• Welcome to the forums of Green & Gold Rugby.
    We have recently made some changes to the amount of discussions boards on the forum.
    Over the coming months we will continue to make more changes to make the forum more user friendly for all to use.
    Thanks, Admin.

Sydney Subbies 2025

Pfitzy

Phil Waugh (73)
Im no barrister but the question becomes are we comfortable we have alignment between clubs, who as you say has its first priority as player welfare, squaring off against an administrative body, a body that imposes penalties on those same clubs should they act to protect those players by forfeiting.

We should be open minded enough to review Competition Rules if and when they need to change. There was a period during COVID where Subbies didn't enforce forfeit penalties, as one example.

Unfortunately, a lot of rules exist for situations like Odyssey describes above: people trying to get around fair play in the first place.

At the same time, we've got people howling that Subbies didn't follow CC for promotion and relegation.

giphy.gif
 

Heavyd

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
I don’t think anyone is saying forfeits shouldn’t be allowed in that situation. That’s exactly what they are there for. But there still needs to be a punishment/deterrent.
Otherwise you’ll see clubs tactically forfeiting to avoid playing a “strong” club or a tough road trip. Imagine if over the last few years clubs went we aren’t going travel out to Newport or mountains cause we are likely to get beaten, let’s regroup and go again the following week. Newport miss a bunch of games leading into finals it’s a lot harder to keep that continuity going.
Have those scenarios ever really happened? In my experience Clubs do everything they can to avoid forefeits, they call on old players, ask current club legends to double up. Then if they still can’t make the numbers work they bite the bullet. I’ve never heard of a club saying I can’t be farked going to whoop whoop lets forfeit. There are a lot of forefeits across multiple comps this weekend. I would bet none of them are “tactical” and all decisions have been agonised over before being made after trying everything to avoid them.

anyways. Go the Wallabies!!
 

Odyssey_Park the 2nd

Jimmy Flynn (14)
Have those scenarios ever really happened? In my experience Clubs do everything they can to avoid forefeits, they call on old players, ask current club legends to double up. Then if they still can’t make the numbers work they bite the bullet. I’ve never heard of a club saying I can’t be farked going to whoop whoop lets forfeit. There are a lot of forefeits across multiple comps this weekend. I would bet none of them are “tactical” and all decisions have been agonised over before being made after trying everything to avoid them.

anyways. Go the Wallabies!!
We’ve had the rules around forfeits and loosing points in for the 20 odd years I’ve been involved in Subbies. Are they the deterrent or it clubs choosing to do the “right” thing?
Yes I have seen a team choose to forfeit rather then play when the result didn’t affect them.
We say no one would bother stacking teams going into finals yet in a couple of weeks I guarantee there will be a bunch of posts here about it happening.
Clubs are always looking for that loophole to give them a jump on the rest of the teams. Hence why we have rules to discourage it.
 

John S

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Pol Pot, Stalin, Kim Jong-il… Green & Gold? All masters of censorship.

G&G Mod Squad (average age: 68) rolls in like the KGB with clipboards, banning posts faster than their beloved Barker Old Boys feel from grace.

They run the place like it’s a Cold War bunker. Dissent? Censored. Sarcasm? “Inappropriate tone.” Banter? Only if you’re one of the fossils. These blokes fear memes more than a Teals Candidate.

At this rate, I expect to see mandatory loyalty oaths to the committee and a Gulag to be set up at Porters Oval.

If I wanted to live under a regime where free speech is crushed and satire is banned, I’d join the local Mixed Netball club and hang out with a few Karens. But here? We heckle, we roast, we call it like we see it—and we drink about it later.

Rugby is about passion, not propaganda. Let the people post!

#NewportMinistryOfTruth #CensorshipDoesntWinComps #StopTheCensorshipScrum
Gee, that escalated quickly.
 

Here To Do

Sydney Middleton (9)
Apparently not a single full game of Subbies after 11am got streamed today. "Major technical issues" on a level I've not seen since Optus or CrowdStrike.

Shame since there were some classics at Hudson in the latest derby...
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_20250726-191805.png
    Screenshot_20250726-191805.png
    348.6 KB · Views: 32

Pfitzy

Phil Waugh (73)
TBH it is a bit hard for clubs to find the $2500-$4000 to start with, then ask players, friends and family to fork out their hard-earned, when these things keep happening.

We've had whole games go missing, techs turn up to the wrong field, and even a guy running late one week.
 

Footyhead67

Frank Nicholson (4)
TBH it is a bit hard for clubs to find the $2500-$4000 to start with, then ask players, friends and family to fork out their hard-earned, when these things keep happening.
Every time I log into NSW Rugby TV I always get a message saying my login may have appeared in a data leak, cause my code and account has been given out to a few people.
 

Here To Do

Sydney Middleton (9)
TBH it is a bit hard for clubs to find the $2500-$4000 to start with, then ask players, friends and family to fork out their hard-earned, when these things keep happening.

