO, the hard-earned parent $$’s that go to club rego fees shouldn’t be directed ( in a significant context, anyway) towards the small minority of lads lucky enough to have a crack at rep footy . There are a lot more kids who don’t get there than do.
So back to the Clubs feeling somewhat aggrieved if players choose to go to another club, other than that which they may have been somewhat “tied” to. Are people really going to suggest that a lad playing district rep footy in the U 11’s or 12’s be obligated to play with that related senior club in years to come ?

The other “tier” that has been totally ignored here (unless I have missed a post somewhere) – are the Subbies Clubs. There are many junior clubs who are affiliated with Subbies clubs – so what if the boys want to play rugby with the Subbies Club that (again, anecdotally) has probably done far more towards the players’ development than the District Club. ?
A previous poster mentioned the possibility of paying some sort of “transfer fee” – I am not sure how this would / could work – but one would hope that should such process eventuate, then the fee might find its way right back down to where the kids have actually played their junior footy – and not just a money grab by the District club.

Lastly, the other part of this is whether the lads have a right to play where they want – along with their mates, if that be the case, - rather than being directed to play for a club that they may actually have no affinity with or for.
At the end of the day, when I look through the current lists of Grade teams, there are few names that I recognize as having been around when my sons went through the “juniors system”.

I think I would be more interested in finding out where the lads that they did battle with on a weekly basis have disappeared to…..
I think as a parent, I would be happier knowing that my lads enjoyed playing this wnderful game of Rugb with their mates, than having them “forced” to play somewhere against their wishes. This sort of direction may in fact have the exact opposite effect – and turn some away from participating in Senior rugby, rather than encouraging them to go and be part of a Club (whether it be Subbies, Grade or whatever)

Lastly, the above comments are in no way directed at “all” district/grade clubs – many of them really do get out and provide assistance and input at the village club level – but there are many who don’t. For those who fall into the latter category, I find it a bit naïve for them to then turn around and demand some sort of fealty to an oft-absent Lord.
The Hound
 

Learned One

Allen Oxlade (6)
Former Newington player Ellis Abrahams kicked some good ones on Saturday - including a spectacular roost to raise the flags which went out of the ground at the northern end and completely shattered a second floor window at the Fisho's! :D Wreckless.
Spectacular !!! I'll keep an eye out for Ellis. Is he as consistent as Reece Hodge?
 

Learned One

Allen Oxlade (6)
Yassmin Uni 1's 9 tries after 4 rounds!
Saw a video of one game,he has jet shoes!
.and they know how to to put him into space.
This is a very talented,very well drilled side.
They had a few rockstars in their side,but the strength of the side is in the structure and the execution.
It's very impressive for this time of the year.
It will take a very good side to beat these guys.


The Uni wingers ,both last year and this season scored heavily. A great deal of the credit should go to the fullback Matthew Hood , who has a knack of making space for himself and his outside players. A very unselfish player who gives the ball while there is still time and space for his wingers to use their jet shoes. It was disappointing not to see him rewarded with a spot in the NSW Colts training squad.

As you say,they are a talented very well coached side .There are a couple of classy outside backs still to return from injury so looking forward to the coming weeks
 

Cattledog

Sydney Middleton (9)
Further to Cattledog's post at #470, and without wishing to raise the ire of some of the recent contributors to this thread, I would like to explore the concept of Clubs / Districts having some sort of proprietary "ownership" / entitlement to village club juniors.
Having been around the traps for a little while, might I offer the observation that in fact many of the senior clubs with whom the Junior Clubs have an affiliation don’t actually contribute a huge amount to the welfare of the village clubs – whether it be from a financial or feet-on-the-ground perspective.
Not for one moment do I think these Clubs have an obligation to do so, however, experience over the last 15 years or so would seem ( at least anecdotally), that some Clubs don’t offer much support at all, even when asked. Club finances (or lack thereof) may have something to do with this – however, requests for players to turn up at lunch time at primary schools to help spread the word seem often to have fallen in the “too hard” basket. And yes, as a working parent, I know how hard it can be to get the time to dash off to a school thing in the middle of the day !

I am sure that Club support of junior representative rugby will be trotted out – however with a couple of sons who have been fortunate enough to participate over the years, it has been a case of the parents and the junior district organizations who have supported in this regard – and generally it has been a user pays approach – which I am entirely comfortable with. IMHO, the hard-earned parent $$’s that go to club rego fees shouldn’t be directed ( in a significant context, anyway) towards the small minority of lads lucky enough to have a crack at rep footy . There are a lot more kids who don’t get there than do.
So back to the Clubs feeling somewhat aggrieved if players choose to go to another club, other than that which they may have been somewhat “tied” to. Are people really going to suggest that a lad playing district rep footy in the U 11’s or 12’s be obligated to play with that related senior club in years to come ?