We've had whole games go missing, techs turn up to the wrong field, and even a guy running late one week.
I feel you mate - in fairness to them, I've quantified the gear in a normal setup from past experiences and you're looking about $5-10K upfront, plus operator costs, plus subscriptions to things like the score graphics and even the stream bonding for reliability (hold your laughter if you've never tried to stream from a mobile hotspot). It isn't cheap and, yes, while you can spread the costs across multiple games, it's a massive investment for relatively small return.

That said, I have to say that there have been more issues this season than I can recall since we got on in 2021. The stream setup in the back-end seems to be a bespoke setup compared to 2020-2024, primarily using LIGR graphics and pretty standard front-end web stuff. This year, they seem to have taken a lot in-house, I assume, to save on costs. Unfortunately, the scalability and reliability has suffered.

Remember, if this mob don't stream our games, we probably go back to being just in the park on Saturday. Horses for courses, I guess.
SA Rugby union had the same issue can confirm.
Yep - all the graphics will be done live in the cloud. No stream = no graphics unless you edit them in yourself. Guess what I get to do this evening and probably most of tomorrow for our club?
 

Pfitzy

Phil Waugh (73)
in fairness to them, I've quantified the gear in a normal setup from past experiences and you're looking about $5-10K upfront, plus operator costs, plus subscriptions to things like the score graphics and even the stream bonding for reliability (hold your laughter if you've never tried to stream from a mobile hotspot)

I get all that. To run anything like it would be impossible for my club.

The fact remains that is the price they asked, it breaks way too often, wasn't working smoothly for the first half of the year, and many people are out of pocket.

If the asking price needs to go up, that's something to consider. It would want to come with better SLAs as a result.
 

Here To Do

Sydney Middleton (9)
I get all that. To run anything like it would be impossible for my club.

The fact remains that is the price they asked, it breaks way too often, wasn't working smoothly for the first half of the year, and many people are out of pocket.

If the asking price needs to go up, that's something to consider. It would want to come with better SLAs as a result.
Yep - the problem then becomes you place a massive funds drain on smaller clubs on top of affiliation fees & insurance, but you already knew that.

SLAs would be great where the network infrastructure is in place. ATM about 2 grounds I've been to have power - Campbelltown Harlequins actually have the best facilities (outside of Rothwell, of course) I've seen below semi-pro level. Camera platform on halfway with clubhouse and power right behind. If more grounds had ample 4G/5G coverage and perhaps even high-speed broadband (what a concept!), it could definitely improve, but there are multiple bottlenecks in the chain.
 

Odyssey_Park the 2nd

Jimmy Flynn (14)
Enough complaining about things that have ultimately made Subbies a better place. Yes it doesn’t work all the time and yes sometimes the footage is poor but hopefully we can grow over the coming years and make it fit what we require. Cluch went bankrupt trying to provide a service above and beyond. I’d prefer to have a lesser quality product but still have it.
 

Odyssey_Park the 2nd

Jimmy Flynn (14)
Onto the football
Div 1- Dummoyne picking up the draw and bonus point in a double points round against an under strength Waverley who still ran out 7 grades plus Newports deduction will be enough to keep them in Div 1 next year. They’ll finish 100 points clear of Newport and just clear Lindfield unless there’s some upsets.

Div 2- UNSW dropping the ball to an under strength Irish have opened the door to Petersham to not only jag the minor premiership in Barraclough but also the Club Championship. It will all come down to the final round but depending on the result next round Petersham could have it in the bag. The finals format for this division means 2nd place will come up against an unpredictable Briars who could beat anyone on there day.

Div 3- Hills have the club championships locked up even though they have 1 less team and the fact that Knox is 2nd despite having forfeited twice this year is a bad sign for this division. Same as above 1st Grade will come down to the last round with 2nd place up against a strong Hornsby who have pushed both sides recently. Hills and Knox are $1.01 favourites in Farrant and Nicholson assuming Knox get some players back after the break.

Div 4- Top 4 are pretty much locked in with Mac Uni in colts only needing a couple of bonus points to qualify and 2 out of 3 games remaining against teams below them. However Balmain are $1.01 favourites here. 1st grade is a 3 horse race and could go to anyone, but final positioning means 1 team will go out the back door in finals. Club Champs will come down to the Wakehurst Balmain match up next round.

Div 5- Hard to see Valley dropping the club champs after a strong performance against Redfield for double points. Epping refuses to go away and after an upset win vs Raptors they will be relying on Harlequins or Raptors dropping the last game and upsetting table topping Valley in the last round. 2nd Grade will likely see Canterbury take the minor premiership (and not winning a game in 1s all year). If Convicts choose to forfeit again in favour of playing Halligans (tactical forfeiting… @Heavyd ) it’s likely Raptors will be the unlucky side to miss out.

Div 6- The question everyone wants to know is can The Emus keep the role going and qualify for the finals after back to back wins against a faltering Harbour they are in the box seat but a final round matchup against the undefeated Manly will be make or break. Unfortunately with a game in hand George’s River and Harbour are likely to finish over the top of them.

Joy Johnson- Not sure on the finals structure for this one. It it’s hard to see anyone beating Norths after a clinical win over Hornsby (insert comment about Shute Shield club playing in Subbies comp). Newport are a $1.01 favourites in the Blue comp. Hard to see how they were drawn in this comp when they were inaugural Premiers in this comp and they numbers of first time clubs in the Yellow comp.

Halligans- The quirkiness of this competition means that of the 4 teams below Colleagues 6th grade only 1 has played them during the season. Hills are in the box seat for the minor premiership with games booked in and Colleagues struggling for games. But give there 2 losses have come against teams in the top 5 there position may be biased by who they’ve played. Crazy that Barker hasn’t been able to find more games but it would be good to see Subbies run a 4 team finals series with these clubs or at the very least a top 2 shoot out.
 

Here To Do

Sydney Middleton (9)
Enough complaining about things that have ultimately made Subbies a better place. Yes it doesn’t work all the time and yes sometimes the footage is poor but hopefully we can grow over the coming years and make it fit what we require. Cluch went bankrupt trying to provide a service above and beyond. I’d prefer to have a lesser quality product but still have it.
Cluch went bankrupt by overcommitting resources they didn't have - not that that's relevant. It's a similar situation to the current video game drama - it's better to have than have not but consumers and the rights licensor (to coin a phrase, possibly) expect and deserve a certain level of quality. It's worth mentioning that it seemed to only be Subbies games that were down but I'm not certain.

I think it's important to be grateful without being blind to the flaws, especially when there hasn't been any explanation or acknowledgement.
 

Fletch

Stan Wickham (3)
Onto the football
Div 1- Dummoyne picking up the draw and bonus point in a double points round against an under strength Waverley who still ran out 7 grades plus Newports deduction will be enough to keep them in Div 1 next year. They’ll finish 100 points clear of Newport and just clear Lindfield unless there’s some upsets.

Div 2- UNSW dropping the ball to an under strength Irish have opened the door to Petersham to not only jag the minor premiership in Barraclough but also the Club Championship. It will all come down to the final round but depending on the result next round Petersham could have it in the bag. The finals format for this division means 2nd place will come up against an unpredictable Briars who could beat anyone on there day.

Div 3- Hills have the club championships locked up even though they have 1 less team and the fact that Knox is 2nd despite having forfeited twice this year is a bad sign for this division. Same as above 1st Grade will come down to the last round with 2nd place up against a strong Hornsby who have pushed both sides recently. Hills and Knox are $1.01 favourites in Farrant and Nicholson assuming Knox get some players back after the break.

Div 4- Top 4 are pretty much locked in with Mac Uni in colts only needing a couple of bonus points to qualify and 2 out of 3 games remaining against teams below them. However Balmain are $1.01 favourites here. 1st grade is a 3 horse race and could go to anyone, but final positioning means 1 team will go out the back door in finals. Club Champs will come down to the Wakehurst Balmain match up next round.

Div 5- Hard to see Valley dropping the club champs after a strong performance against Redfield for double points. Epping refuses to go away and after an upset win vs Raptors they will be relying on Harlequins or Raptors dropping the last game and upsetting table topping Valley in the last round. 2nd Grade will likely see Canterbury take the minor premiership (and not winning a game in 1s all year). If Convicts choose to forfeit again in favour of playing Halligans (tactical forfeiting… @Heavyd ) it’s likely Raptors will be the unlucky side to miss out.

Div 6- The question everyone wants to know is can The Emus keep the role going and qualify for the finals after back to back wins against a faltering Harbour they are in the box seat but a final round matchup against the undefeated Manly will be make or break. Unfortunately with a game in hand George’s River and Harbour are likely to finish over the top of them.

Joy Johnson- Not sure on the finals structure for this one. It it’s hard to see anyone beating Norths after a clinical win over Hornsby (insert comment about Shute Shield club playing in Subbies comp). Newport are a $1.01 favourites in the Blue comp. Hard to see how they were drawn in this comp when they were inaugural Premiers in this comp and they numbers of first time clubs in the Yellow comp.

Halligans- The quirkiness of this competition means that of the 4 teams below Colleagues 6th grade only 1 has played them during the season. Hills are in the box seat for the minor premiership with games booked in and Colleagues struggling for games. But give there 2 losses have come against teams in the top 5 there position may be biased by who they’ve played. Crazy that Barker hasn’t been able to find more games but it would be good to see Subbies run a 4 team finals series with these clubs or at the very least a top 2 shoot out.
Harbour and Georges River have played twice. The ref stopped the first game and its recorded as no match. Not sure if they get a chance to replay it?
 
Top