The other “tier” that has been totally ignored here (unless I have missed a post somewhere) – are the Subbies Clubs. There are many junior clubs who are affiliated with Subbies clubs – so what if the boys want to play rugby with the Subbies Club that (again, anecdotally) has probably done far more towards the players’ development than the District Club. ?
A previous poster mentioned the possibility of paying some sort of “transfer fee” – I am not sure how this would / could work – but one would hope that should such process eventuate, then the fee might find its way right back down to where the kids have actually played their junior footy – and not just a money grab by the District club.

Lastly, the other part of this is whether the lads have a right to play where they want – along with their mates, if that be the case, - rather than being directed to play for a club that they may actually have no affinity with or for.
At the end of the day, when I look through the current lists of Grade teams, there are few names that I recognize as having been around when my sons went through the “juniors system”.

I think I would be more interested in finding out where the lads that they did battle with on a weekly basis have disappeared to…..
I think as a parent, I would be happier knowing that my lads enjoyed playing this wnderful game of Rugb with their mates, than having them “forced” to play somewhere against their wishes. This sort of direction may in fact have the exact opposite effect – and turn some away from participating in Senior rugby, rather than encouraging them to go and be part of a Club (whether it be Subbies, Grade or whatever)

Lastly, the above comments are in no way directed at “all” district/grade clubs – many of them really do get out and provide assistance and input at the village club level – but there are many who don’t. For those who fall into the latter category, I find it a bit naïve for them to then turn around and demand some sort of fealty to an oft-absent Lord.
The Hound

Thanks Hound,

Obviously the regulation & compensation system would be based upon clubs being able to prove exactly what development activities & investment has actually gone on in a players past. However, that would not be difficult for the hard working junior districts of which you speak.

For example in the PDJRU our village players & clubs pay no district affiliation fees. We actually believe that it is the other way around and that it is the district who should be supporting the village clubs. Last year we actually returned money (what we could afford) in the form of $500 presentation day grants to the village clubs for (as you say) they are the lifeblood of junior development. This year we hope to at least double that amount and have already provided start up grants to a new minis club - Penrith RSL.

We also heavily subsidise our district activities thru our own fundraising & sponsorship program. The fees that our players pay only make up a small part of this income. For example the Trips to Orange & Newcastle for the State Championships, buses & accomodation, apparel for coaches & managers, lights & grounds for training, first aid & paramedics, raffle books & raffle prizes (provided to every player so they can recoup their rep fees), administration fees, NSWJRU entry fees, assisting with the cost of coach qualifications, functions, and the PDJRU golf day are just a few of our development costs.

We also ensure that every dollar (where possible) is spent back on the kids and there are separate bank accounts for the junior & senior districts. For example our fees are around $120 - $140 for the year but kids get to keep their shorts, socks, playing jumper, and training shirt which leaves us around $50 per kid to cover all other costs. The shortfall in costs is then covered by good will, fundraising, & sponsorship which is all provided by the unpaid work of volunteers.

In terms of concrete support of the elite player we have a system in place whereby once a player has progressed beyond district rep level any rep fees incurred are paid a third by the player, a third by the village club, and third by the junior district to help offset the cost for parents. For example last year we subsidised all of our U15 & U16 zone reps, Sydney U15 & U16 reps, and our u15 nsw reps. We even helped pay the rep fees one of our U12 lads who made NSW Primary schools.

Then we have the significant number of players who are in our program who receive fee assistance because of personal financial hardship. These players can apply for fee relief and in most cases this amounts to a 50 % fee reduction? However, that doesn't take into account the numerous parents who I have witnessed put their own hand in their pocket for other kids in tough positions?

Clearly the above doesn't put a dollar value on the 1000's of hours of work that people do to get these boys on the field and the 100's of hours that these boys are trained and developed by club members.

How about members who give up hours & nights to attend SJRU meetings, NSWJRU meetings or district planning meetings. Oh the joy of AGM's at all three levels and the associated prepared financial documentation!

Let's all not forget about the time dedicated to the planning of internal & external rep trials for all players, training, the writing of district policies, or the facilitation of minis competitions within districts?

As members of our PDJRU U20 Colts (and to grow our program) our 2014 colts have received 100% subsidised bus travel to all training sessions & 100% subsidised bus travel to all away games. Our colts have also been granted 100% fee relief & have all new kit in 2014. They also get to keep their shorts, socks, and training shirts free of charge. The district also covers the cost of physio, strapping tape, & first aid at all matches & have also invested heavily in equipment such as marquees, tables, benches, and all the other materials that make for a quality program & match day experience.

All of the above is a mere snapshot and all before a player hits the age of 21.

As I said in my previous post. Players do have a right to move & clubs have a right to register players from other districts. However, there needs to be some type of fair system for the regulation & compensation for the developing junior union & district. Clearly this compensation would then be ploughed back into the junior district to continue the development system for the good of all Clubs.

There simply needs to be a SRU system that provides a just framework for the movement of the player, the compensation of the developing district, and the regulation of the benefitting club.
 
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